Unsuccessful signings in the Benham Era? (1 Viewer)

Ealing Bee

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It was with enormous amusement that I read that a mere 18 months after signing Sebastien Haller from Frankfurt for £45m, WHU have had to punt him out to Ajax for £20m. During his time with the Hammers, he managed a grand total of 14 goals in 54 games (10 in 48 PL):
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/55576847

Worse still (better, actually :ROFLMAO:), the reasons given for binning him were that he "did not fit the template manager David Moyes wanted... ... [nor had he] shown a desire to adjust to it." That, of course, is the same David Moyes whom WHU recruited in a desperate relegation battle in November 2017, discarded 6 months later after he'd done the job required of him, then re-appointed again in December 2019.

Now I know that Bees have signed players who simply didn't work out and then had to get rid of them at a loss etc. But I doubt that any of them can ever have had the disastrous effect on BFC's transfer kitty that Haller has had on WHU's, whereby instead of having £45m to spend on new players, Moyes now has less than half of that (assuming the Dildo Brothers really do give him the full amount received from Ajax).

I wonder who "cost" us the most?
 

wanderer paul

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Hofmann, Bjelland, McEachrane and Valencia.

To name four.
 

wanderer paul

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Mokotjo, MacLeod and Proschwitz (or whatever the spelling is?)
 

jlove

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Given that BFC was linked with Haller prior to him joining WHU, it may be that we made a better assessment of his fit.
 

wanderer paul

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All cost fees and wages. Nothing in return. Unless Valencia is sold for something?!
 
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Ealing Bee

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I guess there have been a few when you add them up - it's easy how you forget (or me, at least!).

But I'm not sure if any has had such a catastrophic effect* on Bees' finances as the likes of Haller has on WHU's, or even come close, which is what I'm wondering about.

Remember, Gold/Sullivan/Brady took over WHU in January 2010, just two months before Mr. Benham did at Brentford.

Talk about "slow learners" :ROFLMAO:




* - And all that's before considering the enormous profits we've made on the many transfer successes.
 

mhead bee

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I guess there have been a few when you add them up - it's easy how you forget (or me, at least!).

But I'm not sure if any has had such a catastrophic effect* on Bees' finances as the likes of Haller has on WHU's, or even come close, which is what I'm wondering about.

Remember, Gold/Sullivan/Brady took over WHU in January 2010, just two months before Mr. Benham did at Brentford.

Talk about "slow learners" :ROFLMAO:




* - And all that's before considering the enormous profits we've made on the many transfer successes.

They probably have only paid a fraction of the 40M so far so the debt gets passed onto the new owner and they are only a bit out of pocket.

The reality is the bloke is proper rubbish and 40M, wow, he isn't fit lace Watkins boots.
 

jlove

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It's a percentage game and, in a percentage game, if you're right more than 51% of the time, you're doing OK. I'd say we're way above the 51%.
 

Isleworth_Bee

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Hofmann, Bjelland, McEachrane and Valencia.

To name four.
I think that ones a touch harsh WP. Yes we missed a lot of his time through injury. But when he was in the side he performed well and was integral in the development of Mepham.

I guess he cost us a fiar penny in wages but i dont think he let us down.
 

wanderer paul

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I think that ones a touch harsh WP. Yes we missed a lot of his time through injury. But when he was in the side he performed well and was integral in the development of Mepham.

I guess he cost us a fiar penny in wages but i dont think he let us down.
Cost £2.5m in a fee. Plus whatever he was earning. Then leaves for nothing. Certainly up there as the one who the Club hasn’t had a good return on.
 
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Ealing Bee

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They probably have only paid a fraction of the 40M so far so the debt gets passed onto the new owner and they are only a bit out of pocket.
Are you saying that as well as £20m to WHU, Ajax also have to pay a wedge to Frankfurt? Unless I've misread you, that surely cannot be.

The reality is the bloke is proper rubbish and 40M, wow, he isn't fit lace Watkins boots.
I expect you've got that right - though it would be highly amusing if he now scores a bucket-load for Ajax! :ROFLMAO:
 

AndyS

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Hofmann, Bjelland, McEachrane and Valencia.
To name four.
Mokotjo, MacLeod and Proschwitz (or whatever the spelling is?)
Not sure I'd include Bjelland, who I think we bought to get some experience in the back line and who gave some good service, or Mokotjo, who also did well for us at the level we were at then. I do think McEachrane was a big disappointment as was MacLeod although neither had much luck with injuries.
 

