David Raya

[GP200]

He was superb at dealing with their aerial onslaught in the midst of a gale imo.

.........exactly.............more safe hands.............

 

[BeeHomeSoon]

At fault for Birmingham's goal today? For me he should have come out

At what point was he meant to come out?
He got sold by a great dummy?

 

[Tom the bee]

At what point was he meant to come out?
He got sold by a great dummy?

I mean for the cross, should be intercepting that IMO

 

[Balders Bee]

I mean for the cross, should be intercepting that IMO

Not a chance Raya is at fault for that goal. Norgaard missed initial tackle, Dalsgaard and Jeanvier possibly both could have done better at cutting cross out an Hogan's dummy did for everyone. No blame attached to Raya at all he didn't have a prayer when the ball ran across and I cannot for the life of me see he had a clear opportunty to cut the cross out in the circumstances.

 

[Balders Bee]

Did brilliantly today in near impossible conditions. Never stopped being positive and coming for the ball.

That's the key with him. Whilst he has made a couple of errors lately he continues to retain the confidence of his team and his communication is excellent, in difficult situations he will not hesitate. You could tell last season that Bentley had lost the confidence of the defence and they never knew if he was going to come or stay and that caused a hesitancy.

 

[hatfieldbee]

That's the key with him. Whilst he has made a couple of errors lately he continues to retain the confidence of his team and his communication is excellent, in difficult situations he will not hesitate. You could tell last season that Bentley had lost the confidence of the defence and they never knew if he was going to come or stay and that caused a hesitancy.

In the 2nd half he attempted a very long throw to Ollie who was not far from the right hand touchline almost on the halfway line. The wind played it's part and the ball sailed over Ollie's head into touch.
A minute or so later there was a comparatively long break in play due to injury. David and Ollie had a long conversation, and David then went up to each defender in turn and body language told me they were all very supportive of one another. High 5s and arms round shoulders type of thing.

 

[liverbee]

That's the key with him. Whilst he has made a couple of errors lately he continues to retain the confidence of his team and his communication is excellent, in difficult situations he will not hesitate. You could tell last season that Bentley had lost the confidence of the defence and they never knew if he was going to come or stay and that caused a hesitancy.

Absolutely. If he needs a mental rest though I would be happy with Luke. I really admire Luke’s keeping and his mentality. I thought Bentley was over-indulged.

 

[North London Bee]

The defence love Raya because he is a talker and most importantly because he is decisive in his decision making. He comes for most crosses and does not hesitate.

Exceptional goalkeeper.

 

[Vid]

He gets crowded by both sides. If the ? gives him room he catch or punch easier.

 

[GP200]

................ excellent one on one save near the end..................

 

[Brentford_till_die]

................ excellent one on one save near the end..................

As important as a goal. Brilliant save.

 

[jlove]

Proved the fans of his previous employer wrong...

 

[Gee Bee]

Proved the fans of his previous employer wrong...

Although their keeper was good but I think only on loan

 

[North London Bee]

Seen it so often now. Never a penalty.

 

[alikat]

Seen it so often now. Never a penalty.

Indeed and a great one on one save near the end, but I just felt that he should probably have stayed on his line for their 1st goal as, by coming out, he made it easier for Armstrong, giving him the chance to lob, which he duly executed perfectly.

 

[Balders Bee]

Indeed and a great one on one save near the end, but I just felt that he should probably have stayed on his line for their 1st goal as, by coming out, he made it easier for Armstrong, giving him the chance to lob, which he duly executed perfectly.

Disagree, it was an excellent finish. Given that Pinnock had missed the header Raya's positioning was fine, just think you have to credit Armstrong.

 

[shaun]

Raya had no chance. Terrible mistake by Pinnock which put Raya literally in a horrible position.

For their second goal, never a pen. Which is why they ref was so keen to give us our pen.

 

[Lionel Bart-At]

Raya had no chance. Terrible mistake by Pinnock which put Raya literally in a horrible position.

For their second goal, never a pen. Which is why they ref was so keen to give us our pen.

Shouldn't have been a Blackburn penalty, agreed. On the other one, not a mistake by Pinnock. Oddly, if you'd watched this on TV you would know the wind was responsible here... However, we were always drilled that a keeper should not come to save a bouncing ball (easy meat for attacker). Still don't blame Sir David though.

