Ground Sharing

[WILTSHIREBEE]

In the light of all the mayhem at the club in the last two years ive personally lost faith in the 'Lionel Road' project. If this doesn't materialize imho we will only survive if we take the groundshare option.

If this is the case imho we will have no choice but to move out of the LBH.

Judging by the strong feeling against this on the GPG would someone like to give me some alternatives to this(i for one don't know of a ground we can share within the borough).

Other than wimbledon i don't know of a club who has ceased to exist because of a groundshare(some might argue that they didn't despite their new name and location).

Our visitors on saturday being the best example of this.Yes we all know they've been knocked back in recent times but they exist very healthily in there latest temporary home back in the borough of B&H.

They survived several seasons at gillingford before this as we all know and now with noades out of the picture would we not be prepared to trust bu if a groundshare outside the borough was the only option.Or would the fans prefer it if the club was wound up.

I know which option i'd choose.

 

[rebus]

they exist very healthily in there latest temporary home back in the borough of B&H.

They don't. They are probably losing twice as much as us a week and are being proped up £££ by Dick Knight. If that stadium is not built in the next 4-5 years then they are in real trouble.

 

[ianallon]

They survived several seasons at gillingford before this as we all know and now with noades out of the picture would we not be prepared to trust bu if a groundshare outside the borough was the only option.Or would the fans prefer it if the club was wound up.

I know which option i'd choose.

Wound up please.

 

[Mads Bee]

They don't. They are probably losing twice as much as us a week and are being proped up £££ by Dick Knight. If that stadium is not built in the next 4-5 years then they are in real trouble.

Agree, you don't have to look very far to see how much money they are losing, talk to the supporters too.

Now, look into my eyes, look into my eyes....Lionel Road will happen.....Olympics....mark my words

 

[NorthamptonBee]

Did they have a near 9 mill debt when they started off on their nomadic existance?

If a place as big as them struggles to find them a place to live.........:sad:

 

[JTofBFC]

I'm convinced ground-sharing could work but not in an existing stadium.

Despite all the understandable animosity between the clubs, QPR are the main realistic contenders but it wouldn't work if it was at either GP or Loftus Rd. It has to be at a new stadium that neither club can claim to be "theirs".

Judging from the recent rumours about the downsizing of the capacity at Lionel Rd, it is unlikely that we would be able to attract a football club to share with a sub 20,000 capacity. Personally, I think if Lionel Rd happens and we build it with much less than 20k capacity we will have been sold a sop as it is an obvious limitation on future ambition.

I have a feeling we will still be debating this very same subject in the same way in 3/4 years.

 

[hanworthbee]

Im happy to ground share with a rugby club, then no need to have a capacity larger than say 15,000

 

[JTofBFC]

Im happy to ground share with a rugby club, then no need to have a capacity larger than say 15,000

In other words happy to never be a Championship team.

If we build this new stadium with capacity of 15,000 we might as well not bother.

 

[Brickie Chap]

Any ground has to be 25,000

 

[hanworthbee]

were never going to attract that sort of attendance even if we made it to the premiership, it was as much as we could do to get 7,000 through the gate when we were top of the table last season

 

[Simon C]

were never going to attract that sort of attendance even if we made it to the premiership, it was as much as we could do to get 7,000 through the gate when we were top of the table last season

Look how many came to Sunderland, Reading, etc. We'd be throwing that extra money away whenever we had a big game and I'm sure we'd get more for a big game without a decrepit stadium.

 

[rebus]

were never going to attract that sort of attendance even if we made it to the premiership, it was as much as we could do to get 7,000 through the gate when we were top of the table last season

You sound like a Reading fan from 1992.

 

[JTofBFC]

You sound like a Reading fan from 1992.

Spot on. We have to aspire to be a Reading not a Wycombe.

If we ever did get a new ground at Lionel Rd (or elsewhere) and if we ever did get into the Championship, we might not have an "average" gate of 15,000 but there will be plenty of fixtures where 20,000 could be possible. If we have a stadium with a capacity of 15,000 then our average gate will drop as the bigger fixtures wont generate the crowds they are capable of.

