Team versus Carlisle

finsbury_bee

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---------------- Grigg --------------------

Judge ------- Forshaw ----- Donaldson

----- McCormack --- Douglas ----------

Bidwell --- Craig --- Dean --- Yennaris

---------------- Button -------------------

Subs: Lee, Tarkowski, O'Connor, Reeves, Saville, Dallas

A bit more solid in midfield off the back of a defeat, as well as being away at a place we've not always done well at.

Can't see Warbs going for this, and i'd be much more comfortable with Logan at right back, but we'd win the midfield battle with this set-up.

Straight back to winning ways, especially as in a few hours we may have Preston breathing down our neck.
 

Bridge Bee

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I'd go with that. If Yennaris isn't good enough to play we shouldn't have shipped out Logan.

Alan Mac in midfield is a must. He isn't as good a passer as Saville but think he'd get forward and create just as much. Have thought Saville has started to look leggy recently too, which is understandable seeing as it's his first full season.

Warbs talks about it being a squad game and this weekend will show where our squad is at.
 

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I go along with everything that has been said so far here. I note that Grigg, Yennaris and Tarkowski all played for the Development Squad today and were all taken off on the hour. Could they all have been preparing for Saturday? Tarkowski particularly received praise on the OS, I think we will see him in the first team sooner rather than later.
 

jlove

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I'm not sure why we would change formation; high risk as we've not played that before.
 

beeherenow

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Grigg for trotta other than that I wouldn't change a team that's lost one game in 20, no need for drastic changes after one defeat.
 
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Grigg for trotta other than that I wouldn't change a team that's lost one game in 20, no need for drastic changes after one defeat.

:imwith:
 

ade211

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This may be somewhat controversial but Tarkowwski for Dean. We are conceding too many and while a new formation could help I am not convinced that Dean is back to where he was prior to his injury. If Trotta away then Grigg. I haven't noticed Saville's performance deteriorate recently but he may have to go on the bench to allow McCormack play in mid field, freeing space for Yennaris to play.

On the other hand same starting 11 except Grigg for Trotta. I think this will happen as this is Warburton's approach . So he will believe there is no need to tinker. If we lose then perhaps more changes. So on balance that is what we will start with.
 
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finsbury_bee

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I'm not sure why we would change formation; high risk as we've not played that before.

Pretty sure we have played this formation before. I take your point, but I'd also be concerned if we are only capable of playing one formation. Besides, it's hardly a major change swapping McCormack for Saville and being a bit more solid in front of the back four.
 

Bridge Bee

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Pretty sure we have played this formation before. I take your point, but I'd also be concerned if we are only capable of playing one formation. Besides, it's hardly a major change swapping McCormack for Saville and being a bit more solid in front of the back four.

It's much of a muchness. We know we'll have one central striker and 2 wide players who make it 3 up front when attacking and 5 in midfield when defending.
 

jlove

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We've not played 4-2-3-1 (Wolves' formation, btw) with 2 holding midfielders. We play a high pressing game with our forward 3; as I wrote, it just seems high risk and an over-reaction to last weekend. Keep calm, play Grigg, carry on.
 

Boston Bee

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While knowing it would/won't happen, I'd love to see Donaldson pair Grigg up front. 4-4-2 is highly out of fashion but I think fitting players into a system is less wise than fitting the system around your players.


--------- Grigg Donaldson--------------

Judge ------- Forshaw ----- Dallas/Savlle

-------------- Douglas ----------

Bidwell --- Craig --- Dean --- McCormack

---------------- Button -------------------

Before the critiques: Yes, I know it won't happen.
 

Buzzettesfriend

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This may be somewhat controversial but Tarkowwski for Dean. We are conceding too many and while a new formation could help I am not convinced that Dean is back to where he was prior to his injury. If Trotta away then Grigg. I haven't noticed Saville's performance deteriorate recently but he may have to go on the bench to allow McCormack play in mid field, freeing space for Yennaris to play.

On the other hand same starting 11 except Grigg for Trotta. I think this will happen as this is Warburton's approach . So he will believe there is no need to tinker. If we lose then perhaps more changes. So on balance that is what we will start with.
He had a poor game on Saturday but it's worth remembering we all urged him back from injury throughout the whole of January, and I'm not sure if yet be looking to break up a CB partnership that has played at the top of league 1 for us for the last 2 seasons.
 