 

[ruislip bee]

Seen it so often now. Never a penalty.

I didn't think so live but watching it back I'm not so sure. He got to the ball cleanly enough and pushed it away but as he was falling his hand went around the Blackburn players neck and he pulled him down. I don't think the player had any chance of getting the ball but that pull ensured he wouldn't. It was maybe marginal but I can see why the ref gave it after he had a good clear look first.

 

[No_sting_Bee]

He also jumped really high for the lob and nearly stopped it. Bounced just right for Armstrong too.

 

[alikat]

Disagree, it was an excellent finish. Given that Pinnock had missed the header Raya's positioning was fine, just think you have to credit Armstrong.

If you read my post again, you will see that I said that Armstrong executed the lob perfectly. I just felt that Raya would have given himself a better chance to save any shot if he didn't rush out. I say this because of how wide Armstrong was - if Raya had stayed back, it would have been more difficult to score because of the angle. All about opinions though.

 

[Mr Cynical]

If you read my post again, you will see that I said that Armstrong executed the lob perfectly. I just felt that Raya would have given himself a better chance to save any shot if he didn't rush out. I say this because of how wide Armstrong was - if Raya had stayed back, it would have been more difficult to score because of the angle. All about opinions though.

but if you close the player down it reduces the angles even further. it's what most keepers would do. It was a great finish to be fair and you'd assume Raya was expecting Pinnock to head the ball away as he normally does.

 

[alikat]

but if you close the player down it reduces the angles even further.

Yes, but he was pretty wide anyway, so it would have been difficult for him to score from where he was without being given the option of the lob (which he wouldn't have had if Raya hadn't rushed out). But I agree that it was a great finish.

 

[Balders Bee]

If you read my post again, you will see that I said that Armstrong executed the lob perfectly. I just felt that Raya would have given himself a better chance to save any shot if he didn't rush out. I say this because of how wide Armstrong was - if Raya had stayed back, it would have been more difficult to score because of the angle. All about opinions though.

I read your post the first time and since it was a brilliant finish I disagreed that Raya could have done anything to prevent it. When Pinnock missed the header Raya narrowed the angle on Armstrong's touch and was then beaten by a very good finish. Would you criticise the Blackburn keeper for being beaten at his near post by Watkins thunderbolt? As you say differing opinions.

 

[Newport Pagnell Bee]

If you read my post again, you will see that I said that Armstrong executed the lob perfectly. I just felt that Raya would have given himself a better chance to save any shot if he didn't rush out. I say this because of how wide Armstrong was - if Raya had stayed back, it would have been more difficult to score because of the angle. All about opinions though.

It's one of those where had he stayed on his line and Armstrong smacked it home, people would be saying "why didn't he close him down". The error wasn't his

 

[FlyBee]

It's one of those where had he stayed on his line and Armstrong smacked it home, people would be saying "why didn't he close him down". The error wasn't his

Agree. I think you have to give the scorer credit for a good finish. Not a patch on Ollie's though!

 

[alikat]

I read your post the first time and since it was a brilliant finish I disagreed that Raya could have done anything to prevent it. When Pinnock missed the header Raya narrowed the angle on Armstrong's touch and was then beaten by a very good finish. Would you criticise the Blackburn keeper for being beaten at his near post by Watkins thunderbolt? As you say differing opinions.

Obviously, it was Pinnock's error that created the chance (albeit caused by the weather conditions), but I repeat that Armstrong wouldn't have been able to lob Raya if he hadn't come rushing out. So I'm simply saying that he made the chance easier for Armstrong.

 

[alikat]

It's one of those where had he stayed on his line and Armstrong smacked it home, people would be saying "why didn't he close him down". The error wasn't his

From the angle that Armstrong was coming from, he'd have done well to score without the option of lobbing.

I think that we've done this to death now and it's all a matter of opinions at the end of the day.

 

[BeeHomeSoon]

Obviously, it was Pinnock's error that created the chance (albeit caused by the weather conditions), but I repeat that Armstrong wouldn't have been able to lob Raya if he hadn't come rushing out. So I'm simply saying that he made the chance easier for Armstrong.

From the angle that Armstrong was coming from, he'd have done well to score without the option of lobbing.

