Atmosphere vs Performance

[red_and_white]

Tommy Smith on the run in: “The hardest things is when the pressure comes down from the fans. It’s hard to try not to get caught up in that. Everyone does it, even at the top level, you see guys getting sucked into the atmosphere and that’s part of football.”

In recent weeks - since the Bournemouth win - the atmosphere at the home games has been unusually flat, probably down to the nerves. The performances have matched that and it was only when we were 2-1 against Millwall did the atmosphere get upped a level. The obvious observation was that once it was upped, the players responded.

It's always bit chicken and egg with this (performance breed atmosphere and vice versa), but at this vital stage of the season it seems home advantage gets knocked a little bit because of the nerves. On the flip side, it's the same everywhere and it could be a good time to play Derby.

With 7 games remaining (4 away and 3 at home):

1. Why has the atmosphere deflated at this stage(is it nerves or the less glamourous fixtures?)?
2. Does it have an effect on the players?
3. Do you think we'll pick up more points at home or away?

 

[liverbee]

I find some of the songs sung in the Ealing Road are a tone or three too high for me to comfortably join in. I think a singing teacher would be able to find the right pitch for a maximum impact. and possibly a conductor

 

[Lush55]

Mentioned this another thread,you have picked "pressure comes down from the fans",but missed the most important part out....."Smith believes his side buckled under the pressure of expectation against Millwall in their last outing,"

Atmosphere deflating home or away should not have an effect on these players as they are supposed to be professionals who go out to win,regardless if there are 2000 fans or 50,000 quite or making the noise.
"Buckling under pressure of expectation"........that is what worries me....6000 plus fans "expecting" on Friday or remind me,are we not going expecting to win?.....as I already said the atmosphere will be like a pressure cooker at CC..,if they "buckle" then I will for one will not hold back in my comments,if they play well then I will be one of the first to congratulate.

Jeez,IF we get to Wembley.....the expectation will be sky high!!.....TS has made those comment's as a senior player it is a stupid statement to make and is basically telling the fans not to expect too much and the if the younger players read that as well,then they have their nervous excuse!.....have they not learnt from the other games yet? (tongue in cheek).

As for picking up points .....I expect 9 from home and at least 9 away from our remaining matches........that is being realistic in what we have already achieved.....do Derby and second can still be ours...BEElive in your expectation's!

 

[tobymaxtonesmith]

1) Complacency, lots of new faces and just not enough effort from some parts of the ground.
2) Yes - ask any player and they'll say what a difference it makes.
3) We'll pick up seven points at home and six away, I think.

And we sing everything too quickly.

On the whole 'chicken and egg' thing, I can see your point but for me it's not really good enough to blame flat performances for a bad atmosphere. It's partly our job to get them going.

 

[NorthamptonBee]

The atmosphere has been crap for years, MA days got it back and that run in where we played Wycombe, Exeter and Luton plus a few others under AS got it going too. I don't think it was good under Uwe for large parts or under Warbs, I don't know why as we have enough who would like to make some noise. We get a corner and half of The Paddock start on "Come on you Bees" whilst the other half are giving it "Come on Brentford" and it quickly dies out, I'm not not knocking anyone as quite a few try but it doesn't happen.

Tommy has a point though, nerves do kick in, Tommy is good with words.

 

[liverbee]

I find the songs in The Ealing Road are a tone or three too high for me to comfortably join in at the moment. Perhaps we should get a singing teacher with a tuning fork in to set a good pitch for maximum impact and maybe a conductor..

 

[Lush55]

2) Yes - ask any player and they'll say what a difference it makes.
.

I am not knocking your opinion....but....according to Smith the difference it makes is that it makes the player's "buckle"..??
Or am I reading it all wrong?

 

[ruislip bee]

1) Complacency, lots of new faces and just not enough effort from some parts of the ground.
2) Yes - ask any player and they'll say what a difference it makes.
3) We'll pick up seven points at home and six away, I think.

And we sing everything too quickly.

On the whole 'chicken and egg' thing, I can see your point but for me it's not really good enough to blame flat performances for a bad atmosphere. It's partly our job to get them going.