Keighley Bee

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I'm not sure why we would change formation; high risk as we've not played that before.

Mac and JD have played in the same midfield before (including in the 19 game unbeaten run). When one sat, the other was free to bomb forward; I seem to recall JD commenting how much he enjoyed it. No change of formation need be involved, but the midfield gets a bit more bite. It would have been my midfield of choice against Wolves. The only question now, since we no longer have the option of Logan, is how would Yennaris perform at RB?
 
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Mac and JD have played in the same midfield before (including in the 19 game unbeaten run). When one sat, the other was free to bomb forward; I seem to recall JD commenting how much he enjoyed it. No change of formation need be involved, but the midfield gets a bit more bite. It would have been my midfield of choice against Wolves. The only question now, since we no longer have the option of Logan, is how would Yennaris perform at RB?

McCormack certainly seemed to want to get involved in the middle. :yes: :box:
 

Artixbee

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---------------- Grigg --------------------

Judge ------- Forshaw ----- Donaldson

----- McCormack --- Douglas ----------

Bidwell --- Craig --- Dean --- Yennaris

---------------- Button -------------------

Subs: Lee, Tarkowski, O'Connor, Reeves, Saville, Dallas

A bit more solid in midfield off the back of a defeat, as well as being away at a place we've not always done well at.

Can't see Warbs going for this, and i'd be much more comfortable with Logan at right back, but we'd win the midfield battle with this set-up.

Straight back to winning ways, especially as in a few hours we may have Preston breathing down our neck.

Only 6 players on the bench?
 

thenightfly

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Lee, please. button could have saved all of those goals IMHO. He had a mare Saturday.

Drop donaldson, give him a rest.
 

grepo

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Did they beat Millwall? Can't find the result just the pictures with one celebration. How did Tarka the Otter play?
I go along with everything that has been said so far here. I note that Grigg, Yennaris and Tarkowski all played for the Development Squad today and were all taken off on the hour. Could they all have been preparing for Saturday? Tarkowski particularly received praise on the OS, I think we will see him in the first team sooner rather than later.
 

shouldbee

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Grigg for trotta other than that I wouldn't change a team that's lost one game in 20, no need for drastic changes after one defeat.


I agree no need for drastic changes, but every week on BP MW says " you don't win anything with eleven players, it's a squad game"......so Mr W now practice this ?

Button

Nico Tarkowski Craig Bidwell

Clayton Adam Macca Dougie Judge

Will

Subs: to include : Harlee, Sav, Reeves , Dallas + whoever's not out on loan
 

Bangor Bee

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This may be somewhat controversial but Tarkowwski for Dean. We are conceding too many and while a new formation could help I am not convinced that Dean is back to where he was prior to his injury. If Trotta away then Grigg. I haven't noticed Saville's performance deteriorate recently but he may have to go on the bench to allow McCormack play in mid field, freeing space for Yennaris to play.

While I certainly don't agree with putting Saville on the bench, I do agree about bringing in Tarkowski for Dean. Harlee looked sluggish at Shrewsbury, and perhaps even a bit overweight. He was better against Crewe but by all accounts poor against Wolves. We've kept (I think) one clean sheet in ten: nowhere near good enough for a side looking for automatic promotion (admittedly our usual centre back pairing was not available for all of these games). Tarkowski comes with an excellent reputation, fully warranted by the limited amount I've seen of him, so I feel under the circumstances he should be integrated sooner than might have been expected. He will definitely add to our game going forward.
 

wanderer paul

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I'm also unconvinced by Button. Maybe a idea to give Lee a go !!

More diatribe. Button has performed very well over the last 20 odd games. After watching the Wolves 2nd goal again, I don't think he could've got to it first, so no blame from me. He is so assured when receiving the ball, he acts as an 11th outfield player. Lee is nowhere near Button's ability in distributing the ball, his long kicks are excellent and 9 times out of 10 are on the toe or head of the player he is directing the pass to. Lee will have to wait. If he ever gets another chance.
 

Eieieio

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I'd really like to have a go for this one. Although only 5''6 I reckon I could do a job up front.


Edit - as long as that job isn't scoring any goals.
 