I think that we've done this to death now and it's all a matter of opinions at the end of the day.

And has he stayed on his line Armstrong would either have had a very good chance of scoring by drilling the ball into the far corner or he could have taken the ball down and taken it in closer to create an even better angle to shoot from...

Can’t we just agree that his lob was inch perfect as it was placed just out of Raya’s reach?

As for people blaming him for the penalty, absolutely laughable, he got to the ball and cleared it before making contact with the striker...
Using some people’s logic should be have had a penalty Mbeumo collided with their keeper when he came rushing out?

 

[AB]

Boils my piss, nothing cheeky about messing around with a goal keepers hands as a corner is being swung in. ****ers

Not as cheeky as the Bee (Egan?) who stuck his finger up Button’s bottom, at a corner when he played against us for Fulham.

 

[Frothybaby]

Not as cheeky as the Bee (Egan?) who stuck his finger up Button’s bottom, at a corner when he played against us for Fulham.

Could JJ not have bust a gut to get back and cover the goal once he saw Pinnock miss the header?

 

[Lionel Bart-At]

Obviously, it was Pinnock's error that created the chance (albeit caused by the weather conditions), but I repeat that Armstrong wouldn't have been able to lob Raya if he hadn't come rushing out. So I'm simply saying that he made the chance easier for Armstrong.

He did. When I played (many decades ago), keepers were always told to come out and narrow the angle, EXCEPT when the attacker was coming onto a bouncing ball, for obvious reasons, as exemplified yesterday. Great finish nonetheless. (And yes... weather, not Pinnock).

 

[BeeHomeSoon]

He did. When I played (many decades ago), keepers were always told to come out and narrow the angle, EXCEPT when the attacker was coming onto a bouncing ball, for obvious reasons, as exemplified yesterday. Great finish nonetheless. (And yes... weather, not Pinnock).

Getting a lob inch perfect is a more difficult skill than drilling a ball hard and low across into the far corner.

Or even if say he had held back on his line and Armstrong had taken the ball in his stride, then cut inside to create an even better angle to get a shot away people would be criticising him for not coming out quick enough...

He did absolutely nothing wrong, he made a judgment and Armstrong finished very well...however if he had that same opportunity 10 times I bet he’d miss more times than he’d score.

As a keeper that played at a reasonable level I have never been told to stay on my line when a player is bearing down on goal and it served me well...

 

[Lionel Bart-At]

Getting a lob inch perfect is a more difficult skill than drilling a ball hard and low across into the far corner.

Or even if say he had held back on his line and Armstrong had taken the ball in his stride, then cut inside to create an even better angle to get a shot away people would be criticising him for not coming out quick enough...

He did absolutely nothing wrong, he made a judgment and Armstrong finished very well...however if he had that same opportunity 10 times I bet he’d miss more times than he’d score.

As a keeper that played at a reasonable level I have never been told to stay on my line when a player is bearing down on goal and it served me well...

Different eras maybe. You are also right in saying that lobs don't often come off. As an outfield player, though, what I would say is that when a keeper comes out to meet me and a bouncing ball, he makes my mind up very easily and I know exactly what to do. This takes him out of the equation straight away, even if, as you say, I will probably miss with my lob. Didn't happen yesterday, unfortunately. :sad:

 

[BeeHomeSoon]

Different eras maybe. You are also right in saying that lobs don't often come off. As an outfield player, though, what I would say is that when a keeper comes out to meet me and a bouncing ball, he makes my mind up very easily and I know exactly what to do. This takes him out of the equation straight away, even if, as you say, I will probably miss with my lob. Didn't happen yesterday, unfortunately. :sad:

Quite possibly a different era thing...the way some keepers punch shots that are straight at them instead of opting to catch baffles me.
If I’d done that type of stuff back in the day, the goalkeeper coach would have given me a kicking...lol

 

[Hakonen_72]

I think Raya made a mistake because he did not go all the way for Armstrong. He stopped 2-3 metres before Armstrong, and Armstrong scored brilliantly. In that situation, either you go all the way or do not go. Raya probably misjudged the situation from the beginning as he was already on the 6 yard line when Armstrong got the ball, so he had made the decision already, but he still had time to get closer before the lob, do not know why he did not. I also think that staying (near) the goal line, would have been better than his actual decision to come "midway", there were four Bees players closing in anyway.

