Thomas Frank - Signs to June 2023 (46 Viewers)

HaylingBee74

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I found 2 errors.
1. Canos’s assists should be for Dasilva, Jensen, Toney (for our 2nd goal v Wycombe) & Mbuemo
2. Mbuemo has 6 assists for Toney and 1 each for Forss, Fosu, Ghoddos & Canos

Thanks to Whoscored.com for the stats
 

brentfordfc4ever

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It's as simple as this.

1. TF has provided us two magnificent seasons on the trott.

2. He clearly loves this club and its supporters. He really finds a way to connect with the fans when we are in the stadium

3. He will be doing everything in his power for us to regain our form.

Let's get behind him, his staff and his players for the remaining fixtures.

We can talk end of season decisions at the end of the season, right?
 

Leonardo

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I also think he should look at what the B team have done and not rigidly stuck to 4-3-3 and going 3-4-3 because available defenders and midfielders
 

AB

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I also think he should look at what the B team have done and not rigidly stuck to 4-3-3 and going 3-4-3 because available defenders and midfielders
We’ve got 4 very good CBs so it makes some sense but neither Pontus nor Ethan looked particularly happy in a back three at the start of last season. TF is obviously not dead set against 343 as that sorted out the horror of his first ten games in his first season and he tried to keep it going last season. But it’s all about the right formation for the players we have so depends on whether those CBs will play it well.
 

BeesBloke

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Why do we often start so poorly?
Whether it is giving away an early free kick which we struggle to defend or concede or errors made passing out from the back.

Are they given too many instructions before kickoff and have a team brain fog?
There does appear to be a fundamental problem which then largely goes away after the first 15 minutes. With all our analytics we should be able to identify the cause
This is an issue I have with TF, he is a master of firing up the opposition with misguided press statements, but our own players seem to take to the field like they have just got out of bed, they usually take 15mins to rouse from this slumber, at which point we are often 1-0 down. TF is undoubtably a nice man but I sense he in-stills as much motivation & fear as a supply teacher.
 

HaylingBee74

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This is an issue I have with TF, he is a master of firing up the opposition with misguided press statements, but our own players seem to take to the field like they have just got out of bed, they usually take 15mins to rouse from this slumber, at which point we are often 1-0 down. TF is undoubtably a nice man but I sense he in-stills as much motivation & fear as a supply teacher.
This situation has brought back memories of Perryman unable to motivate and then Holder taking over and firing almost the same players to be Champions
 

TorbayBee

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If we don’t get up, I will bet big money that Thomas will jump before he is pushed.
If the worst scenario should arise he will be drained having had two years of effort and 100% focus ending in failure by his and the clubs standards.

He’s been away from family and with various other obstacles and blockers to success, he may feel it’s time to have a well earned rest with his loved ones out of the spotlight while he considers his next career move.

He is incredibly intelligent, articulate and I believe ambitious, he has a bright future and may decide it lies outside of London or this country, if he does he would leave with my utmost respect and admiration.

He doesn’t always get the tactics right but equally he didn’t muck up yesterday and tell the right back to ignore his keepers shout, slip on the ball and then pass it to a player who didn’t want or call for it. He didn’t miss a nailed on penalty, however reasonable to assume he must have said and changed things at half time as we looked a lot better, scored and hit a post within minutes of the break.
Should he have changed it around further at that stage? Probably, but I didn’t see those who came on make us any stronger if honest and sadly he can’t be responsible for both Sergi and Bryan running on fumes and playing as poorly as they are at the moment?
He isn’t to blame for the injuries to Norgaard, Rico and Josh, 3 of our 4 Prem quality players and arguably Toney who we’re led to believe has been playing through an injury as so vital to us this year.

He isn’t responsible for recruitment either so while he has to take responsibility for tactics and failure to change certain things on pitch on match day I’m not sure that he’s let anyone down in getting us to 3rd place again given the circumstances.

Question his tactics, criticise his lack of a plan b but don’t slate the coach who has achieved what he we did last season despite having an inferior squad and not having Ollie Watkins, Benrahma coupled with the worrying form of Bryan all season.