Sultan

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Heard we paid a good few quid for Jan Holldack.
 

8corner

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Cost £2.5m in a fee. Plus whatever he was earning. Then leaves for nothing. Certainly up there as the one who the Club hasn’t had a good return on.
I'd definitely exclude Bjellend Wanderer. He suffered an injury that meant we probably, sadly, never saw the best of him yet he was still a quality player for us and imho we wouldn't have got anywhere near the fee we did for Mepham that we did (as he would not have developed to the same extent so quickly)
 

Mulitinovic

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Are you saying that as well as £20m to WHU, Ajax also have to pay a wedge to Frankfurt? Unless I've misread you, that surely cannot be.

I expect you've got that right - though it would be highly amusing if he now scores a bucket-load for Ajax! :ROFLMAO:
Aside from PSV most League One strikers could score a bucket load in the Eredivisie
 

wanderer paul

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Bjelland was class
That’s not the point.

It’s a player who cost money and no return on him.

They all are.

Im not questioning their abilities.
 

wanderer paul

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Not sure I'd include Bjelland, who I think we bought to get some experience in the back line and who gave some good service, or Mokotjo, who also did well for us at the level we were at then. I do think McEachrane was a big disappointment as was MacLeod although neither had much luck with injuries.
Oh dear.......................
 

wanderer paul

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I'd definitely exclude Bjellend Wanderer. He suffered an injury that meant we probably, sadly, never saw the best of him yet he was still a quality player for us and imho we wouldn't have got anywhere near the fee we did for Mepham that we did (as he would not have developed to the same extent so quickly)
As above.

Im not questioning their abilities. It’s highlighting players who have cost money and Brentford haven’t had a return on.....

Do I need to say that?
 

Indian Bee

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Cost £2.5m in a fee. Plus whatever he was earning. Then leaves for nothing. Certainly up there as the one who the Club hasn’t had a good return on.
[/QUOTE

That’s not the point.

It’s a player who cost money and no return on him.

They all are.

Im not questioning their abilities.
But isn’t the return also linked to the developmental of Meps by playing alongside him? How much did we sell him for.

Not sure it was also his fault being injured by the awful pitch we had at the time !
 

8corner

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As above.

Im not questioning their abilities. It’s highlighting players who have cost money and Brentford haven’t had a return on.....

Do I need to say that?
No you don't but
a) The title of the thread is "Unsuccessful signings..."
b) My point was that I believe we indirectly got a return on Bjellend through the fee we got for Mepham (as AB was hugely influential in making him the player he was)
 
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Ealing Bee

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Every half decent striker scores a bucket load in the Eredivsion.
Aside from PSV most League One strikers could score a bucket load in the Eredivisie
Fair enough, except that Haller's wiki page states he scored 24 goals in 60 Bundesliga games for Frankfurt, incl:

"In the 2018–19 Bundesliga season, he scored 15 league goals in 29 appearances as the club finished seventh. In addition to his goals scored, he also made nine assists, so was involved in 24 goals, a figure only beaten in the 2018–19 season by Robert Lewandowski with 29."

None too shabby, esp since he was in his early-mid 20's
 
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Leonardo

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Tebar comes to mind. Although I think Frank would have got him to fit in
 

JANORAK

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I echo the comments re: Bjelland’s influence on Mepham.
The problem with subjects like this is we’ve generally only got a rough idea of what was paid and received. For example, I’ve no clue as to whether we got our money back on Jota?
What about the other side of the coin? Those players (not stars), whose BFC career is done/petering out, yet we got surprisingly decent returns overall (add ons)? Toums, Dallas, Goggia, Dean, Egan, Yennaris, Yearwood, Mawson...
 

jlove

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Tebar comes to mind. Although I think Frank would have got him to fit in
He'd have done well enough for us if he hadn't tried to give the manager the benefit of his experience as a midfielder.
 

mhead bee

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Are you saying that as well as £20m to WHU, Ajax also have to pay a wedge to Frankfurt? Unless I've misread you, that surely cannot be.

I expect you've got that right - though it would be highly amusing if he now scores a bucket-load for Ajax! :ROFLMAO:
I remember reading about it a few years ago, it is a complete mish mash of deals. Lets say; he is earning 80K per week, WHU lose the salary so free up 80K into their ongoing budget, they stop the payments to wherever he came from which are 1M a month for example, WHU now have 1M and 80K in their budget and the player off their hands. The person who buys him takes over the 1M a month payment and only have 2 years left on the deal so 24M for example. So SWHU have paid 1M a month for 24 months so 24M, but they run the club on a monthly budget so don't look at it as dead money only as ongoing costs they have now reduced.

