Halil Dervişoğlu

BFC1997

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It’s a frustrating part of modern football IMO.

Dervisoglu is under contract at Brentford but clearly is very much seen as an asset for us to extract maximum transfer value from rather than a player for our team.

Not sure if that’s because the player would rather be in Turkey or Netherlands or because TF doesn’t fancy him but probably a combination of both.

Perhaps being in Turkey is best for his international prospects too, which in turn is good for his transfer value.
 

cromerbee

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See the normal idiots on Twitter saying Frank has ruined Halil by not playing him. The Turks in a frenzy!!
Basically in my opinion he didn't want to be here.
Anyway, can't Wissa play through the middle of required??
You Beeeesssss!!!!!
 

SH

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Halil’s only 21. He’s been playing in major leagues since he was, what?, 18. He’s a full Turkish international and will be playing for one of the top sides there in front of 30,000+ crowds every week. I just don’t get why people want to write him off?

If we signed him next summer aged 22 as a “new” player after a great season in Istanbul, everywould say “fantastic … typical Brentford sign another young star in the making”.

He may have a pushy/difficult dad, but that’s not his fault: the son could still be a big winner for us.
 

PJ

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Halil’s only 21. He’s been playing in major leagues since he was, what?, 18. He’s a full Turkish international and will be playing for one of the top sides there in front of 30,000+ crowds every week. I just don’t get why people want to write him off?

If we signed him next summer aged 22 as a “new” player after a great season in Istanbul, everywould say “fantastic … typical Brentford sign another young star in the making”.

He may have a pushy/difficult dad, but that’s not his fault: the son could still be a big winner for us.
Maybe but ever since he's been here it's felt like a soap opera.
I'm not sure any of us have seen enough of him to properly judge him as a player or even describe his best position.

Turkey were absolute pants in the euros so I don't think being in their squad currently merits as many brownie points as perhaps it would in a different era.

For a variety of reasons I doubt we'll see him back here.
If we make a few bob out of the whole saga what's not to like?
 

swr22

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Halil’s only 21. He’s been playing in major leagues since he was, what?, 18. He’s a full Turkish international and will be playing for one of the top sides there in front of 30,000+ crowds every week. I just don’t get why people want to write him off?

If we signed him next summer aged 22 as a “new” player after a great season in Istanbul, everywould say “fantastic … typical Brentford sign another young star in the making”.

He may have a pushy/difficult dad, but that’s not his fault: the son could still be a big winner for us.
For me it is quite simple- we can’t play players who are not committed and won’t press with the intensity we need. He’s got a nice turn and has some skill, but through the games and training he’s been with us he has never been more than a bit part.
Maybe his value will go up for regular game time at Gala and we can make a very decent profit. Maybe he learns to press hard and develops. Either way, it is the best move for us.
 

SH

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Turkey were absolute pants in the euros so I don't think being in their squad currently merits as many brownie points as perhaps it would in a different era.

They’re (currently) top of a qualifying group including Holland and Norway. Not too shabby. But, as with Halil, it’s still early days… we’ll see what the season brings. I’m not convinced the fat lady’s sung her last on this one. But then I’m an eternal optimist 😁
 

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Halil’s only 21. He’s been playing in major leagues since he was, what?, 18. He’s a full Turkish international and will be playing for one of the top sides there in front of 30,000+ crowds every week. I just don’t get why people want to write him off?

If we signed him next summer aged 22 as a “new” player after a great season in Istanbul, everywould say “fantastic … typical Brentford sign another young star in the making”.

He may have a pushy/difficult dad, but that’s not his fault: the son could still be a big winner for us.
I think he is sending you a message.....he does not want to be here, and I do not think he ever did. He was only here five minutes, and he wanted out. Happy to take our signing on fee thought.......forget him.
 

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Decent player. High potential. Not a good fit for Brentford for whatever reason. Sell at end of season for £5m. The end.
 

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I think he is sending you a message.....he does not want to be here, and I do not think he ever did. He was only here five minutes, and he wanted out. Happy to take our signing on fee thought.......forget him.
Things might have been different without covid. He’s had barely a couple of months here before first lockdown and a loan then a big change with us going up while he was on loan. Even a player who’d had a v successful year with us in Bryan found life post-lockdown very hard.
 

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Things might have been different without covid. He’s had barely a couple of months here before first lockdown and a loan then a big change with us going up while he was on loan. Even a player who’d had a v successful year with us in Bryan found life post-lockdown very hard.
You are getting soft in your old age!
 
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Stanley

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Another year and another year older and maybe wiser. It's hard to believe we will see him back again next summer but if you ignore the conjecture about his attitude and work rate I just get the feeling we may have not seen the last of him.
 

