Post Match Thread Barnsley 0-1 Brentford

Isleworth_Bee

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He’s an ex BBC reporter who was asked to leave after inappropriate comments about QPR but has been rightly given a second chance and taken it well.You may notice he has trouble pronouncing Mbeumo properly but believe he will be receiving elocution lessons before he’s next selected
Great to see you back posting mate. :sorted:
 

Isleworth_Bee

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Didnt like the way MJ and JDS both pulled out wide at times. I know Barnsley were making it hard but it left us with very little out ball and link in the middle.
 

beebopalula

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I was concerned after the Wycombe performance that we'd get nothing. Huge difference due to the inclusion of Fosu and Janelt. Defensively we looked back at last season's level. One more change needed which is to rest Bryan. Shame as l thought he improved vs Wycombe but IMO he was ineffectual again. Maybe play Marcondes wide or Forss depending on injury situation. I don't think we will see Josh on Friday.
 

red_and_white

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Barnsley are a decent side which we limited to one shot from distance.

We created several chances ourselves and put them under lots of pressure pretty much all second half.

I’m really happy with how solid we’ve looked in the last couple of games, and content with the points haul.
 

wanderer paul

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Barnsley sat off us and allowed us to play out from the back. No pressing at all. That was a massive help to us!!

Having the back 4, 5, back playing as a unit also made us stronger as a defensive unit. Janelt sitting in front Of them was excellent (although very lucky not to give away a penalty!).

This solid back line, and Barnsley’s lack of pressing, allowed Jensen & Dasilva to float around the pitch, offering themselves to pick up the ball in wider areas. This pushed Mbeumo and Fosu further forward too. The full backs did their job overlapping and defending well, especially Rico (outstanding once again).

Ivan led the line brilliantly even though he didn’t have many opportunities his way. The one chance he got, he tucked away with a lovely header.

A much better performance and something to work with!!

Will the QPR match see changes? I hope not!
 

nick logan

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As soon as some fans realise this the better, we will not be as entertaining as last year. Ollie can be replaced but Said cannot, we were privileged to have these 2 in our team. But ultimately they failed at the last hurdle when it mattered most.

We might need to grind out results, we may win ugly at times this season. We may not be as entertaining but that doesn’t mean we can’t get promoted.

Jenelt is class, Da Silva and Henry have both clearly improved, Toney will comfortably get 20 league goals, Jenson looks better this year and Raya is more than reliable.

We will be there or there abouts this season...
he'll have 20 by the new year :sorted:
 

nick logan

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We're still lacking a bit of a spark, but what was much better was that we had control of the game, particularly in the second half. That, together with a really solid defence, gave us the platform to take the 3 points even though we didn't create a huge amount.

At times since Frank took over, it's felt like we've been less concerned about actually controlling the game than under Smith and more focused on direct attacks on the opponent's goal. With an attacking line-up that isn't as threatening as last year, that approach hasn't been working in recent games. But tonight, we were patient and ground out a deserved victory. We're not the same team as last season, but we've got it in us to find different ways of winning games, and hopefully this can be the start of some better form.
better form ? 1 defeat in 9 , unbeaten in 6 letting in 2 goals
 

Leedsbee

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Only caught the second half but against a team doing alright at the moment that was a pretty dominant performance. Liked the improved performances from Sergi and particularly Emiliano who kept things simple. Bryan was having a bit of a sulk but I thought Said was too at the beginning of last season. Bryan, Saman and Segi could all do with the confidence a few goal will bring. Really impressed by Raya absolutely confident again about claiming that space between himself and the back line of the defence. Can't see how Thomas has the time in training at the moment to work on the intricate patterns we love , probably all physical recovery and defensive shape, but keep in the mix till Christmas then go again.
 

Isleworth_Bee

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Barnsley sat off us and allowed us to play out from the back. No pressing at all. That was a massive help to us!!

