Covid and the future of games

PhilE

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Out of interest, can you prove you've been vaccinated against Diphtheria or Polio, for example?
I had an international vaccination card for years but ultimately never had to show it. GP has a record though so I imagine if I needed it to be proved anywhere I could get something from the surgery.
 

jlove

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I had an international vaccination card for years but ultimately never had to show it. GP has a record though so I imagine if I needed it to be proved anywhere I could get something from the surgery.
Still got mine but it's only those in the last 20 years.
 

beesbees_bfc

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Don't know but hopefully state of the art if the NHS are going to co-ordinate the re-vaccination etc as this is going to go on for ages yet (year after year probably).
This is a very serious issue and needs to be treated as such and something like the DVLC MOT/Insurance database is required.
It won't be hundreds of thousands of requests at 3pm as people buy tickets in advance. Also STH's can prove it well in advance and with bar-code entry at tunstiles it will just flag you up as in-eligible so no point in travelling if you can't get in.
Not saying it's easy but needs to done, I'd be amazed if it isn't already in hand.
To clarify, you’d expect the club to have a system that has a two way integration with the NHS database which enables the BFC system to know everyone’s vaccination status at any point in time.

You then expect that application to be integrated with the turnstile system in order to recognise and flag discrepancies in statuses.

Im assuming the two systems (BFC vaccine application and turnstile application) would also need to be integrated with the ticketing system in order to have all of the data points needed to match the ticket to a person and then, in turn, the person to the vaccination status.

Without even considering the data permission aspect or the fact that all you’d need to do is buy a ticket in the name of someone who had been vaccinated (thereby meaning BFC had inappropriately accessed that persons medical info) to bypass this system it seems a very complicated and expensive undertaking for minimal gain
 

badgerbee

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I had an international vaccination card for years but ultimately never had to show it. GP has a record though so I imagine if I needed it to be proved anywhere I could get something from the surgery.
Genuinely read that as Griffin Park (obsessed...??......), and wondered why the club would have a record of your vaccinations.......😐
 

bubb

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An interesting article from computer weekly about development of a COVID immunity/vaccination system that maintains privacy and is under trial. Someone somewhere thinks that it is worth developing this technology to sell to organisations
 
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It might be used by some countries as a condition of entry depending how the pandemic evolves but really can’t see it being used for events etc.
You do seem to have a bee in your bonnet on this but I think that (thankfully) you are going to be disappointed. We are not going to have a vax/novax society let alone for football.
Not a bee in my bonnet cheshirebee just angry I guess and looking for things that might get us out of this and watching footy etc again. Yesterday’s BBC news had a report from Wuhan where they are back to normal, today’s news had a harrowing report from a London ICU and 1,600 more fatalities. Clutching at straws that might change the current direction 😔
 

nocoat

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Not a bee in my bonnet cheshirebee just angry I guess and looking for things that might get us out of this and watching footy etc again. Yesterday’s BBC news had a report from Wuhan where they are back to normal, today’s news had a harrowing report from a London ICU and 1,600 more fatalities. Clutching at straws that might change the current direction 😔
For a given value of “us” !
 
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To clarify, you’d expect the club to have a system that has a two way integration with the NHS database which enables the BFC system to know everyone’s vaccination status at any point in time.

You then expect that application to be integrated with the turnstile system in order to recognise and flag discrepancies in statuses.

Im assuming the two systems (BFC vaccine application and turnstile application) would also need to be integrated with the ticketing system in order to have all of the data points needed to match the ticket to a person and then, in turn, the person to the vaccination status.

Without even considering the data permission aspect or the fact that all you’d need to do is buy a ticket in the name of someone who had been vaccinated (thereby meaning BFC had inappropriately accessed that persons medical info) to bypass this system it seems a very complicated and expensive undertaking for minimal gain
Please, respectfully, see post #357
 

beesbees_bfc

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Please, respectfully, see post #357
Post 357 and the linked article read... it potentially goes some way to answering the data privacy question albeit only with lots of vague words and reassurances from someone who will benefit financially from the prototypes success.

However, nothing in the article addresses any of the technology complexity specific to football stadiums or BFC lack of previous prowess when it comes to buying or building systems (please see ticket system thread for evidence as to BFC current capabilities in this space).

I’ve never stated that the technology couldn’t be established within certain organisations or industries (e.g when booking a flight where you need to book in advance, provide passport info etc and could easily tick a box to say you’re happy for them to obtain your vaccination status all seems very surmountable), my scepticism was the ability of football clubs and BFC’s ability and appetite to do it.
 

