England v Pakistan 4th Test, The Oval

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maddogging

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Will be interesting to see how this affects any bets placed

your not wrong, I'd imagine after Pakistan's first innings, the price on England to win would be very nice offerings indeed.
 

stedders

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Agree with Aggers:

I have some sympathy with the Pakistani team on this, but there are ways of registering a protest and refusing to play, however temporary is not the way to do it.

I would hope that the interests (although I am sure it is a forlorn hope) of the paying public are given paramount significance.
 

West Ealing Bee

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Will be interesting to see how this affects any bets placed

There was an email read on out TMS saying that just before tea England were about 250-1 on the exchanges and during the tea interval, ie before anyone knew what was about to happen, that had come in to 6-4 :eek: :suspect:
 

Willo

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I would hope that the interests (although I am sure it is a forlorn hope) of the paying public are given paramount significance.

....and a announcement soon. Many people will be travelling from miles away and don't deserve to be ****ed about :mad1:
 

West Ealing Bee

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The whole thing is a complete farce and for no decision to be announced at nearly 10pm makes it even worse.

I said earlier that I thought Pakistan might fly home, which Edmundo disagreed with, and someone above said replace the umpires. I think it is important to look at the ramaifications of this.

As it stands Pakistan are cheaters, no ifs, buts or maybes, they won't be happy with that.
If the game is forfitted the ICC are siding with the umpires saying that Pakistan are cheaters, I can forsee a situation where Pakistan sue the ICC or something similar, India will almost certainly side with them as will Sri Lanka and Bangladesh, the whole system could crumble.

I don't think Pakistan have an issue with England but they will do with the umpires and QED the ICC which appoints them, and now looks likely to back them in a dispute.

The ICC has no power without the support of the Indian sub-continent.

I know it's a big leap but the ramifications of this could be huge.
 

Les Beeavinu

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BBC news announce that the game has been awarded to England. :(
 

West Ealing Bee

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The whole thing is a complete farce and for no decision to be announced at nearly 10pm makes it even worse.

I said earlier that I thought Pakistan might fly home, which Edmundo disagreed with, and someone above said replace the umpires. I think it is important to look at the ramaifications of this.

As it stands Pakistan are cheaters, no ifs, buts or maybes, they won't be happy with that.
If the game is forfitted the ICC are siding with the umpires saying that Pakistan are cheaters, I can forsee a situation where Pakistan sue the ICC or something similar, India will almost certainly side with them as will Sri Lanka and Bangladesh, the whole system could crumble.

I don't think Pakistan have an issue with England but they will do with the umpires and QED the ICC which appoints them, and now looks likely to back them in a dispute.

The ICC has no power without the support of the Indian sub-continent.

I know it's a big leap but the ramifications of this could be huge.

My worst case scenario appears to have been averted.

The ICC seem to be siding with Pakisatn, while realising they can't allow them to not come onto the field and get away with it.

There is to be a review of the 'ball-tampering' call and I suspect that will come down on Pakistan's side, seeing the end of Hair's career but allowing cricket to continue as it should.

It remains to be seen what Pakistan will do now but the ICC have done all they can to blame the umpires IMHO without changing their decision.
 

Willo

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Edmundo

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Good. I trust they will announce how we go about claiming our refund. All that's missing now is an apology for keeping spectators in the dark.
 

Edmundo

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Good. I trust they will announce how we go about claiming our refund.
http://www.surreycricket.com/news/international/test-match-update,5310,NS.html

Ticket holders who attended the fourth day of the Test Match on Sunday 20 August will be entitled to a 40% refund on the face value of the tickets held. Purchasers should follow the instructions as outlined on the reverse of their tickets to claim this refund.

Customers who have purchased tickets for Monday 21 August are advised that a full refund of the face value of tickets purchased will be automatically processed. Customers are advised that tickets do not need to be returned.
 

weymouth bee

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If they were in the clear why did the forfeit the game :confused:
 

davido_i

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. . . but I do think the Pakistani's were being a bit childish!

I would hate to think that any England team were accused of cheating, but would expect them to knuckle down and get on with the job in hand.

Er, what like Mike Gatting "knuckled down & got on with the job in hand" in Pakistan when Shakoor Rana made his allegations of cheating????

