GONE Said Benrahma

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Voice from the Braemar

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should do business with proper respected clubs like villa who pay what they’re worth and it’s all out in the open and professionally handed.....whu are run by scheming crooks and will do everything to feck us about....I bet this is the hardest deal bfc have ever had to deal with ?
 

Gee Bee

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We might want the deal structured in such a way that if WHU get relegated and we get promoted, Benrahma comes back to us!!
 

Shamrock_Bee

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I'm sure lawyers will be all over this and there will be no hidden clauses that prevent Brentford receiving their money or allow West Ham to set up a try before you buy deal (you'd hope).

However one would have to be very naive not to believe West Ham have played a blinder. In the current financial climate; reduced revenues and no fans it isn't the best time to pay a large percentage of a £30million fee which would have been a requirement. Instead they waited, waited and waited and then in the last few hours said they need to check further things in the medical.

At the same time they'd showed the player his new wage packet and just at the right time suggested a loan arrangement. That way the player gets his payrise, they get the player and the fee can be paid when revenue streams have started again. Lets be honest we've been played and it's unlikely we'll receive a penny until Summer 2021. It might suit Brentford as they'll receive no ST money next season and it'll be a nice cheque to receive however to let an asset go and receive no money for a year when money is tight can't have been the plan. Whatever about West Ham's owners you can't deny they know business.
 

Houghton Bee

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I'm sure lawyers will be all over this and there will be no hidden clauses that prevent Brentford receiving their money or allow West Ham to set up a try before you buy deal (you'd hope).

However one would have to be very naive not to believe West Ham have played a blinder. In the current financial climate; reduced revenues and no fans it isn't the best time to pay a large percentage of a £30million fee which would have been a requirement. Instead they waited, waited and waited and then in the last few hours said they need to check further things in the medical.

At the same time they'd showed the player his new wage packet and just at the right time suggested a loan arrangement. That way the player gets his payrise, they get the player and the fee can be paid when revenue streams have started again. Lets be honest we've been played and it's unlikely we'll receive a penny until Summer 2021. It might suit Brentford as they'll receive no ST money next season and it'll be a nice cheque to receive however to let an asset go and receive no money for a year when money is tight can't have been the plan. Whatever about West Ham's owners you can't deny they know business.
Looks like we're getting £4m as a loan fee :)
 

Untouchable

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Not possible - once they edited out the swear words, it was only 20 seconds long.
**** off you ****ing West Ham *****. I’m going to take one of your dildos and shove it up your ****ing arse and choke you the **** to death with it. *****.

Something like that.
 

Gazza Bee

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I'm sure lawyers will be all over this and there will be no hidden clauses that prevent Brentford receiving their money or allow West Ham to set up a try before you buy deal (you'd hope).

However one would have to be very naive not to believe West Ham have played a blinder. In the current financial climate; reduced revenues and no fans it isn't the best time to pay a large percentage of a £30million fee which would have been a requirement. Instead they waited, waited and waited and then in the last few hours said they need to check further things in the medical.

At the same time they'd showed the player his new wage packet and just at the right time suggested a loan arrangement. That way the player gets his payrise, they get the player and the fee can be paid when revenue streams have started again. Lets be honest we've been played and it's unlikely we'll receive a penny until Summer 2021. It might suit Brentford as they'll receive no ST money next season and it'll be a nice cheque to receive however to let an asset go and receive no money for a year when money is tight can't have been the plan. Whatever about West Ham's owners you can't deny they know business.
Read Bananas post please - this is what I suspect is nearer the truth
 

Wise old Bee

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Presumably he remains an asset on the BFC balance sheet until WH pay up and that could be borrowed against etc. I'm not an accountant, clearly, but this is reasonable enough no?
 

Doovster

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To be honest this is a transfer where no one comes out looking particularly good.
Don't agree. If we get the £4M loan fee as reported, that's probably not that short of getting the £25M which would probably have been paid in 4 or 5 instalments anyway, so from a cashflow perspective we're not that down on where we probably would have been anyway.
 

jbee

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I'm sure lawyers will be all over this and there will be no hidden clauses that prevent Brentford receiving their money or allow West Ham to set up a try before you buy deal (you'd hope).