BudleighBee

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If they were to allow entry to football only to those that have been vaccinated, then anyone under 50 can probably forget going to football until well into next season, some very likely not until 2022. Then of course if they find that boosters are needed every 5 months, no-one would ever be able to go to a whole season of football ever again, unless you could remain permanently in date. Then of course new variants would appear to stop everyone going to football again until a vaccine is made for that variant and then they might say the same for flu vaccines. Careful what you wish for.
 

cheshirebee

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Not a bee in my bonnet cheshirebee just angry I guess and looking for things that might get us out of this and watching footy etc again. Yesterday’s BBC news had a report from Wuhan where they are back to normal, today’s news had a harrowing report from a London ICU and 1,600 more fatalities. Clutching at straws that might change the current direction 😔
Understand your frustration. Vaccination will help get us where we all want to be but I think you have to be patient and let the effect that it will have to drive down cases, hospitalisation and deaths to open up football and other aspects of ‘normal’ life. Using it to divide society into vax/novax is not the way to get there practically nor ethically.
 

beesbees_bfc

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Hopefully what it will mean is that when football does allow limited numbers of spectators in again (assuming they’ll build up slowly), those fans who were eligible to be in one of the first games at Lionel Road but declined due to shielding etc will have been vaccinated and will feel comfortable attending and getting their first taste of the new stadium.
 

Ealing Bee

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Covid-19 cases in Championship, League One and League Two drop from 123 to 32

The number of positive Covid-19 cases in the English Football League has fallen from 123 to 32 in the latest round of testing.

A total of 4,598 players and staff from all 72 EFL clubs were tested from 11-18 January with 53 clubs returning no positive results.
The week before 123 people tested positive from 4,038 tests.
EFL Covid-19 cases drop significantly
 

cheshirebee

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Covid-19 cases in Championship, League One and League Two drop from 123 to 32

The number of positive Covid-19 cases in the English Football League has fallen from 123 to 32 in the latest round of testing.

A total of 4,598 players and staff from all 72 EFL clubs were tested from 11-18 January with 53 clubs returning no positive results.
The week before 123 people tested positive from 4,038 tests.
EFL Covid-19 cases drop significantly
That’s such good news. 75% lower positive cases from 20% more tests.
Hopefully a signal that we’ve turned a corner and talk of shuttting down football will cease.
 

Judio1999

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9 days ago Crawley dressing room
Beat Leeds
Non covid celebrations

And guess what

Outbreak of covid at Crawley

Cant play FA Cup match this weekend...
 

cheshirebee

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H&W take themselves into self isolation...
Meanwhile Slough post an open letter about Saturday: Club statement: Response to options set out by National League
Wow, that’s pretty raw stuff on the H&W video.
Brings it home the reality of how difficult it is to control the virus without the resources of PL or perhaps Championship clubs. Doesn’t seem sustainable at National League level and can only see a suspension coming unfortunately.
Hopefully won’t be the case for EFL.
 

Judio1999

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Have a look at the chaos with the tennis players flights to Aussie
Test negative to get on plane at LA
Test positive on arrival in Aus

The WHOLE plane now has to isolate for 14 days in their hotel room without leaving it
And now six days later

A Spanish WTA player who was on that flight (and tested negative on arrival)

Was been put in hard quarantine for 14 days

Has Today Tested Positive

So the Quarantine IS needed despite the tennis players moaning and whingeing
 

wibs

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The National League North and National League South seasons have been suspended for two weeks.

Several member clubs had called for the campaign be halted until concerns over the funding of elite non-league sides and Covid-19 testing are addressed.

The decision was taken at a National League board meeting on Friday morning after a review of feedback from clubs.
 

SpiderBee

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The National League North and National League South seasons have been suspended for two weeks.

Several member clubs had called for the campaign be halted until concerns over the funding of elite non-league sides and Covid-19 testing are addressed.

The decision was taken at a National League board meeting on Friday morning after a review of feedback from clubs.
Latest - National League still to decide on vote
 

HaylingBee74

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If these leagues had scheduled fixtures to only play teams Home OR Away they could have finished the season and had promotion/relegation at the end
 

BFC1997

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The numbers now (cases, deaths) are better than they were when fans were in stadiums (Dec 9th, when we hosted Derby). And that’s with what must be increased testing since then.

Given the warming weather, vaccinations, and downward trajectory of the figures. We must be fairly close to having fans back. Before the end of the season must be on the cards.
 

jlove

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The numbers now (cases, deaths) are better than they were when fans were in stadiums (Dec 9th, when we hosted Derby). And that’s with what must be increased testing since then.

Given the warming weather, vaccinations, and downward trajectory of the figures. We must be fairly close to having fans back. Before the end of the season must be on the cards.
The number of daily reported cases, on a 7-day average, dropped below 1,000 on 14 Jun 2020 and consistently rose above after 24 Aug, and have remained so since. They were above 20,000 on 9 Dec and have now dropped to 12,000, so I don't think 9 Dec is a valid baseline. 2 months below 1,000 is more appropriate.
 