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jlove

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While I would like to see Tarkowski and Yannaris start a game, it would be very risky to start them both, particularly with Donaldson in front of them.
 
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Button is integral to the way we play.

Our game is all about keeping possession and probing for gaps and Button's ability to pass the ball accurately both long and short ensures that our ball retention levels are high and we are not fighting for possession from hoofs down the middle
 

shouldbee

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While I would like to see Tarkowski and Yannaris start a game, it would be very risky to start them both, particularly with Donaldson in front of them.

Yes maybe but, If Yannaris isn't ready for first team selection why did we get rid of Shay ?...
 

alexcavell

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While I certainly don't agree with putting Saville on the bench, I do agree about bringing in Tarkowski for Dean. Harlee looked sluggish at Shrewsbury, and perhaps even a bit overweight. He was better against Crewe but by all accounts poor against Wolves. We've kept (I think) one clean sheet in ten: nowhere near good enough for a side looking for automatic promotion (admittedly our usual centre back pairing was not available for all of these games). Tarkowski comes with an excellent reputation, fully warranted by the limited amount I've seen of him, so I feel under the circumstances he should be integrated sooner than might have been expected. He will definitely add to our game going forward.

I'd probably give Harlee another couple of games before considering leaving him out, but there's also an argument that O'Connor shouldn't have been dropped to make way for him on his return in the first place, so maybe Kev should be given the nod ahead of Tarkowski in such a situation?

For the Carlisle match I'd go with the same team, but Grigg in for Trotta (and Fillo on the bench - if not fit then Oyeleke).
 

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More diatribe. Button has performed very well over the last 20 odd games. After watching the Wolves 2nd goal again, I don't think he could've got to it first, so no blame from me. He is so assured when receiving the ball, he acts as an 11th outfield player. Lee is nowhere near Button's ability in distributing the ball, his long kicks are excellent and 9 times out of 10 are on the toe or head of the player he is directing the pass to. Lee will have to wait. If he ever gets another chance.

I'm not always been a Button fan but to have any kind of debate about his position as No.1 after Saturday is ridiculous, he has played a solid role in our unbeaten run and people rightly laud his distribution as being important to the side. Still think Lee is the better shot stopper and command of his box and positional sense/decision making is better than Button's but the latter is still young and learning. Button is without doubt a better 'sweeper' keeper than Lee and deserves to retain his place at the current time.

Ps re second goal I do disagree and believe if Button had not have hesitate he would have got their after the blokes heavy furst touch, that is not to say he was responsible for the goal as the middle of our defence parted like the red sea with Harlee playing the role of the Pharaoh.
 

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Grigg for trotta other than that I wouldn't change a team that's lost one game in 20, no need for drastic changes after one defeat.

No need for drastic changes indeed, but a lot depends on the pitch. We struggled given the heaviness of the GP surface on Saturday, so I would consider Mac for Sav or even Forshaw to add tenacity in the middle, with Douglas sitting. However, I would be much more confident suggesting this if I knew what Yennaris is like!
 

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Agree with the comments about Yennaris and loaning Logan out. I think we really need to control the midfield and hit them on the counter when they do attack. Mac's midfield drive is crucial to that.

I want to start by making shooting opportunities for Grigg and Donaldson. Zero chances for Donaldson on Saturday who hasn't scored in a while now..
 

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Grigg for trotta other than that I wouldn't change a team that's lost one game in 20, no need for drastic changes after one defeat.

It could perhaps be said that this post is based on a false premise. The same team did not play in the 20 games mentioned. At various times Sam Saunders, Toumani Diagouraga. Farid El Alagui, Khadim Harris, Shaleum Logan, Kevin O'Connor, Stuart Dallas, Richard Lee, Jake Reeves, Will Grigg have made significant contributions to the successful run. As Mark Warburton regularly emphasises - it is a squad game these days.
 

garybee99

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Button
Yanaris. Dean. Craig. Bidwell
Dougie
Donaldson Macormack. Saville judge
Grigg

Subs
Lee, Tarkowski, Forshaw, Dallas, Fillo, new loan cf if possible if not kev
 

nick logan

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I'd go with that. If Yennaris isn't good enough to play we shouldn't have shipped out Logan.