Time to back him 100% until we know if we are up, in the play offs or wishing sometimes we’d picked a bigger West London club to support when 5 years old

COYBs
Did you really write ‘I am not sure he has let anyone down by getting us to third in the league’ ?
Hahaha 🤣
 

TorbayBee

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Some of the rubbish on this thread makes me squirm. The way this season has been structured has led to most teams (except possibly Norwich) experiencing surges in results with subsequent dips in form. We are no different. We have to operate within tight financial budgets whilst labouring under the cloud of last seasons failure, no pre season , uniquely playing in a new stadium without fans, key payer injuries etc. Most of these are not exclusive to us but as a combined set of impacts they are a huge negative burden. Next season we will at worst start in Europe’s fifth biggest and toughest league once again. We are now a respected force in that league. That is some achievement and I for one fear the day we lose a coach as erudite, committed and talented as TF.
 

andyrew

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The problems are from my analysis and I know I will be shot down for this
Toney. He is such a different type of striker than Watkins and it seems our whole play has slowed because he is coming so deep and staying central.
Winger/left forward . Benrahma wasn't replaced (and Ghoddos we were led to beleive was but is completely different type of player) and Canos has been too inconsistant
LB cover. Without Henry we have no drive down the left. I like Sorenson and he's improved so much this season but he is a square peg in a round hole.
Midfield box to box. With JDS injured our only other similar player is Baptiste also long term injured.

So some weaknesses in squad depth and couple with unluckiness on injuries to key players has hit us.
We obviously did our best, but the right players at a realistic price were not available/didn't end up choosing us. Plus of course we have had rotten luck with a lot of medium to long term inuries both with the 1st team and B team squads.
 

jlove

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This is an interesting snippet about Covid-19 activities at Jersey Road.
 

Robi Bee

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If we lose the playoffs for the tenth time. Easily the worst record ever. We will need a rejig of the coaching staff.

We nearly have the worst record for conceding goals in the first 15 mins. (Something that has cost us dearly). I see nothing in our setup that deals with this.

It is quite obvious to teams that with a high press early on we very prone to mistakes. TF puts it down to just making freak mistakes but I feel we need to adjust our style for the first part of the game.
Would agree. TF refers to them as "freak" goals. Well, not really. We've conceded too many in the first 20 mins for them to all be freak goals. We've got into the habit of starting games poorly (often too slowly and with indecision) and it is costing us. Please sort.
 

mhead bee

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This is an issue I have with TF, he is a master of firing up the opposition with misguided press statements, but our own players seem to take to the field like they have just got out of bed, they usually take 15mins to rouse from this slumber, at which point we are often 1-0 down. TF is undoubtably a nice man but I sense he in-stills as much motivation & fear as a supply teacher.
He has the highest win % of any Brentford manager, we finished third in the Champ last year, we went 21 games unbeaten and it is in our hands to get promoted this season.

I literally read your post 3 times to make sure I wasn't misunderstanding and then I pinched myself and read it again.

What utter garbage.
 

mhead bee

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The problems are from my analysis and I know I will be shot down for this
Toney. He is such a different type of striker than Watkins and it seems our whole play has slowed because he is coming so deep and staying central.
Winger/left forward . Benrahma wasn't replaced (and Ghoddos we were led to beleive was but is completely different type of player) and Canos has been too inconsistant
LB cover. Without Henry we have no drive down the left. I like Sorenson and he's improved so much this season but he is a square peg in a round hole.
Midfield box to box. With JDS injured our only other similar player is Baptiste also long term injured.

So some weaknesses in squad depth and couple with unluckiness on injuries to key players has hit us.

The last 7-8 years has seen the most beautiful football team in the world next to Barcelona play the most wonderful football, however our Achilles heel was the dark arts, being bullied/cheated/kicked/cheated/outmuscled/cheated on too many occasions to count.

Everyone was hand wringing, accusing the players of being soft and begging for an antidote so we addressed this with Pontus, Norgaard, Dalsgaard, Janelt and Toney so we rarely get beaten by the anti football scum any more. However this has come at a price, the tikka takka has gone, the quick counter has been eroded and we have become far more of a slow build up, play the %'s, sit deep at 1.0 up and try to do the dirty stuff kind of team.