No TV evidence & everything points to a quite appauling piece of umpiring. Can't blame the Pakistan side at all for making a public show of their contempt for this claim that they have been cheating.
 

weymouth bee

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crumbs - it might be an idea to read about what's happened before launching straight in with such a question :wave:

I did read about it and have heard it on the radio all morning. If they are innocent why didn't they go onto the field and play. Surely the spectators would have wanted the game to carry on. what's the old adage
There's no smoke without fire.
 

Brickie Chap

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What is that picture on the front page of the freebie newspaper all about? Trying to imply one of the fielders did tamper with the ball?
 

Brickie Chap

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crumbs - it might be an idea to read about what's happened before launching straight in with such a question :wave:



...but they did forfeit and have claimed to be innoncent...seems a reasonable question to me...
 

Willo

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Interesting to read that Nasser Hussein has said that if he was captain of a team accused in the same way Pakistan were, then he would have acted in exactly the same as they did.
 

jmcp

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Daryl Hair made a decision which surely he couldnt have made lightly and Billy Doctgrove must surely have also concured with it. I take the view you back the umpires decision in these cases and until an enquiry proves otherwise Hair was right to do what he felt.
 

weymouth bee

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Didn't Mike Gatting accuse a team for cheating? I have forgotten which country it was now.
 

West Ealing Bee

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Didn't Mike Gatting accuse a team for cheating? I have forgotten which country it was now.

He accused Pakistani umpire Shakoor Rana of cheating in 1987.

England v Pakistan series have been notoriuos for controversy over the years, pretty much since they started.

It is odd that perhaps the biggest issue to ever affect a match comes when the two teams are getting on :shrug:
 

Edmundo

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No TV evidence & everything points to a quite appauling piece of umpiring. Can't blame the Pakistan side at all for making a public show of their contempt for this claim that they have been cheating.
I don't blame them for wanting to protest, but refusing to play the match is not the right way to protest. All the evidence points to a quite appalling piece of spelling! ;)
 

weymouth bee

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The 1987 incident didn't that result in having an umpire from a different country as well as one from the hosting country?
 

West Ealing Bee

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The 1987 incident didn't that result in having an umpire from a different country as well as one from the hosting country?

Pakistan began calling for neutral umpires after a series here in 1987 and I think after that incident England started to agree ;)

They didn't come in for a few years though, 92ish :scratch:
 

Mr Tree

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I did read about it and have heard it on the radio all morning. If they are innocent why didn't they go onto the field and play. Surely the spectators would have wanted the game to carry on. what's the old adage
There's no smoke without fire.


they didn't go on to play because they were disgusted with being accused of cheating without any evidence, apparently. sounds reasonable to me. they wanted to make a protest - they probably didn't go about it the right way, but i can see their point :sorted:
 

weymouth bee

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they didn't go on to play because they were disgusted with being accused of cheating without any evidence, apparently. sounds reasonable to me. they wanted to make a protest - they probably didn't go about it the right way, but i can see their point :sorted:

I agree they went about it the wrong way but this morning the radio said that they wanted to finish the game and how can they dictate on which umpires to have in their tests matches? Can you imagine what the chaos if that happened in football.
 

Edmundo

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If they had wanted to finish the game, they could have come out to play when the umpires came out for a second time, with the English batsmen. They didn't. I sympathise with them about the behaviour of the umpire, but not with them for the way they went about their protest. But we haven't heard Darrell Hair's side of the story yet, nor Mike Proctor's (the match referee) verdict.
 

Mr Tree

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I agree they went about it the wrong way but this morning the radio said that they wanted to finish the game and how can they dictate on which umpires to have in their tests matches? Can you imagine what the chaos if that happened in football.

haha, i think you'll find Man Utd regularly hand the FA a list of refs who should be kept away from them as much as possible :sorted:

Hair's blatantly a racist, look at him :sorted:
 

Leonardo

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What is Mike Atherton's view of the incident?

yes the same MA who soiled the ball if I remember ...
 

davido_i

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how can they dictate on which umpires to have in their tests matches? Can you imagine what the chaos if that happened in football.
:nono:

Pakistan are asking for 1 umpire from the international rota to be discounted when appointments are made for their matches in future, which hardly equates to "dictating which umpires to have in their tests".

And I do believe it is fairly standard practice in football (even outside Italy!!) to avoid using referees for certain teams where there is a bit of previous.
 
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