Having the back 4, 5, back playing as a unit also made us stronger as a defensive unit. Janelt sitting in front Of them was excellent (although very lucky not to give away a penalty!).

This solid back line, and Barnsley’s lack of pressing, allowed Jensen & Dasilva to float around the pitch, offering themselves to pick up the ball in wider areas. This pushed Mbeumo and Fosu further forward too. The full backs did their job overlapping and defending well, especially Rico (outstanding once again).

Ivan led the line brilliantly even though he didn’t have many opportunities his way. The one chance he got, he tucked away with a lovely header.

A much better performance and something to work with!!

Will the QPR match see changes? I hope not!
Very strange as they looked like a very fit well drilled team. Any side who does their homework on us must know that a high press (at the minute( will cause us issues.
 

Delbee

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Only caught the second half but against a team doing alright at the moment that was a pretty dominant performance. Liked the improved performances from Sergi and particularly Emiliano who kept things simple. Bryan was having a bit of a sulk but I thought Said was too at the beginning of last season. Bryan, Saman and Segi could all do with the confidence a few goal will bring. Really impressed by Raya absolutely confident again about claiming that space between himself and the back line of the defence. Can't see how Thomas has the time in training at the moment to work on the intricate patterns we love , probably all physical recovery and defensive shape, but keep in the mix till Christmas then go again.
Always said Top 10 at Christmas Top 6 at Easter then last push
 

jlove

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Barnsley head coach Valerien Ismael to BBC Radio Sheffield said:
We expected the best opponent in possession with a lot of quality. It is not easy to press an opponent like that because they are very calm and try to lure you. We need another approach to be more patient, and aggressive in some others.

Out of possession we were really good but in possession we were not clinical enough in some situations. We have to work on this. It is a bit frustrating, but it was another level for us. It was like chess."
It was their coach's decision not to press us high as he thought we would be able to play through it. Maybe he gave us too much respect but it meant they played deeper and tried to get the ball out quickly. We had 13 goal attempts to their 3, so would have won on points, thankfully, one goal was always going to win it.
 

bee good

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Only saw the highlights but opened them up at least twice - Forss 1 on 1 which he should have scored and Mbeumo 1 on 1 which he should have passed into Ivan for an open goal...
Wasn't Toney coming from an offside position though?
 

nick logan

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caught Clinton Morrissons comments
In control
good performance
will be right up there

:sorted:
 

IslandBee

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Janelt my MoM. He is a great find. CN is not going to just walk back into the side.
I think he will but it will be Jensen who gives way. Still think we are not getting nearly enough from him. Decent touches here and there, good at set-pieces, but drifts out of the game for extended periods and is very easy to brush off the ball
 

nick logan

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I think he will but it will be Jensen who gives way. Still think we are not getting nearly enough from him. Decent touches here and there, good at set-pieces, but drifts out of the game for extended periods and is very easy to brush off the ball
cant see that , Jensen has been very good imho
 

Banana

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It was their coach's decision not to press us high as he thought we would be able to play through it. Maybe he gave us too much respect but it meant they played deeper and tried to get the ball out quickly. We had 13 goal attempts to their 3, so would have won on points, thankfully, one goal was always going to win it.
Yes indeed, as evidenced below
1606301909382.png
 

YORKIE

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I think he will but it will be Jensen who gives way. Still think we are not getting nearly enough from him. Decent touches here and there, good at set-pieces, but drifts out of the game for extended periods and is very easy to brush off the ball
He is the nearest we have to Sawyers in terms of creativity. He is a Danish international who is highly regarded by their manager. These players don’t run around like headless chickens, or need to be “bruisers” ready to knock over opponents, they look for front players running off the ball into spaces to enable them to produce the killer passes.
They are least effective when the football is more direct I.e defence to winger, cross into the box for the front man to get on to the end of. Unfortunately when teams work a high press tactic there is a tendency by some players and a fair few fans to get the ball up the field as fast as possible aka Warnock, Pulis type play.
Without him on the field we would inevitably be forced to use such tactics. He is a very good player (as was Sawyers) ...we can Ill afford to lose/ get on his back as some on here delighted in doing fairly recently.
 