Guess what chaps, you can't have it both ways. This is not easy on the eye, at times it is a slog but if you want to go up it is a very affective way of winning enough games. This is what we can call plan B.

TF has proven from the above that he is capable of completely changing the way we play, it is a turnaround in style and personnel and one many of us have considered a necessary burden should we want to go up.

After 2/3rd's of the season this was working magnificently and then the new kryptonite arrived, the dreaded high press. It completely nullifies our build up from the back and in fact it creates a huge amount of opportunity for the opposition and my only criticism of TF is he has not found a plan C yet to deal with this. We all have our ideas, take the wingers off as they are not in the game and put 2 CM's on to help the middle 3 who are outnumbered 5 to 3 and give us a chance to release the constant pressure. I keep waiting for TF to do do something but we see nothing as the clock ticks away and a won game turns into a draw.

This IMO is a flaw with TF at the moment but it has nothing to do with being unable to motivate. Our issues have as much to do with having to rely on 2-3 B team players every game and the godawful goals we give away always at the worst moment in the most important and tightest of games. If we could could give a gash goal away when 4.0 up but we always do it at 2.1 up when hanging on or in the first minute when we are playing a team renowned for being hard to break down in the first place.

Also lets not underestimate the value of luck, how many games have Watford won 1.0, how many awful goals and non penalties have they been gifted in these 1.0 wins. We have had a couple of pens that were probably 65-70% and on another day may not have been given but I bet we have had a good 6-7 that were stone wall not given. How many deflected goals have we scored, how many have hit the post.

Lots of reasons why we are not clear at the top of the table and it is not down to one mans team talk. The team talk is the most overrated tool in football anyway, nothing you say changes a game, it is preparation and tactics and being able to adjust tactics on that fly that wins games.
 

Adam

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He has the highest win % of any Brentford manager, we finished third in the Champ last year, we went 21 games unbeaten and it is in our hands to get promoted this season.

I literally read your post 3 times to make sure I wasn't misunderstanding and then I pinched myself and read it again.

What utter garbage.
I think when you look at our squad versus some of the teams around us then the fact TF has got us to 3rd at this point really speaks for itself. Sarr, Hughes, Pedro, Buendia, or Cantwell could arguably walk in to a top 6-8 Premier League side next season. Even the likes of Ayew, Ejaria, Olisa, Lerma, Billing, are comfortably Prem quality players. I know our recruitment is brilliant and we have some fantastic players, but that doesn't automatically mean that we have the best squad in the league and deserve to go up. Look at Raya for example, great keeper for us, but 3 of the clubs around us have Begovic, Foster, and Krul - these are goalkeepers with nearly 1,000 Premier League appearances between them! They've even won major honours and played in World Cups!
 

neilbee

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Beginning to think is Frank a nearly man. By that i mean he will always get us close to promotion but never over the line. Hope to be proved wrong. 🐝.
 

TorbayBee

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Beginning to think is Frank a nearly man. By that i mean he will always get us close to promotion but never over the line. Hope to be proved wrong. 🐝.
My advice is to stop thinking that. Once you do you will feel better. Honest.
 

Balders Bee

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Beginning to think is Frank a nearly man. By that i mean he will always get us close to promotion but never over the line. Hope to be proved wrong. 🐝.
I really don't think we're nearly close to calling him the 'nearly' man quite yet. 2018/19 was a season of consolidation, 2019/20 we all know what happened and of course this year is very much all to play for, so a bit premature saddling the poor bloke with that sobriquet.
 

Mr Cynical

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I really don't think we're nearly close to calling him the 'nearly' man quite yet. 2018/19 was a season of consolidation, 2019/20 we all know what happened and of course this year is very much all to play for, so a bit premature saddling the poor bloke with that sobriquet.
also, given how poor everyone seems to think the current squad is elsewhere on this board, shouldn’t we be praising him for keeping us in with a chance of promotion at this stage despite these limitations and a challenging injury list?
 