However one would have to be very naive not to believe West Ham have played a blinder. In the current financial climate; reduced revenues and no fans it isn't the best time to pay a large percentage of a £30million fee which would have been a requirement. Instead they waited, waited and waited and then in the last few hours said they need to check further things in the medical.

At the same time they'd showed the player his new wage packet and just at the right time suggested a loan arrangement. That way the player gets his payrise, they get the player and the fee can be paid when revenue streams have started again. Lets be honest we've been played and it's unlikely we'll receive a penny until Summer 2021. It might suit Brentford as they'll receive no ST money next season and it'll be a nice cheque to receive however to let an asset go and receive no money for a year when money is tight can't have been the plan. Whatever about West Ham's owners you can't deny they know business.
We don't need the money now, no difference to us if it is a loan with an obligation. I've no idea what West Ham are playing at but they are chancers not master strategists.
 

Doovster

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Presumably he remains an asset on the BFC balance sheet until WH pay up and that could be borrowed against etc. I'm not an accountant, clearly, but this is reasonable enough no?
I don't think many banks would lend against a footballer to be fair....
 

Invipai

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So...what happens if his 'issue' stays fine, but he has a leg break? Would that then also mean the deal doesn't become permanent?
 

Twickenhamben

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West Ham use an agent called Will Salthouse as a key part of their recruitment. Unless I am a
Don't agree. If we get the £4M loan fee as reported, that's probably not that short of getting the £25M which would probably have been paid in 4 or 5 instalments anyway, so from a cashflow perspective we're not that down on where we probably would have been anyway.
Hadn’t thought of it like that
 

Houghton Bee

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If this deal gets done, current understanding between West Ham and Brentford is that the only way the loan would not become an obligation to buy (and revert to a straight loan) is if the medical issue develops into something unexpectedly extreme @TheAthleticUK #WHUFC #BrentfordFC


you can bet your last pound that West Ham will think it's severe next summer if he flops or they haven't got the funds to meet the fees.
 

davebee

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If this deal gets done, current understanding between West Ham and Brentford is that the only way the loan would not become an obligation to buy (and revert to a straight loan) is if the medical issue develops into something unexpectedly extreme @TheAthleticUK #WHUFC #BrentfordFC

So in an Emiliano Sala type situation (god forbid) West Ham would be off the hook?
 

jbee

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If this deal gets done, current understanding between West Ham and Brentford is that the only way the loan would not become an obligation to buy (and revert to a straight loan) is if the medical issue develops into something unexpectedly extreme @TheAthleticUK #WHUFC #BrentfordFC

Said better hope he does well then or expect Sullivan and his goons at his door in January. "Wouldn't it be a shame if your medical issue became unexpectedly extreme" *strokes baseball bat*
 

Shamrock_Bee

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Looks like we're getting £4m as a loan fee :)
I'd strongly suspect that £4million will not be additional money. It's more likely to come off the final fee; nobody will know for sure what has went on but if our board admit it or not they can't be happy. Even if WHU pay us £4million now that is small change for a player of SB's quality, I do think WHU planned this especially as we know how reluctant their owners are to spend money. Where they ever going to pay us the upfront fee we'd asked for!? I don't think they were so smart business minds came together to get Moyes the player for peanuts this transfer window and give themselves space to pay us next summer. I do believe we'll get our money but it's hard not to acknowledge their business planning.
 

gbems92

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I know said is abit flash but flying back to brentford to say goodbye to everyone from east london? I dont think so
 

TBEE

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If this deal gets done, current understanding between West Ham and Brentford is that the only way the loan would not become an obligation to buy (and revert to a straight loan) is if the medical issue develops into something unexpectedly extreme @TheAthleticUK #WHUFC #BrentfordFC

Don't like this medical clause at all. If Said gets some other condition or injury, they can then claim that the medical issue they identified was a contributing factor or hampering his recovery and walk away from the deal. Or worse still, there's nothing wrong with him and they claim that he's showing signs of lethargy as he's not tracking back!! You can't have a clause in a contract like this that is subject to judgement. Don't do it Brentford. Bring him home, play till the end of the year and generate interest from proper clubs.
 