It also works the other way around. Remember the home game last season after the Stevenage debacle. We were losing going into the last 20 minutes - cant remember against who. The atmosphere was quiet and flat. Bidwell did a crunching tackle and raced up the line and the crowd suddenly came alive. We won 3-1 and the rest is history. Sometimes something needs to happen on the pitch to spark the crowd.

 

[Lush55]

Tommy has a point though, nerves do kick in, Tommy is good with words.

Oh please,Tommy using that as an excuse,please see my above drivel or are we wrapping them up again....."they will learn".....if they 'aint yet then I am more worried about the next 7 than I was already!

 

[Hamburger Hill]

Atmosphere on Friday won't be an issue I'm sure

 

[whyteleafebee76]

It also works the other way around. Remember the home game last season after the Stevenage debacle. We were losing going into the last 20 minutes - cant remember against who. The atmosphere was quiet and flat. Bidwell did a crunching tackle and raced up the line and the crowd suddenly came alive. We won 3-1 and the rest is history. Sometimes something needs to happen on the pitch to spark the crowd.

Against Colchester I believe. Uwe remembers it well.

 

[whyteleafebee76]

Atmosphere on Friday won't be an issue I'm sure

Orient away last year was pretty special, I would expect it to be even louder/more intense than that on Friday and will be disappointed if it isn't.

 

[liverbee]

I didn't mean to do a similar thing twice. Sorry. A couple of times a season, most seasons, the whole ground gets going. I am a bit of a singer though. Pitch is important. You go to high when you try too hard. A bit like footballers.

 

[NorthamptonBee]

Oh please,Tommy using that as an excuse,please see my above drivel or are we wrapping them up again....."they will learn".....if they 'aint yet then I am more worried about the next 7 than I was already!

I mean our nerves as in why it goes quiet.

 

[AB]

I'd hope that the players can cope with a flat atmosphere but I think the problem comes when the atmosphere is deflating and deflated so that all they can hear is a murmuring of groans for every misplaced pass or mistimed tackle. If the players aren't supplying it, the fans need to give themselves their own happy pills and keep on being positive through to the end. We have a team that plays to the final whistle so we shouldn't give up hope whatever the scoreline is reading!

 

[sonofabee]

Atmosphere away where most occasions people who are there to sing can be in the same area and it's always been more fun and louder away for whatever reason.

At home it's not been great apart from odd games here and there for years and usually when it has been good it's got something to do with the away fans influencing our volume?

2,500 or whatever it was at Orient last year was as noisy as it is with over 10,000 Bees fans in GP, so I trust Putney on Friday will be as loud and as sustained as most will have witnessed.

As far as buckling under the pressure I think it's imperative that we have a blend of experience and fearless youth between now and the end of the season. It felt like we huffed and puffed against both Cardiff and Millwall at home but didn't probably didn't have enough about us to truly deserve the win in either game even though obvious we were by far the better footballing side on both occasions.
Never expected anything away at Blackburn but by all accounts we didn't play particularly well and didn't necessarily deserve to win on balance of play but we did, was that because the players didn't feel the pressure as much in front of our diehards, who knows.

Be good to be really loud and proud between now and the end of the season and hopefully the players will respond and it will get us through games. Having said that Millwall had excellent support at our place but look where they are?

 

[Lush55]

I mean our nerves as in why it goes quiet.

I think I knew what you meant,but for Tommy to say that our expectation can make the team nervous or buckle,just does not ring my bell and really worries me.

 

[tobymaxtonesmith]

It also works the other way around. Remember the home game last season after the Stevenage debacle. We were losing going into the last 20 minutes - cant remember against who. The atmosphere was quiet and flat. Bidwell did a crunching tackle and raced up the line and the crowd suddenly came alive. We won 3-1 and the rest is history. Sometimes something needs to happen on the pitch to spark the crowd.

Yeah absolutely - of course it's a two-way thing. But I'm thinking of games like Crewe on that Wednesday night two years ago, and Orient away last year where you could see how great an effect vocal support had on the players.

 

[tobymaxtonesmith]

I am not knocking your opinion....but....according to Smith the difference it makes is that it makes the player's "buckle"..??
Or am I reading it all wrong?

It's going to be different with every player, of course, but I don't reckon most of our squad would share Tommy's opinion - there's a lot less expectation from us than any other club challenging for promotion to the Prem. And maybe what he means is that, in a quiet ground, you can sense that the fans are nervous. But that's just me placing one of many possible spins on the quote.