smiffy superbee

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A good result borne out by the stats.
First priority achieved a C L E A N S H E E T ....and in addition we managed to score!
Things to build upon:-
1. Jansson & Pinnock SHOULD be chipping in with one or two goals with headers from the number of corners that we win.
2. Ghoddos, Mbeuno (R foot), Canos and Fosu to consistently up their games and chip in with a goal or two, and with more quality assists to Toney.
 

shouldbee

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Clean sheet. 70% possession, 13 corners to their 2, and we restricted them to one shot on target. We should have won 3-0 if Bryan and Forss had converted their good chances.
Back 4 sold, Raya did what he had to do, Janelt MOM. Fosu good on the left and Sergi did well when he came on......and let's not forget Barnsley had won 4 out of their last 5 games.
TF got it spot on :)
 

WARFIELD BEE

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Clean sheet. 70% possession, 13 corners to their 2, and we restricted them to one shot on target. We should have won 3-0 if Bryan and Forss had converted their good chances.
Back 4 sold, Raya did what he had to do, Janelt MOM. Fosu good on the left and Sergi did well when he came on......and let's not forget Barnsley had won 4 out of their last 5 games.
TF got it spot on :)
BLOODY HELL THAT WAS QUICK!
 

West Wilts Bee

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Clean sheet. 70% possession, 13 corners to their 2, and we restricted them to one shot on target. We should have won 3-0 if Bryan and Forss had converted their good chances.
Back 4 sold, Raya did what he had to do, Janelt MOM. Fosu good on the left and Sergi did well when he came on......and let's not forget Barnsley had won 4 out of their last 5 games.
TF got it spot on :)
Good summary I go along with that, also agree with your point about Barnsley’s form. I have moaned a lot about our recent performances, and I hate being negative about our team. But as a unit last night they looked very comfortable, so i have to give them a lot of credit. We are still not there yet imo, but for me that was a cracking 3 points.
 

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TF's post-match interview summed it up very well. Mature performance. Very solid at the back but still room for improvement in the final third. Barnsley have been in great form but we made them look very ordinary. Tarique did well and Janelt was outstanding (although glad there was no VAR to give the penalty). Hope DaSilva is not out for long but Marcondes was impressive second half. Just need Mbuemo to find his scoring boots - a goal will do wonders for his confidence. Without Benrahma we're not going to be the same exciting team as last season but we can still be very effective. Keep in touch with the leaders until Christmas and then push on in 2021 with fans to roar us on !
 

IslandBee

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He is the nearest we have to Sawyers in terms of creativity. He is a Danish international who is highly regarded by their manager. These players don’t run around like headless chickens, or need to be “bruisers” ready to knock over opponents, they look for front players running off the ball into spaces to enable them to produce the killer passes.
They are least effective when the football is more direct I.e defence to winger, cross into the box for the front man to get on to the end of. Unfortunately when teams work a high press tactic there is a tendency by some players and a fair few fans to get the ball up the field as fast as possible aka Warnock, Pulis type play.
Without him on the field we would inevitably be forced to use such tactics. He is a very good player (as was Sawyers) ...we can Ill afford to lose/ get on his back as some on here delighted in doing fairly recently.
I was a huge fan of Sawyers, know absolutely what such players bring to sides and would very much like Jensen to be doing the same. He is not, unfortunately, by some distance.

'Killer passes' are a case in point: how many have there been in the last 10/15 games other than the one that everyone remembers against Swansea? He is a good dead ball striker, for sure, but his forward passing in open play is still generally disappointing.

Without Jensen on the field we would be a long ball team. Really? I don't see much long ball about JDS, CN and Vitaly. They can all play, pick a pass, and link up moves between back and front. But, what they also bring, which Jensen has not so far, is a consistent ability to protect the ball ie earning the right to play.