Gee Bee

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So...what happens if his 'issue' stays fine, but he has a leg break? Would that then also mean the deal doesn't become permanent?
I'm sure they'll buy some sort of insurance policy to cover long term injuries. All Premier league clubs do, I know who the Broker is.
 

Mr Cynical

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I'll look at 5.00 at the score, I can't believe we have got those 3 starting again. No signings with your most important player out until xmas. We just focused on getting Said out. I would have taken Hurlock back over Jenson playing defensive midfield again. Hope we win tomorrow but very disappointed with this window.
We'll be absolutely fine.
So in an Emiliano Sala type situation (god forbid) West Ham would be off the hook?
No, I imagine it means the issue with the medical (whatever that was) developed into something more significant
 

Andrelux

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To be honest this is a transfer where no one comes out looking particularly good.
I dunno - Brentford bean counters might look at it and go OK, lawyers might be tying up the loose ends. If it is 4mill + 21 mill + 5 mill, then it is pretty much bang on what we were hoping for (25m +5m, and it was only ever going to be paid in installments).
So, as long as we get what we wanted (and as I said, lawyers are probably crawling all over this), then the optics don't matter.

WHU ask BFC to reformat the deal, but it ends up being pretty much what we'd hoped for, with a few alterations in wording. First year is pretty much the same but a loan fee rather than the first installment. So what? If they try and project it as having got one over on us, then neither us, nor their fans, will buy it.

But, you know, let them claim that. You have to leave the loser with his dignity.
 

Adam

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If this deal gets done, current understanding between West Ham and Brentford is that the only way the loan would not become an obligation to buy (and revert to a straight loan) is if the medical issue develops into something unexpectedly extreme @TheAthleticUK #WHUFC #BrentfordFC

How extreme? Dead? Seems ambiguous, which I’m sure WHUs lawyers will be all over if he doesn’t have a good season. Say it’s a heart issue, they could claim poor form due to lack of fitness resulting from the heart condition.
 

bees1984

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I would imagine the medical issue becoming severe will be in relation to the 'issue' that is connected to this medical. Would be very risky if it is any medical issue that crops up. Be interesting to see who conducts the medical before it is made permanent. I have faith that we will be aware of potential sh*thousery from West Ham
 

Jay Bee

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Presumably he remains an asset on the BFC balance sheet until WH pay up and that could be borrowed against etc. I'm not an accountant, clearly, but this is reasonable enough no?
If he's 99.9% gone his contract will not be on our balance sheet any more. But the cash that we are 99.9% due to receive for him will be an asset on the balance sheet, debtors owed to us. So I wouldn't worry about that.
 

Jay Bee

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I would imagine the medical issue becoming severe will be in relation to the 'issue' that is connected to this medical. Would be very risky if it is any medical issue that crops up. Be interesting to see who conducts the medical before it is made permanent. I have faith that we will be aware of potential sh*thousery from West Ham
Indeed and it will be part of our side of the legal agreement to ensure that wording leaves as little room for interpretation as possible and also the deal gets sealed ASAP once he can complete the necessary checks (not in 9 months time when he could have unrelated injuries etc).
 

Twickenhamben

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Genuinely don’t think this is a good move for Said (outside of the obvious financial benefits). There’s clearly tension between Moyes and the owners over transfers. Moyes wants full control, the owners like to get input from an agent called Will Salthouse (from what I have read).