There is lots of evidence that a new ground with up to date facilities generates substantial crowd improvements so we cannot allow our past attendance history to dictate the capacity.

I am hearing rumours (unsubstantiated as far as I am concerned) that Lionel Rd is being considered as a 14,000 - 18,000 site now not a 20,000 - 23,000 site. I think we have to be careful here if there is any truth in this.

For Brentford fans, the stadium is the crucial part of this development and should not be sacrificed for more ancillary development.

If the stadium does not work financially with a 20,000 capacity then maybe it is time to look elsewhere.

 

[rebus]

The capacity of Lionel Road is slated at 18-20000.

 

[jlove]

WILTSHIREBEE, how about groundsharing with AFC Wimbledon at the old Kingstonian ground?

It is entirely possible for BFC to move to a new Griffin Park, with the co-operation of LBH, both for planning and for use, and one or more developers. We may have a "£9M debt" (£7.2M according to BU) but we do have a £10M ("£19M" according to Uncle Ron, © Tony Flood lol ) asset.

In this case, other sporting clubs may well ground-share with BFC, like a local RU club, and possibly other sporting activites, depending on what is actually developed. Look at Doncaster, who have Rugby League, Ladies Football and Athletics.

My understanding of the terms of planning are that Griffin Park Mark 1 cannot be developed until a new location is found. I think this means that it is possible for BFC to ground-share while a new stadium is being built but not to do a B&HAFC and just flog it off to ground-share. Of course, if BFC went into receivership, this probably will not apply and we'll lose the lot.

So, your point is... ?

 

[reg partridge]

Hounslow council don't give a monkey's for BFC. If we moved out of the borough they would be happy to see the back of us. Take Hounslow Town who at one time were a big non-league side, sold Denbigh Road and now play park football, in another borough, after briefly merging with Feltham. Take it from me we cannot move out of GP until we have a new home or we'll never get back in. The fact that for the last 30+ years we have been looking at a new stadium and every single time the council have rejected it speaks for itself.

 

[rebus]

The fact that for the last 30+ years we have been looking at a new stadium and every single time the council have rejected it speaks for itself.

We've never put a planning application in for a new stadium with Hounslow Council. How can they reject it if we've not applied?

Our relationship with the council is the best it's ever been. They've lent us £500k!

 

[reg partridge]

So all the talk of WIM, Feltham Arena, and countless other sites over the years were just that were they! Its a good job we didn't put applications in for all these sites as we'd be more in debt than we already are. If we move out of LBH for any length of time we will not get back in FACT!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[reg partridge]

Hallelujah Brother, my thoughts exactly

 

[rebus]

If we move out of LBH for any length of time we will not get back in FACT!!!!!!!!!!!

That's something I will agree with you on.

 

[reg partridge]

Wonders never cease

 

[leggybee]

I think this has been suggested before and I dont know the finances involved but there is a hell of a lot of space in the middle of Kempton park where a new ground could be built or at a push how about sandown.

Hey heres an idea if we share with that lot down the road. Do you think the new Wembley might be available. Oh I suppose they might object to that as it would be more like our home ground as we would be more used to playing in finals in recent times.

 

[sgaz]

I think we should groundshare with Harlequins!

I've just seen their new cheerleaders 'The Hearts' on Sky Sports News and i really think we should give it some thought if they are part of the package :brow:

 

[wanderer paul]

I think we should groundshare with Harlequins!

I've just seen their new cheerleaders 'The Hearts' on Sky Sports News and i really think we should give it some thought if they are part of the package :brow:

don't start talking about sharing with a rugby club...................................

you'll be getting that yellow bent bit of fruit harping on about an exiled club from the 'Celtic' area of England next...........................

 

[sonofabee]

were never going to attract that sort of attendance even if we made it to the premiership, it was as much as we could do to get 7,000 through the gate when we were top of the table last season

Sorry,

Can't agree, Fulham were down to 4k average home gates when they were in div 4 and now they're back I believe to 18-20K.

 

[WILTSHIREBEE]

We've never put a planning application in for a new stadium with Hounslow Council. How can they reject it if we've not applied?

Our relationship with the council is the best it's ever been. They've lent us £500k!