 

[Balders Bee]

I think Raya made a mistake because he did not go all the way for Armstrong. He stopped 2-3 metres before Armstrong, and Armstrong scored brilliantly. In that situation, either you go all the way or do not go. Raya probably misjudged the situation from the beginning as he was already on the 6 yard line when Armstrong got the ball, so he had made the decision already, but he still had time to get closer before the lob, do not know why he did not. I also think that staying (near) the goal line, would have been better than his actual decision to come "midway", there were four Bees players closing in anyway.

Can't agree with that, when Raya saw Pinnock had missed the header he did not have time to come all the way so he narrowed the angle and set himself. It was just a brilliant finish. This has really been done unto death....it's a matter of opinions.

 

[Balders Bee]

Quite possibly a different era thing...the way some keepers punch shots that are straight at them instead of opting to catch baffles me.
If I’d done that type of stuff back in the day, the goalkeeper coach would have given me a kicking...lol

Keeping constantly evolves, I think some of the opinions on here re goalkeeping hark back to the days forwards could charge keepers into the back of the net and keepers used to dive head first at oncoming strikers feet. IMHO instead of looking for a non existent fault in Raya's decision making for the first goal we should be praising him for the technical brilliance of his one on one save from the same striker in the second half after HD's woefully under hit back pass. Speed off his line, went on the poor touch and an excellent block. Modern keeping technique personified.

 

[Hakonen_72]

Can't agree with that, when Raya saw Pinnock had missed the header he did not have time to come all the way so he narrowed the angle and set himself. It was just a brilliant finish. This has really been done unto death....it's a matter of opinions.

Because I was not at GP. I had second best option, watching the match from Viaplay with plenty of camera angles and replays. Those replays show exactly what Raya was doing... Raya was on the edge of penalty area when Blackburn goalie kicked the ball, then Raya went backwards to 6 yard line, and never made the effort to go and stop the ball or / and Armstrong... he "followed" the 6 yard line leaving a 2-3 metres gap between him and Armstrong, on purpose. That must be something he has learnt / taught to do, because this was not the first time he did that. Armstrong almost stopped before the lob because he had time to do so.

I have nothing against Raya or any other players, I just think about this situation objectively, and, of course, would have liked the outcome to be different.

 

[Balders Bee]

Because I was not at GP. I had second best option, watching the match from Viaplay with plenty of camera angles and replays. Those replays show exactly what Raya was doing... Raya was on the edge of penalty area when Blackburn goalie kicked the ball, then Raya went backwards to 6 yard line, and never made the effort to go and stop the ball or / and Armstrong... he "followed" the 6 yard line leaving a 2-3 metres gap between him and Armstrong, on purpose. That must be something he has learnt / taught to do, because this was not the first time he did that. Armstrong almost stopped before the lob because he had time to do so.

I have nothing against Raya or any other players, I just think about this situation objectively, and, of course, would have liked the outcome to be different.

Sorry I was there watching this in real time and subsequently reviewed the reply on the highlights and do not accept your synopsis of the goal. He correctly positioned himself for Pinnock to possibly head the ball back to him - a perfectly rational decision. When Pinnock misjudged the situation Raya readjusted his position realised he would not have time to reach Armstrong and set himself for the shot. Armstrong executed the perfect lob. He made a valid and sound decision and was beaten by a very good finish.

The only point with which I agree with you is that the outcome would have been different. It is clear we have differing opinions even though we are watching the same incident and nothing else can be said.

 

[Newport Pagnell Bee]

and nothing else can be said.

Only thing I would add, is this is all split second stuff. Raya didn't have time to enter all the permutations into a laptop and calculate which position would give him the best chance of making a save. All very well pontificating on the rights and wrongs on a slow motion replay but that's the easy bit. He made his decision and that was that. Two things I like about Raya are his decisiveness and quality of decision making

 

[Balders Bee]

Only thing I would add, is this is all split second stuff. Raya didn't have time to enter all the permutations into a laptop and calculate which position would give him the best chance of making a save. All very well pontificating on the rights and wrongs on a slow motion replay but that's the easy bit. He made his decision and that was that. Two things I like about Raya are his decisiveness and quality of decision making

Absolutely agree with this 100%.