Surprise suprise Salthouse seems to represent Said Benrahama. So his agent is pushing for this deal yet Moyes seems underwhelmed. I can’t see Moyes going anywhere so Said becomes a bit part player this season and fails to really show his worth. We then end up getting £25m next June for a player whose made 10 starts and 15 sub appearances, Said then ends up at a club in France for about £15m....
 

hypa123

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If words have a meaning - and in contract law every word has a meaning - an obligation to buy is an obligation to buy under the terms agreed, and is legally binding. If Benrahma were to suffer an injury that put him out of the game for six months, a year or even more, the obligation to buy at the agreed price remains.
 

Shamrock_Bee

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Indeed and it will be part of our side of the legal agreement to ensure that wording leaves as little room for interpretation as possible and also the deal gets sealed ASAP once he can complete the necessary checks (not in 9 months time when he could have unrelated injuries etc).
I don't trust West Ham; I do trust our board will have strong lawyers to ensure everything is in order. However as I mentioned on the thread earlier I think West Ham have planned this whole situation; we have to be very careful they don't insert hidden clauses in case he flops with them or they don't fancy the player in 9 months. Even the mention of potential get out clauses linked to medicals etc is already ringing alarm bells and the deal isn't even completed yet.
 

Twickenhamben

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I don't trust West Ham; I do trust our board will have strong lawyers to ensure everything is in order. However as I mentioned on the thread earlier I think West Ham have planned this whole situation; we have to be very careful they don't insert hidden clauses in case he flops with them or they don't fancy the player in 9 months. Even the mention of potential get out clauses linked to medicals etc is already ringing alarm bells and the deal isn't even completed yet.
Perhaps the deal doesn’t go through because our lawyers don’t like the terms?
 

Twickbee

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I am quite sure Phil and the team will not have agreed to anything detrimental to BFC.

But having the day off from work today and dipping in and out of Sky Sports news more than a few times, it has made me chuckle to see little old Brentford dominating the transfer deadline headlines.

How times have changed 😀

I think some posters on this thread could do with re-winding less than 10 years and putting things in to a bit more perspective.
 

Leedsbee

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The answer is probably no but could we still sell Said to someone else in a year if we get a much bigger offer?
 

BeehindU

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I think most of us would have been a lot more calmer about this if (a) it was virtually any other club than West Ham, and (b) if this had all happened a few weeks and not a few hours ago. You can’t help but feel we’ve been played, whatever the advantages to the club are of this last-minute new arrangement.
 

TadB

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That is closed, a fine needs paying.

So if the player doesn't pay his fine we can get out of an obligation to buy? Please explain?
It is not a fine and it is not closed. It is eye watering compensation due to the aggrieved club and Ghoddas has said he will not pay it. It is being appealed. It in no way relates to the Benrahma transfer/loan
 

Old B

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Does it matter if he went today, last week or last month, since the end of the play offs we have assumed he will be off, really don’t get all the bed wetting on why is it a loan, do any of you have any knowledge about football contracts? Do any of you seriously think the Bees DoFs are out of there depth? I suppose London to High is taking it’s toll.
 

Houghton Bee

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Does it matter if he went today, last week or last month, since the end of the play offs we have assumed he will be off, really don’t get all the bed wetting on why is it a loan, do any of you have any knowledge about football contracts? Do any of you seriously think the Bees DoFs are out of there depth? I suppose London to High is taking it’s toll.
It's a simple lack of confidence in West Ham to fulfil their obligations with their current regime. Not a slight on Brentford, we've been backed into a corner. If it all goes to plan and we get the full £4m now, £21m in the summer and hopefully all of the add-ons then happy days. But it's painfully obvious that West Ham will try and find the slightest out they can next summer if Said flops, picks up an injury or West Ham lack funds.

I seriously doubt BFC are happy how this has played out, assuming this loan deal is the one that goes through.
 

FJBee

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Latest word on the West Ham fan twitter accounts is apparently there isn't even an obligation anymore...
 

Peteseeger

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There are far too many people reading too much into rumour, speculation and conjecture. I am so glad I am not on twitter. I will remain blissful in my ignorance.
 
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