Delbee

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also, given how poor everyone seems to think the current squad is elsewhere on this board, shouldn’t we be praising him for keeping us in with a chance of promotion at this stage despite these limitations and a challenging injury list?
I don’t go with the poor squad comments, yes we may be a bit short of 20 starters to chose from and the extra skills need for the bench. Saturday we were missing Dalsgard Henry Dasilva and Baptiste from the match day squad. All of them would have had match time on Saturday
 

nick logan

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also, given how poor everyone seems to think the current squad is elsewhere on this board, shouldn’t we be praising him for keeping us in with a chance of promotion at this stage despite these limitations and a challenging injury list?
you wont get anywhere on here with pesky good questions you know !
 

Mr Cynical

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I don’t go with the poor squad comments, yes we may be a bit short of 20 starters to chose from and the extra skills need for the bench
personally I think he's done an excellent job considering what happened last season, the short break and pre-season, splitting up of the BMW, the insane schedule and injuries to key players across the season. It's no coincidence that the teams still in form at this point in the season are those with substantial squads...
 

nick logan

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personally I think he's done an excellent job considering what happened last season, the short break and pre-season, splitting up of the BMW, the insane schedule and injuries to key players across the season. It's no coincidence that the teams still in form at this point in the season are those with substantial squads...
spot on
 

mhead bee

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I think when you look at our squad versus some of the teams around us then the fact TF has got us to 3rd at this point really speaks for itself. Sarr, Hughes, Pedro, Buendia, or Cantwell could arguably walk in to a top 6-8 Premier League side next season. Even the likes of Ayew, Ejaria, Olisa, Lerma, Billing, are comfortably Prem quality players. I know our recruitment is brilliant and we have some fantastic players, but that doesn't automatically mean that we have the best squad in the league and deserve to go up. Look at Raya for example, great keeper for us, but 3 of the clubs around us have Begovic, Foster, and Krul - these are goalkeepers with nearly 1,000 Premier League appearances between them! They've even won major honours and played in World Cups!
you were doing well until you mentioned Ayew and premier league in the same sentence. He wouldn’t get in our B team. 😉
 

BridportBee

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Got crucified on here for saying we needed to get rid of Frank and since i did its actually been getting worse. Today worse performance of the lot. Boring, drab, in effective dross. Looks like 11 blokes who have met each other for the first time in the changing rooms before the game.
 

Ashford Bees

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Got crucified on here for saying we needed to get rid of Frank and since i did its actually been getting worse. Today worse performance of the lot. Boring, drab, in effective dross. Looks like 11 blokes who have met each other for the first time in the changing rooms before the game.
were you watching the same first half as me?
 

Adam

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you were doing well until you mentioned Ayew and premier league in the same sentence. He wouldn’t get in our B team. 😉
Swansea are the definition of a one man team, take Ayew out (40+ goals and assists for them over the last 2 seasons) they are mid-table team at best.
 

Adam

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Got crucified on here for saying we needed to get rid of Frank and since i did its actually been getting worse. Today worse performance of the lot. Boring, drab, in effective dross. Looks like 11 blokes who have met each other for the first time in the changing rooms before the game.
Played well against a game plan we traditionally lose 1-0 to. Dean Smith's Brentford would have lost that game, I know that much.
 

Bridge Bee

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We’re awful. He’s the head coach. Has to carry the can. It’s not one or two games. It’s nearly 2 months.

Change formation. Give Fosu and Forss more than a combined 18mins. Get someone near Toney for the whole game. Do something different. Feels like he’s gone back to his stubborn ways of his first 10 games where we did the same thing over and over and got the same poor results over and over.

If he comes out and says that was a top performance, or that we won 12-0 according to the data, or that 99 times out of 100 we win the game....I would really like to take a pair of clippers to his hair and kick him in the nuts.
 

Isleworth_Bee

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We’re awful. He’s the head coach. Has to carry the can. It’s not one or two games. It’s nearly 2 months.

Change formation. Give Fosu and Forss more than a combined 18mins. Get someone near Toney for the whole game. Do something different. Feels like he’s gone back to his stubborn ways of his first 10 games where we did the same thing over and over and got the same poor results over and over.

If he comes out and says that was a top performance, or that we won 12-0 according to the data, or that 99 times out of 100 we win the game....I would really like to take a pair of clippers to his hair and kick him in the nuts.
Saddens me to say i agree.