 

[sonofabee]

I think I knew what you meant,but for Tommy to say that our expectation can make the team nervous or buckle,just does not ring my bell and really worries me.

I kind of agree, can't imagine any pro saying "God, this is pressure especially given those bloody GPGers are expecting us to beat Millwall! I hope no one's struggling to hold it together as maybe a problem seeing as we haven't got a stress counsellor yet, he's on route next season with the Sleep consultant"

 

[brundallbee]

Atmosphere and singing invariably much better at away games - and I think that goes for virtually all clubs (perhaps not Liverpool and one or two others). Possibly due to 'trench mentality' of being a small number in amongst a far greater number is the reason or perhaps those who spend a great deal of time and money going to away games are more 'into it'?

As for away performances I thought at the start of the season that given our squad and the way Warbs likes to play we'd be more dangerous away than at home - the stats don't exactly bear that out but we are, generally, more exciting away than at home because we are counter attacking rather than trying to break down two banks of four.

 

[Shaunyjb]

Atmosphere away where most occasions people who are there to sing can be in the same area and it's always been more fun and louder away for whatever reason.

At home it's not been great apart from odd games here and there for years and usually when it has been good it's got something to do with the away fans influencing our volume?

2,500 or whatever it was at Orient last year was as noisy as it is with over 10,000 Bees fans in GP, so I trust Putney on Friday will be as loud and as sustained as most will have witnessed.

As far as buckling under the pressure I think it's imperative that we have a blend of experience and fearless youth between now and the end of the season. It felt like we huffed and puffed against both Cardiff and Millwall at home but didn't probably didn't have enough about us to truly deserve the win in either game even though obvious we were by far the better footballing side on both occasions.
Never expected anything away at Blackburn but by all accounts we didn't play particularly well and didn't necessarily deserve to win on balance of play but we did, was that because the players didn't feel the pressure as much in front of our diehards, who knows.

Be good to be really loud and proud between now and the end of the season and hopefully the players will respond and it will get us through games. Having said that Millwall had excellent support at our place but look where they are?

We didn't play badly at Blackburn at all, it was two attacking sides in a very open game that we nicked late and deservedly so............... The 457 that went made a right racket all night, helped in part by a few hundred local kids across the netting who were giving it all they had to be fair.

Atmosphere at home has been poor of late, not helped by the appalling acoustics of the BIAS stand, but I do think the expectation level has risen beyond all belief and we just need to calm down in our hearts and make a hell of a lot of noise with our mouths. This will NOT be an issue on Good Friday as it wasn't at Brisbane Road last season but we need to raise the roof on Easter Monday............................

 

[nick logan]

Atmosphere away where most occasions people who are there to sing can be in the same area and it's always been more fun and louder away for whatever reason.

At home it's not been great apart from odd games here and there for years and usually when it has been good it's got something to do with the away fans influencing our volume?

2,500 or whatever it was at Orient last year was as noisy as it is with over 10,000 Bees fans in GP, so I trust Putney on Friday will be as loud and as sustained as most will have witnessed.

As far as buckling under the pressure I think it's imperative that we have a blend of experience and fearless youth between now and the end of the season. It felt like we huffed and puffed against both Cardiff and Millwall at home but didn't probably didn't have enough about us to truly deserve the win in either game even though obvious we were by far the better footballing side on both occasions.
Never expected anything away at Blackburn but by all accounts we didn't play particularly well and didn't necessarily deserve to win on balance of play but we did, was that because the players didn't feel the pressure as much in front of our diehards, who knows.

Be good to be really loud and proud between now and the end of the season and hopefully the players will respond and it will get us through games. Having said that Millwall had excellent support at our place but look where they are?

We did deserve to win and we were very loud all night , much better noise than Norwich , Brum and Leeds imo.

 

[samwood]

what a load of b***ocks.

 

[sonofabee]

We didn't play badly at Blackburn at all, it was two attacking sides in a very open game that we nicked late and deservedly so............... The 457 that went made a right racket all night, helped in part by a few hundred local kids across the netting who were giving it all they had to be fair.