Hippobee

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The number of daily reported cases, on a 7-day average, dropped below 1,000 on 14 Jun 2020 and consistently rose above after 24 Aug, and have remained so since. They were above 20,000 on 9 Dec and have now dropped to 12,000, so I don't think 9 Dec is a valid baseline. 2 months below 1,000 is more appropriate.
Agree about 9th December not being a valid baseline, although I don't think it'll need to be as low as 1000 positive tests per day for fans to be let in. June 2020 is not really comparable to now for two reasons. Firstly, there is far more testing being done now and will continue to be done (so I doubt we will see below 1000 a day for many months). Secondly, the seriousness of the illness for those testing positive should be factored in. If all goes to plan with the vaccine rollout, then there should be far fewer people admitted to hospitals the longer we go on. Once they let schools back in, then the figures must be monitored very closely. That is the key, as it involves something like 2 million people per day out and about compared to now. The numbers of infections will certainly rise, but if they can be kept at a relatively low level and crucially, hospital admissions continue to fall, I would say there's a good chance of small numbers being let into stadia before the end of the season. Big 'if' though!
 

jlove

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Agree about 9th December not being a valid baseline, although I don't think it'll need to be as low as 1000 positive tests per day for fans to be let in.
Yes, I'm not advocating 1,000 as a baseline, just pointing out that the UK managed to be below 1,000 for about 10 weeks and we've maxed-out at 81,551 at the beginning of the current 10-week period. Any number should be closer to 1,000 than 80,000.
 

mhead bee

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Agree about 9th December not being a valid baseline, although I don't think it'll need to be as low as 1000 positive tests per day for fans to be let in. June 2020 is not really comparable to now for two reasons. Firstly, there is far more testing being done now and will continue to be done (so I doubt we will see below 1000 a day for many months). Secondly, the seriousness of the illness for those testing positive should be factored in. If all goes to plan with the vaccine rollout, then there should be far fewer people admitted to hospitals the longer we go on. Once they let schools back in, then the figures must be monitored very closely. That is the key, as it involves something like 2 million people per day out and about compared to now. The numbers of infections will certainly rise, but if they can be kept at a relatively low level and crucially, hospital admissions continue to fall, I would say there's a good chance of small numbers being let into stadia before the end of the season. Big 'if' though!
Depends who’s advise is being taken though.

Some of the scientific advisors during the week were saying that if the unvaccinated people go out they will still spread it amongst themselves and create a new varient that may overcome the immunity of the vaccine and we are at the start again.

she was recommending that we stay in full lockdown for at least another full year if not more,

I got the impression that she is possibly in her element now as her chosen field now puts her in high demand and she has absolutely nothing else in her life except work.
 

mhead bee

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The numbers now (cases, deaths) are better than they were when fans were in stadiums (Dec 9th, when we hosted Derby). And that’s with what must be increased testing since then.
And if I have to endure any more games like that I hope they keep it closed forever.

Seriously though, I would be surprised if we see anything this season. The leaked document is saying at best hospitality will be the end of April to beginning of may and out door sports at the same time.

I think it’s all wonky as outdoor sports, restaurants and gyms are by far the safest places way above meeting friends at home and shops but the whole thing had been shambolic from day one so who knows what U turns we have in store.
 

Themepark

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BudleighBee

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Depends who’s advise is being taken though.

Some of the scientific advisors during the week were saying that if the unvaccinated people go out they will still spread it amongst themselves and create a new varient that may overcome the immunity of the vaccine and we are at the start again.

she was recommending that we stay in full lockdown for at least another full year if not more,

I got the impression that she is possibly in her element now as her chosen field now puts her in high demand and she has absolutely nothing else in her life except work.
I agree with a lot of this. A very cautious approach is highly likely. I think enough people have been scared witless by the messaging and the scientists, none of whom seem to agree with each other, to make a return to full stadiums unlikely in the short to medium term. With out door sport unlikely before April/ May, I would think some fans in stadiums from Sept/ Oct is probably the earliest (hopefully Sept). There will then be gradual increases in fan numbers throughout next season, unless there is a rise in COVID numbers next winter (highly likely if not almost certain?) in which case it will be back to zero fans again for the winter months. That will mean small numbers of fans back in spring 2022 and if there is no resurgence over winter I reckon we could see full stadiums again in spring 2022. Hopefully, regardless of what happens next season we will start the 2022/23 season with full stadiums, though whether further BCD games will be needed in the winter of that season remains to be seen.
 
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You get a card when you get inoculated and I can see this evolving into a photo ID card.
Obviously not secure but it’s all on a database too which could be made available to companies etc.
I know the human rights brigade will be all over it but IMO it’s worth it to see a game in the flesh.
Do you know how difficult and expensive it would be to design a system that does that?
Well Les, it looks like a 'tin-pot' country like Israel (1:1685) has managed it without too much trouble.
Israel eases restrictions following vaccine success
Everything you need to know about Israel’s green passport program
Where there's a will there's a way.
Hopefully our Government is thinking along the same lines; it would be a big step towards LR attendance.
 
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