Does Brian Riemer have to much of a say in the tactics? Is it all about defence now.
 

Isleworth_Bee

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TF has to start earning his money. Yes hes hampered by injuries to our better players, but we had that at other points of the season and got by.

CHANGE THE FORMATION
TRUST OTHER PLAYERS

Hes sleep walking us into the PO's.

Not good enough. He has to take some responsibility.
 

liverbee

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Got crucified on here for saying we needed to get rid of Frank and since i did its actually been getting worse. Today worse performance of the lot. Boring, drab, in effective dross. Looks like 11 blokes who have met each other for the first time in the changing rooms before the game.
Well that's complete bo******s. We are nearer the play-offs now with JDS and RH possibly coming back and last seasons experience informing a team not quite firing.
Having said that, I'm not sure what Forrs brings.
 

Balders Bee

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Saddens me to say i agree.

Does Brian Riemer have to much of a say in the tactics? Is it all about defence now.
Is it though? Statistically we're still the leading scorers in this division (might not be depending upon how many Norwich put in tonight).

Whilst we are not clicking going forward by any stretch of the imagination we have lost points with some awful faux-pas at the back. Admittedly tonight was not taking our chances and Etheridge reminding us what a decent keeper he is.
 

keefor

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Frank is a good manager in the sense of improving players and therefore improving their monetary value. He doesn't help himself by 'talking up' poor performances though.
 

Isleworth_Bee

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Is it though? Statistically we're still the leading scorers in this division (might not be depending upon how many Norwich put in tonight).

Whilst we are not clicking going forward by any stretch of the imagination we have lost points with some awful faux-pas at the back. Admittedly tonight was not taking our chances and Etheridge reminding us what a decent keeper he is.
Not for me BB. The two saves were camera saves, i would expect any keeper to make them.

Cant keep holding onto the statistics of being top scorers, top XG, the justice league. We are crawling into the PO's.................... Even that may be too quick.

Sorry im normally positive but the last 2 months have driven me insane. Thrown away such a good chance. We look destined to end this season with disappointment. :(
 

ChertseyBee

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I think Thomas Frank deserves massive credit for getting us to third in the table.

Last season we saw the best team any of us have ever seen.

Take out the front three of Watkins, Benrahma and Mbeumo (here in name only this year)

Take out Norgaard and Jansson for virtually a whole season/half a season

Take out Henry and Dasilva for the final third of the season.

Not allowing for Toney coming in, that leaves THREE of last season‘s outfield first choice team to have had a relatively uninterrupted season.

Most of you lot live on Mars.
 

Isleworth_Bee

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Well that's complete bo******s. We are nearer the play-offs now with JDS and RH possibly coming back and last seasons experience informing a team not quite firing.
Having said that, I'm not sure what Forrs brings.
Not sure what he can do when played out wide for 10minutes. Hes a striker not a winger.
 

Isleworth_Bee

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I think Thomas Frank deserves massive credit for getting us to third in the table.

Last season we saw the best team any of us have ever seen.

Take out the front three of Watkins, Benrahma and Mbeumo (here in name only this year)

Take out Norgaard and Jansson for virtually a whole season/half a season

Take out Henry and Dasilva for the final third of the season.

Not allowing for Toney coming in, that leaves THREE of last season‘s outfield first choice team to have had a relatively uninterrupted season.

Most of you lot live on Mars.
Hes not above criticism. The last two months have been ****
 

WARFIELD BEE

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Well that's complete bo******s. We are nearer the play-offs now with JDS and RH possibly coming back and last seasons experience informing a team not quite firing.
Having said that, I'm not sure what Forrs brings.
What could anyone do in 4 1/2 Minutes?
 

BFC1997

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Today, the balance of the game was tipped in our favour. The substitutions then made us a less effective unit.

Do you blame Thomas for poor decision making, or feel sorry for him because he hasn’t quite got the squad needed?
 

liverbee

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Hes not above criticism. The last two months have been ****
I agree that the results and large parts of the performances have been hugely disappointing. Since Reading. We've seen worse, but we were looking set before Valentine's Day. The knees went weak. I do not think that TF is to blame. But how would I know?
 

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