Don't get me wrong: I know there is a very good player in there; I am very definitely not delighting in getting on his back. I think he can ultimately contribute at the level Sawyers did. I just find it frustrating that he is not getting closer to this level at present.
 

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I was really lifted by some of our play last night, in complete contrast to the previous game. I saw signs of progress which will be even more marked once the confidence levels increase. The repetitive line trotted out is wanting the ball movement to be quicker. This will happen when confidence increases and two or three touches become one touch, confident and instinctive. JDS naturally plays this way but less so atm, and Marcondes naturally plays this way and started to do this last night.
 

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I can't wait for us to pass Reading, getting fed up with a Reading supporter who keeps saying mind the gap.
 

YORKIE

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I was a huge fan of Sawyers, know absolutely what such players bring to sides and would very much like Jensen to be doing the same. He is not, unfortunately, by some distance.

'Killer passes' are a case in point: how many have there been in the last 10/15 games other than the one that everyone remembers against Swansea? He is a good dead ball striker, for sure, but his forward passing in open play is still generally disappointing.

Without Jensen on the field we would be a long ball team. Really? I don't see much long ball about JDS, CN and Vitaly. They can all play, pick a pass, and link up moves between back and front. But, what they also bring, which Jensen has not so far, is a consistent ability to protect the ball ie earning the right to play.

Don't get me wrong: I know there is a very good player in there; I am very definitely not delighting in getting on his back. I think he can ultimately contribute at the level Sawyers did. I just find it frustrating that he is not getting closer to this level at present.
I too was a fan of Sawyers but he was playing in a team which created the opportunities for him by making good movement off the ball- Watkins, Maupay, Jota, Vibe, Judge et al.It is-players off the ball who create the space for the pass to be executed. Jensen has not got that quality of runners at the moment hence we are getting less creativity. In an ideal set up midfielders who have the ball should have at least 2 players available for the pass/making these forward runs.
The long ball from the defence is played either because there is a lack of confidence in the player bringing the ball forward or not seeing the positions that Jensen and DaSilva are taking up....CN and or Vitaly are the ball winners but in the last few games they have been missing, hence the tendency to get the ball forward at the earliest opportunity from our defenders..if Jensen and JDS are not playing that will still be the case.
As you know Sawyers came in for some stick sometimes for not getting involved enough.....the same thing is happening with him at WBA. They are playing him as the ball winner( aka CN role) rather than the attacking midfielder he so successfully played with us...at times recently Jensen has had to do the same....with the result in both cases that the fans are frustrated at the lack of flow and incisive football that they wanted(in WBA’s case) or are missing in our case.
 

jlove

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I too was a fan of Sawyers but he was playing in a team which created the opportunities for him by making good movement off the ball- Watkins, Maupay, Jota, Vibe, Judge et al.It is-players off the ball who create the space for the pass to be executed. ...
There's another factor in that the team was geared up to get the ball to Sawyers, as the player who was going to dictate the game, and have the attacking players anticipating balls into the half-spaces. That's not the case with Jensen as there is much more variety in our play (or should be) now. Our "two 8's" are complementary, with one able to pick out the passes and one able to carry the ball forward. It makes us, when on form, more flexible and unpredictable, the essence of 4-3-3.
 

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There's another factor in that the team was geared up to get the ball to Sawyers, as the player who was going to dictate the game, and have the attacking players anticipating balls into the half-spaces. That's not the case with Jensen as there is much more variety in our play (or should be) now. Our "two 8's" are complementary, with one able to pick out the passes and one able to carry the ball forward. It makes us, when on form, more flexible and unpredictable, the essence of 4-3-3.
That's the theory but while one is delivering the other is not most of the time, though I do accept @YORKIE that the quality of the runs/finding of space could be better.
 