It went something like that anyway but I am sure somebody will come in with a better example.
 
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Ealing Bee

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I remember reading about it a few years ago, it is a complete mish mash of deals. Lets say; he is earning 80K per week, WHU lose the salary so free up 80K into their ongoing budget, they stop the payments to wherever he came from which are 1M a month for example, WHU now have 1M and 80K in their budget and the player off their hands. The person who buys him takes over the 1M a month payment and only have 2 years left on the deal so 24M for example. So SWHU have paid 1M a month for 24 months so 24M, but they run the club on a monthly budget so don't look at it as dead money only as ongoing costs they have now reduced.

It went something like that anyway but I am sure somebody will come in with a better example.
Regardless of how the deal was structured and accounted for etc, I don't think anyone can deny that West Ham did their conkers on Haller.

No?
 

condorman

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It was with enormous amusement that I read that a mere 18 months after signing Sebastien Haller from Frankfurt for £45m, WHU have had to punt him out to Ajax for £20m. During his time with the Hammers, he managed a grand total of 14 goals in 54 games (10 in 48 PL):
Ajax sign Haller from West Ham

Worse still (better, actually :ROFLMAO:), the reasons given for binning him were that he "did not fit the template manager David Moyes wanted... ... [nor had he] shown a desire to adjust to it." That, of course, is the same David Moyes whom WHU recruited in a desperate relegation battle in November 2017, discarded 6 months later after he'd done the job required of him, then re-appointed again in December 2019.

Now I know that Bees have signed players who simply didn't work out and then had to get rid of them at a loss etc. But I doubt that any of them can ever have had the disastrous effect on BFC's transfer kitty that Haller has had on WHU's, whereby instead of having £45m to spend on new players, Moyes now has less than half of that (assuming the Dildo Brothers really do give him the full amount received from Ajax).

I wonder who "cost" us the most?
we looked at Haller a few years ago. I think we even tried to sign him. Ditto Albian Ajeti (now at Celtic on loan) who also went to West Ham
 

Jay Bee

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I was explaining a bit about the Bees on the Palace board when they were sniffing around Benrahma back in September and wrote the following.

We do sign a few duds but honestly not too many.

Transfermarkt reckons we have signed 25 players for >£1m since promotion in 2014 (plus Hermann under Noades all the way back in 1998). Of those 25,
  • 8 have been important first team players that were sold for a profit
  • 12 are likely to be in and around the first team this season (plus Benrahma)
  • 2 have just gone out on loan and may still leave for a profit (Jeanvier and Valencia)
  • 2 left on free transfers after a lot of injuries (Macleod and Bjelland)
  • 1 was a dud (Hofmann was a striker that never clicked in the first team).
Transfermarkt is not the most scientific of sources and even free transfer signing "cost" the club in wages etc but based on that list I'd suggest there was 1 or 3 depending on whether you are counting signings that were unsuccessful due to injury, as well as signings that simply shouldn't have happened.
 

LostBee

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Speculation in the papers at the time was that we bought him for £400k and sold him for £1m. Those figures could be way out, I suppose, but hardly so much that we actually lost money?
If we managed to do that after the terrible season he had with us then it is just another example of how good the DOF's are!
 

Jay Bee

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Speculation in the papers at the time was that we bought him for £400k and sold him for £1m. Those figures could be way out, I suppose, but hardly so much that we actually lost money?
Will Grigg went to a tribunal when we signed him so we can be happy the £325k quoted for signing him was correct?
.

He was a bad signing for improving our team - we would never have had Trotta back for the promotion season if he had worked out - but worked out well money wise.
 
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Ealing Bee

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Will Grigg went to a tribunal when we signed him so we can be happy the £325k quoted for signing him was correct?
.
An "initial" £325k, with add-ons (appearances rather than goals!) possibly adding another £75k?

Still, if we did really sell him for £1m, then we can probably say we got him from Walsall for a song.
 

Jay Bee

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An "initial" £325k, with add-ons (appearances rather than goals!) possibly adding another £75k?

Still, if we did really sell him for £1m, then we can probably say we got him from Walsall for a song.
Yes of course. He played 36 times for us and was part of the promotion squad so that indicates add-ons of £80k per that report. So yes, very much around £400k.
My point which I'm sure you realise is that it was more than newspaper speculation, it was a deal laid out for all to see.
 

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