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Another year and another year older and maybe wiser. It's hard to believe we will see him back again next summer but if you ignore the conjecture about his attitude and work rate I just get the feeling we may have not seen the last of him.
Most of us never thought we’d see Jota back after he went on loan to Eibar so who knows?
 

swr22

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Never got an opportunity.
Not sure that is fair. By thy rationale lots of players have not had an opportunity, from Valencia to Zamburek to Oksanen.

players come to train every day and need to impress when they are on the pitch. It’s clear that Halil has not done enough to earn a regular place
 

Indian Bee

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Perhaps you have to earn every opportunity

In fairness to Halil since he joined we have had Watkins and thereafter Toney upfront and both were banging in the goals. I am not suggesting Halil is like for like for them both but maybe our system we have played and both these have been fortunate in terms of injuries had prevented him playing more games that we and him would have liked. There is a player in him and our squad IMO is weaker with him out on loan.
 

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Lovely reverse pass, but otherwise didn't see the ball much at all.
 

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Can’t help but think we may have made a mistake with loaning him out. I fully understand he probably wanted the move, but looking at our bench the last 2 games we really could’ve done with a player like him who offers something different to Forss.
 

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Can’t help but think we may have made a mistake with loaning him out. I fully understand he probably wanted the move, but looking at our bench the last 2 games we really could’ve done with a player like him who offers something different to Forss.
We're obviously not party - and rightly so - to the managements thinking but on the face of it I agree with this.
 

AB

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We're obviously not party - and rightly so - to the managements thinking but on the face of it I agree with this.
There’s also what Halil wanted and was willing to do. On paper I’d agree that my preference would have been to have had Halil stay and push for a place off the bench while Forss furthered his overall development by getting regular football at a high level in the Championship or a suitable European top flight (which Halil already had prior to joining us).
 

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Can’t help but think we may have made a mistake with loaning him out. I fully understand he probably wanted the move, but looking at our bench the last 2 games we really could’ve done with a player like him who offers something different to Forss.
Strongly disagree. If the Prem needs athletes and intensity, Halil didn't work hard enough up top in the Championship, let alone the Prem
 

jlove

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Wissa and Forss will have been ahead of him, best for him to be knowing what he needs to do to improve and do it regularly elsewhere.
 

Les Beeavinu

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A conversation to suggest he stay around to make the bench in case there were injuries to Wissa and Mbuemo would have been an interesting one. Maybe Nathan Young-Coombes will make the bench - he will after all be guaranteed to run around a bit.
 

BFC1997

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A conversation to suggest he stay around to make the bench in case there were injuries to Wissa and Mbuemo would have been an interesting one. Maybe Nathan Young-Coombes will make the bench - he will after all be guaranteed to run around a bit.
I felt like this last season when Canos and Mbeumo were having tough runs and then Toney got injured.

But I’ve since changed my mind. I think for the good of the squad you have to have an idea of what is an acceptable standard for senior players in terms of their application in training, running stats etc. and stick to it.

Maybe Halil is a better player than NYC but what does it say to the group of players if they know you can come to Brentford be part of the squad even though you don’t put in 100% or you’re not in the best physical shape possible. Suddenly it becomes acceptable....
 

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I felt like this last season when Canos and Mbeumo were having tough runs and then Toney got injured.

But I’ve since changed my mind. I think for the good of the squad you have to have an idea of what is an acceptable standard for senior players in terms of their application in training, running stats etc. and stick to it.

Maybe Halil is a better player than NYC but what does it say to the group of players if they know you can come to Brentford be part of the squad even though you don’t put in 100% or you’re not in the best physical shape possible. Suddenly it becomes acceptable....
I don’t think we have any evidence he slacks off at training or is not in good shape. His natural game might not be one that fits us and his Dad may be pulling him towards Turkey but that’s different.
 

BFC1997

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I don’t think we have any evidence he slacks off at training or is not in good shape. His natural game might not be one that fits us and his Dad may be pulling him towards Turkey but that’s different.
I think unfortunately there’s plenty of evidence that he doesn’t do enough running off the ball.

Perhaps he’s a good trainer and in excellent shape and then just doesn’t replicate it on the pitch but I doubt it.

It’s frustrating because some of his dribbling and on the ball stuff is really excellent.
 

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I felt like this last season when Canos and Mbeumo were having tough runs and then Toney got injured.

But I’ve since changed my mind. I think for the good of the squad you have to have an idea of what is an acceptable standard for senior players in terms of their application in training, running stats etc. and stick to it.

Maybe Halil is a better player than NYC but what does it say to the group of players if they know you can come to Brentford be part of the squad even though you don’t put in 100% or you’re not in the best physical shape possible. Suddenly it becomes acceptable....
There’s no maybe about it. I like NYC but Halil was a regular starter in the Dutch League and is currently a regular for a Galatasaray side playing European football. NYC has never played a competitive game of football.
 

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There’s no maybe about it. I like NYC but Halil was a regular starter in the Dutch League and is currently a regular for a Galatasaray side playing European football. NYC has never played a competitive game of football.
Right! And still...
 

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I think unfortunately there’s plenty of evidence that he doesn’t do enough running off the ball.

Perhaps he’s a good trainer and in excellent shape and then just doesn’t replicate it on the pitch but I doubt it.