Isleworth_Bee

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That's the theory but while one is delivering the other is not most of the time, though I do accept @YORKIE that the quality of the runs/finding of space could be better.
You've also got to remember who we have played in the last few games and the tactics they employed.

Boro - man marked the midfield out of the game. It was their main tactic even JDS had a quiet game. It worked very well.
Wycombe - Sat in, made life very tough and battled for every ball. This was the one game out of all the bad performances where our options off the ball were next to none and were the main reason we struggled. MJ was onto a loser as was JDS. They cant pass to no one.
Barnsley - Dropped deep every time but pressed us very well when we got into the final 2 thirds.

Teams arent making it easy for our midfield three and when they have no options to pass to it makes it even harder. I suppose thats whey JDS and MJ are pulling wider. But IMO MJ is the least of our worries atm and we would be worse off without him. JDS has offered as much as he has in the last few games.
 

IslandBee

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You've also got to remember who we have played in the last few games and the tactics they employed.

Boro - man marked the midfield out of the game. It was their main tactic even JDS had a quiet game. It worked very well.
Wycombe - Sat in, made life very tough and battled for every ball. This was the one game out of all the bad performances where our options off the ball were next to none and were the main reason we struggled. MJ was onto a loser as was JDS. They cant pass to no one.
Barnsley - Dropped deep every time but pressed us very well when we got into the final 2 thirds.

Teams arent making it easy for our midfield three and when they have no options to pass to it makes it even harder. I suppose thats whey JDS and MJ are pulling wider. But IMO MJ is the least of our worries atm and we would be worse off without him. JDS has offered as much as he has in the last few games.
Fair enough. Good points well made. Hope you are right! :)
 

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Re the "penalty for handball", the acknowledged expert on this says it was NOT a penalty.

There's been new guidance over the international break that changed how handballs are to be interpreted.

100% not a penalty, in fact, if he had moved his hand to get out of the way of the ball and it still hit, it may actually have been given! Wish it would just be as clear cut as "deliberate hand ball".
 

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100% not a penalty, in fact, if he had moved his hand to get out of the way of the ball and it still hit, it may actually have been given! Wish it would just be as clear cut as "deliberate hand ball".
Yep deliberate works for me. Easy to understand. Dont quite know how the Pen given against Pitbull away at Watford in 93 was deliberate though. The ball was thundered into his hand. Those 2 points dropped got us relegated in the end.
 

Banana

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100% not a penalty, in fact, if he had moved his hand to get out of the way of the ball and it still hit, it may actually have been given! Wish it would just be as clear cut as "deliberate hand ball".
Which, of course, is a clear cut as mud. Unless you can read the player's brainwaves
 

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I guess it's easy to say after seeing the replay isn't it. Who'd want to be a referee?
Thankless task atm. The powers to be arent making it easy for them with the handball nonsense, VAR and offsides.
 

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Re the "penalty for handball", the acknowledged expert on this says it was NOT a penalty.

There's been new guidance over the international break that changed how handballs are to be interpreted.

I agree it would have been extremely harsh to give pen. Janalt was barely 3 yards away and there is no movement of hand towards ball. Only a mind reader can know if a handball is deliberate so best way of judging is the old adage, ball to hand, or hand to ball. The only time the judgment needs to be more nuanced is when a defender charges out to block a shot or header. In that situation, if his hands are raised and ball hits hand, it should be a penalty. This is what I think the law should be, and how I'd see it if I was a ref, not what I think the law actually is now. The lawmakers have made such a mess of it I don't think anyone really understands what is supposed to be a penalty any longer.
Just as an aside, I think our performance against Barnsley was far better than posters on this forum have stated. Almost the perfect away performance against a decent team. Just because of the heights we hit after lockdown last season I think the bar of expectation has now been raised unrealistically high
 

nick logan

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I agree about Barnsley performance.
I can't think of another team in Champ who can control 1 goal away wins like we did at Sheff wed and tuesday.
Cant remember either team having a worthy effort ( certainly in last hour at SWFC )
 

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