Alan Mac in midfield is a must. He isn't as good a passer as Saville but think he'd get forward and create just as much. Have thought Saville has started to look leggy recently too, which is understandable seeing as it's his first full season.

Warbs talks about it being a squad game and this weekend will show where our squad is at.

He didnt look leggy at Crewe where i thought he was brilliant
 

jlove

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Yes maybe but, If Yannaris isn't ready for first team selection why did we get rid of Shay ?...
I wasn't suggesting he was not ready, I'm saying that two new players together in the RHS of defence is very risky; I'd prefer that each new player is supported and surrounded by players who know each other and the way we play.
 

RoyBee

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Button
Yanaris. Dean. Craig. Bidwell
Dougie
Donaldson Macormack. Saville judge
Grigg

Subs
Lee, Tarkowski, Forshaw, Dallas, Fillo, new loan cf if possible if not kev

Swap Forshaw for Saville and I'd go with that. On the big assumption that Yennaris must be good enough otherwise loaning out Shay was a huge mistake.
 

nick logan

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Button
Yanaris. Dean. Craig. Bidwell
Dougie
Donaldson Macormack. Saville judge
Grigg

Subs
Lee, Tarkowski, Forshaw, Dallas, Fillo, new loan cf if possible if not kev

No Adam ? and why would we need 2 centre backs on the bench
 
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It will just be Grigg coming in for Trotta (due to international duty). The rest will remain unchanged.
 

garybee99

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Think the side needs a little shake up with just a tweak or two here and there and with Adam coming back from injury I felt it best that he could come on last 30 mins or so to influence the game more and continue with his fitness.i don't want him to suffer through injury at the end of the season by rushing him back now and we could miss saville with 10 bookings soon. I also feel Macormack in midfield would press them more and give us the impetus. I also feel that with certain min subs of Farid Logan and Toums on loan and in view that the bread man has had kev and tarkowski on the bench recently he feels 2 ch are possibly also necessary. I feel that Dallas has a role to play in the game and if he could produce a moment like he did at peterboro then it would be worth his inclusion as a sub late on. It won't be easy having lost there in the cup but feel our players will be at the next level come Saturday. We are a wonderful side with good players so no reason why we cant win the game. Come on you bees
 

nick logan

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Yes maybe but, If Yannaris isn't ready for first team selection why did we get rid of Shay ?...

He is ready, he played at shrews and got a knock, also Warbs prefers Mac at RB
 

beeherenow

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It could perhaps be said that this post is based on a false premise. The same team did not play in the 20 games mentioned. At various times Sam Saunders, Toumani Diagouraga. Farid El Alagui, Khadim Harris, Shaleum Logan, Kevin O'Connor, Stuart Dallas, Richard Lee, Jake Reeves, Will Grigg have made significant contributions to the successful run. As Mark Warburton regularly emphasises - it is a squad game these days.

They've all had their part to play but barring injury or suspension this has been the side that's been winning, obviously judge only came into the fold recently but my point is you wouldn't start tinkering with what is probably our strongest team just because we lost one game.
 

shouldbee

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They've all had their part to play but barring injury or suspension this has been the side that's been winning, obviously judge only came into the fold recently but my point is you wouldn't start tinkering with what is probably our strongest team just because we lost one game.

But the quote our leader " As I've said many times you cannot win things with 11 or even 14 players, it's a squad game" .......ahhhhhh !!!!! :mad1:
 

beeherenow

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But the quote our leader " As I've said many times you cannot win things with 11 or even 14 players, it's a squad game" .......ahhhhhh !!!!! :mad1:

Yes I agree but this thread is 'team v Carlisle so that's the team I think should start?
 

Eieieio

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i wish Farid was here and playing instead of Grigg. oh well, I'll cheer on whoever plays.
 

alexcavell

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i wish Farid was here and playing instead of Grigg. oh well, I'll cheer on whoever plays.

Grigg played well in the central striker role away at Notts County and hasn't been given much of a chance in that position since. He's a good forward when used correctly, and I'm confident he'll do well for us.
 

Eieieio

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Grigg played well in the central striker role away at Notts County and hasn't been given much of a chance in that position since. He's a good forward when used correctly, and I'm confident he'll do well for us.

Fair. Well, hopefully he can make the chance count (if he gets it).
 
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