It’s frustrating because some of his dribbling and on the ball stuff is really excellent.
I think how players train and how they play don’t always match up. By all accounts McEachran was a keen and diligent trainer but, well you catch my drift. Halil might do the work but just play in a different way- it’s not a terrible thing but unhelpful. Many of us were critical of Moyes beating the need to press and work defensively into Said, who to his credit has done those hard yards and understood that succeeding at it and carrying it out in games is essential if he wants to play.

Solskjaer (or his replacement) is going to have to get some very fine attacking players indeed to knuckle down to contribute to defensive shape at least a bit. They probably do defensive drills and so on in training and don’t dissent from showing the effort, but it isn’t part of their on pitch game.

So Halil stands at a crossroads about how and where he’ll play. His way sees him playing for a massive club in his ancestral home country and for its national team, making his dad, friends and family proud. He could instead become an even bigger star on an even bigger stage by shining in the PL first, but that’s harder and less certain. There are times when my career has gone into the doldrums and I’ve wondered whether I shouldn’t have done things differently- volunteering to stay through the night to get that deal through rather than going off to the pub at 7 because sitting by a fax machine waiting for info that in fact I’d rightly predicted wouldn’t come until the next morning but the dullard who said yes got marked out for the promotion that set him onto now pulling in £700k. But in the end I’m not that guy and never needed the life or lack of that he led to his “success”. Being the next Toney would be our dream but not necessarily every player’s. And not just lazy ones- nobody would accuse Steve Bull of that but he followed a different dream.
 

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There’s no maybe about it. I like NYC but Halil was a regular starter in the Dutch League and is currently a regular for a Galatasaray side playing European football. NYC has never played a competitive game of football.
And one is happy to be our 5th choice option up top while the other wants game time to keep in his international squad.
 

BFC1997

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I think how players train and how they play don’t always match up. By all accounts McEachran was a keen and diligent trainer but, well you catch my drift. Halil might do the work but just play in a different way- it’s not a terrible thing but unhelpful. Many of us were critical of Moyes beating the need to press and work defensively into Said, who to his credit has done those hard yards and understood that succeeding at it and carrying it out in games is essential if he wants to play.

Solskjaer (or his replacement) is going to have to get some very fine attacking players indeed to knuckle down to contribute to defensive shape at least a bit. They probably do defensive drills and so on in training and don’t dissent from showing the effort, but it isn’t part of their on pitch game.

So Halil stands at a crossroads about how and where he’ll play. His way sees him playing for a massive club in his ancestral home country and for its national team, making his dad, friends and family proud. He could instead become an even bigger star on an even bigger stage by shining in the PL first, but that’s harder and less certain. There are times when my career has gone into the doldrums and I’ve wondered whether I shouldn’t have done things differently- volunteering to stay through the night to get that deal through rather than going off to the pub at 7 because sitting by a fax machine waiting for info that in fact I’d rightly predicted wouldn’t come until the next morning but the dullard who said yes got marked out for the promotion that set him onto now pulling in £700k. But in the end I’m not that guy and never needed the life or lack of that he led to his “success”. Being the next Toney would be our dream but not necessarily every player’s. And not just lazy ones- nobody would accuse Steve Bull of that but he followed a different dream.
Tbf I didn’t criticise Moyes at the time.

And I am not saying Dervisoglu is a bad player or doesn’t have a promising future following a different path. We signed him knowing what we were getting and obviously still see him as a financial asset or we’d have let him go permanently.

It’s just that if he wants to be an actual Brentford player in this setup he needs a different approach and I’d rather have a smaller squad of players that really buy into the require work ethic (and occasionally rely on players like NYC from the B team for games like Wednesdays) than carry players like Halil on the fringes and risk lowering the standard of what’s acceptable.
 

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By all accounts he’s continuing to do well at Galatasary.

Some of the dribbling is really exceptional and he’s popping up with the odd goal too.

The Süper Lig isn’t an amazing standard but he’s also performing well for Turkey and in the Europa League.

The most pleasing aspect though: he’s improving the physical and defensive side of his game.

Stats from whoscored:

42A06FCD-8CEF-49E8-89E4-6F344F96A69F.jpeg
 

rebus

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By all accounts he’s continuing to do well at Galatasary.

Some of the dribbling is really exceptional and he’s popping up with the odd goal too.

The Süper Lig isn’t an amazing standard but he’s also performing well for Turkey and in the Europa League.

The most pleasing aspect though: he’s improving the physical and defensive side of his game.

Stats from whoscored:

View attachment 28339
All moot as he’s never playing for us again.
 

rebus

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Probably, but not moot the better he does the higher his transfer value when we come to let him go.
He’ll probably leave on a Bosman and we’ll loan him out a couple more times to recoup our fees.
 

BFC1997

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He’ll probably leave on a Bosman and we’ll loan him out a couple more times to recoup our fees.
Ok, but we can still justify higher loan fees the better he performs 🤷‍♂️

Probably be a very good deal for whoever takes him on a bosman if that is how it pans out.
 
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