Atmosphere at home has been poor of late, not helped by the appalling acoustics of the BIAS stand, but I do think the expectation level has risen beyond all belief and we just need to calm down in our hearts and make a hell of a lot of noise with our mouths. This will NOT be an issue on Good Friday as it wasn't at Brisbane Road last season but we need to raise the roof on Easter Monday............................

I wasn't criticising the support at Blackburn it sounded fantastic and I posted at the time that the 450+ that travelled up had deserved victory, my point was I listened to commentary and it wasn't a game we dominated or sounded like the team most likely to win but we did. At home, how superior were we all over the park to Cardiff but even when they were down to 9 players in last few minutes sadly it felt like too little too late in terms of genuine pressure in or around their box and real efforts on target.

 

[sonofabee]

We did deserve to win and we were very loud all night , much better noise than Norwich , Brum and Leeds imo.

Not back tracking but not talking about the noise of the crowd which was outstanding but it was a small percentage of 13, 000 + crowd. I may have got it wrong as wasn't there but sounded like we didn't play that well but kept at it and took our chances, I apologise.

 

[guildfordbee]

The lad that forks over the pitch before the match should be put on high alert for the rest of our home games. He managed to stir up the atmosphere this time last year

 

[sonofabee]

The lad that forks over the pitch before the match should be put on high alert for the rest of our home games. He managed to stir up the atmosphere this time last year

 

[GP200]

The lad that forks over the pitch before the match should be put on high alert for the rest of our home games. He managed to stir up the atmosphere this time last year

.............yep............good lad.............

 

[The Pipe]

Whilst I can see the correlation between the 2 it is, in my opinion, the responsibility of the players to perform which should then intensify the atmosphere

Unfortunately atmosphere at the vast majority of clubs has diminished in recent seasons something which cannot be solely down to seating. I think to a degree it is the new style of football supporters, it is now more of a " day out". Let's face it the pricing puts it in the same envelope as a theme park.

There are exceptions but, like Crystal Palace it is an orchestrated thing with flags, drums and people directing the sunging rather than watching the football

We are where we are and despite all the arguments on here regarding standing and singing the atmosphere has been on the decline for many years with just occasional upturns in specific games

Today's new fans are those that expect to be entertained and as we progress up the leagues there will be more and more of them. We have seen them at GP this season, taking photos but not really appreciating the clubs history

 

[badgerbee]

The lad that forks over the pitch before the match should be put on high alert for the rest of our home games. He managed to stir up the atmosphere this time last year

Anthony........did a fantastic job........wonder if he'll be at Fulham??........

 

[smiffy superbee]

.....like Crystal Palace it is an orchestrated thing with flags, drums and people directing the sunging rather than watching the football

We are where we are and despite all the arguments on here regarding standing and singing the atmosphere has been on the decline for many years with just occasional upturns in specific games

To arrest that decline and start to create an atmosphere I wondered whether it might be possible to add some form of sound system to get the crowd going?
I know its a bit contrived but it may just work (especially in the short term).
I was thinking that if a few microphones could pick up the noise from say, Ealing Road and be amplified and transmitted via speakers to the other sides of the ground it just MIGHT encourage them to join in as well.....what do you think? (well, certainly better than Crystal Palace's drum!)
Obviously I dream of the good old days (most recently under MA) when the NOIZY BOYZ reigned supreme! ......ha-ha!

 

[sonofabee]

To arrest that decline and start to create an atmosphere I wondered whether it might be possible to add some form of sound system to get the crowd going?
I know its a bit contrived but it may just work (especially in the short term).
I was thinking that if a few microphones could pick up the noise from say, Ealing Road and be amplified and transmitted via speakers to the other sides of the ground it just MIGHT encourage them to join in as well.....what do you think? (well, certainly better than Crystal Palace's drum!)
Obviously I dream of the good old days (most recently under MA) when the NOIZY BOYZ reigned supreme! ......ha-ha!

Mate that's exactly what they do at Old Trafford to make it sound louder in all parts of the ground.
I genuinely believe the acoustics will be excellent in LR as know it's been publicly spoken about by Cliff Crown. Suspect great opportunity for like minded fans and friends to get season tickets together and create bigger areas of singing and lively fans that is easier away than at home.

Meantime who cares what it takes if GP can sound louder and create a better and more inspiring atmosphere for the players and fans do it!

 

[FlyBee]

Tommy is good with words.

He's a wordsmith.