 

[BeeHomeSoon]

Keeping constantly evolves, I think some of the opinions on here re goalkeeping hark back to the days forwards could charge keepers into the back of the net and keepers used to dive head first at oncoming strikers feet. IMHO instead of looking for a non existent fault in Raya's decision making for the first goal we should be praising him for the technical brilliance of his one on one save from the same striker in the second half after HD's woefully under hit back pass. Speed off his line, went on the poor touch and an excellent block. Modern keeping technique personified.

Completely agree with you, that save was the goalkeeping equivalent of scoring a goal.

If people want to see a goalkeeping error they should watch the Southend goal against Burton lol

 

[Lionel Bart-At]

Completely agree with you, that save was the goalkeeping equivalent of scoring a goal.

If people want to see a goalkeeping error they should watch the Southend goal against Burton lol

Absolutely. Has been an interesting debate on here, but, at the end of the day, my opinion of Raya remains very, very high. He is a breath of fresh air as a keeper. Positive, enthusiastic and, above all else, very decisive. He is a fantastic shot stopper, does incredibly well in one-on-ones, claims the ball more frequently than many keepers (as opposed to punching), but reads situations very quickly so that he decides judiciously when to catch and when to punch. His feet are also excellent and he distributes effectively and intelligently with both feet (and out of hand). Finally, his passion for the team and the club is clear to see. Wears his heart on his sleeve in this respect (in a very positive way).

 

[claphambee]

Could JJ not have bust a gut to get back and cover the goal once he saw Pinnock miss the header?

This. I’m glad someone else thought it. JJ was casual running back when he saw the danger. Want him busting a gut and ending up in the net. I’ve seen that casual nature a few times from JJ. No, this goal was not his error but didn’t see any desire to defend there.

 

[Hakonen_72]

Sorry I was there watching this in real time and subsequently reviewed the reply on the highlights and do not accept your synopsis of the goal. He correctly positioned himself for Pinnock to possibly head the ball back to him - a perfectly rational decision. When Pinnock misjudged the situation Raya readjusted his position realised he would not have time to reach Armstrong and set himself for the shot. Armstrong executed the perfect lob. He made a valid and sound decision and was beaten by a very good finish.

The only point with which I agree with you is that the outcome would have been different. It is clear we have differing opinions even though we are watching the same incident and nothing else can be said.

Highlights shows the situation from New Road view, camera follows the ball and Raya is visible in 9 second mark. Viaplay showed replay from behind goal which shows exactly what he was doing during the whole time before the goal. Also, another replay shows, in slow motion, the situation from the NRS 508 and those replays are the reason I say what I say. You can disagree, no problem, and does not really matter.

 

[BeeHomeSoon]

Absolutely. Has been an interesting debate on here, but, at the end of the day, my opinion of Raya remains very, very high. He is a breath of fresh air as a keeper. Positive, enthusiastic and, above all else, very decisive. He is a fantastic shot stopper, does incredibly well in one-on-ones, claims the ball more frequently than many keepers (as opposed to punching), but reads situations very quickly so that he decides judiciously when to catch and when to punch. His feet are also excellent and he distributes effectively and intelligently with both feet (and out of hand). Finally, his passion for the team and the club is clear to see. Wears his heart on his sleeve in this respect (in a very positive way).

Agreed

I guess I’m a little precious...GK union and all that

 

[Mattingly Bee]

Raya = Best goalkeeper for years.

 

[Vid]

He could have caught the lob. It's his Mums fault. She should have fed him more green beans and he would be taller.

 

[BeeHomeSoon]

I think Raya made a mistake because he did not go all the way for Armstrong. He stopped 2-3 metres before Armstrong, and Armstrong scored brilliantly. In that situation, either you go all the way or do not go. Raya probably misjudged the situation from the beginning as he was already on the 6 yard line when Armstrong got the ball, so he had made the decision already, but he still had time to get closer before the lob, do not know why he did not. I also think that staying (near) the goal line, would have been better than his actual decision to come "midway", there were four Bees players closing in anyway.

Raya stopped and set himself as the ball was dropping for the first bounce after Armstrong’s first touch, as that was the first opportunity he could have struck the ball...if he had “gone all the way” as you’re suggesting and Armstrong had taken the earlier shot he would have not been balanced to make the save...

This is standard stuff keepers are taught.