So are you saying that Barclays Bank will continue to lend us money beyond our only asset which as far as I know is GP?


LBH know full well that if we go bust they'll get their 500k back.

 

[leggybee]

I think we should groundshare with Harlequins!

I've just seen their new cheerleaders 'The Hearts' on Sky Sports News and i really think we should give it some thought if they are part of the package :brow:

Won't the grass be too long?
Not that it would make any difference to how the cheerleaders looked. I was thinking more of our free flowing football.

 

[rebus]

So are you saying that Barclays Bank will continue to lend us money beyond our only asset which as far as I know is GP?

No, someone else probably will. It doesn't take a genius to work out who or what either. Barclays Bank may have realised they've had a lucky escape.

 

[WILTSHIREBEE]

Its taken over 20 years for LBH to grant us planning permission for any decent ground improvements which our club has desperately needed
(too little too late springs to mind).

Every previous site that has been suggested for a new stadium has been rejected before any planning application was made weren't they?


The point of this thread was to ask if anyone had any new ideas for a possible groundshare and all its produced is the obvious one at loftus road and kingstonian which has been repeatedly rubbished on here since the noades era.

As bu has failed to attract any investors that have unlimited funds they are prepared to throw at the club i fail to understand where the money will come from for a 'Lionel Road' type project unless we share it on a permanent basis with either QPR or a very rich rugby club.

As for the 'B&HA argument they've got exactly what we have'nt,someone who has been prepared to bankroll them for more than a decade with the hope that eventually they will do a 'Reading'.

 

[rebus]

Its taken over 20 years for LBH to grant us planning permission for any decent ground improvements which our club has desperately needed
(too little too late springs to mind).

We haven't put anything in since 1996 - not twenty years - and that (paddock and New Road seating) was approved with no problems.

 

[Stanley]

As for the 'B&HA argument they've got exactly what we have'nt,someone who has been prepared to bankroll them for more than a decade with the hope that eventually they will do a 'Reading'.

Won't go on forever and not sure the Falmer project is as sound as once thought.

LBH seem to be far more accomodating than in the past although one is never quite sure what really was proposed and said in the past...like the early 80's development which was turned down...

 

[sgaz]

Not that it would make any difference to how the cheerleaders looked

It is ALL about the cheerleaders
Where we end up is irrelevant (as long as there are cheerleaders)

 

[WILTSHIREBEE]

We haven't put anything in since 1996 - not twenty years - and that (paddock and New Road seating) was approved with no problems.

So we have'nt been repeatedly knocked back with plans to put a roof on ealing road since the demolishing of the old 'royal oak' end then.?

 

[rebus]

repeatedly knocked back

If you mean one planning application in 1995, then no.

 

[WILTSHIREBEE]

If you mean one planning application in 1995, then no.

Sorry to harp on but at the 'lifeline' meeting at Hounslow Civic Centre this was one of the issues brought up by Martin Lange.

At the time it was reported in the local press as one of the reasons we were in so much financial trouble.

 

[WILTSHIREBEE]

If you mean one planning application in 1995, then no.

Didn't Noades get knocked back as well, leading him to claim that we would have to leave GP?

 

[rebus]

Didn't Noades get knocked back as well, leading him to claim that we would have to leave GP?

No, that was one of usual threats which led the council to wash its hands of him.

Sorry to harp on but at the 'lifeline' meeting at Hounslow Civic Centre this was one of the issues brought up by Martin Lange.

At the time it was reported in the local press as one of the reasons we were in so much financial trouble.

Not sure what you mean. By that meeeting (Spring 1986) he had gained permission by the council for flats at both ends of the ground and a new stand.

 

[Hullbee]

More council bashing by people who can't see the bigger picture

Hounslow Council has other residents to consider not just those who support Brentford FC. I am afraid we live in a demcracy and as such a council cannot just go bang there you go build your stadium on this piece of land under the flight path in green belt land with no public transport.

When Brentford submit a planning application for Lionel Road then perhaps the council will have something to work on/with.

I want to build an extension on my house do I critcise the council for not granting me permission. Even though I have not even bothered to submit a planning application please explain what the difference is

Why should public money be wasted on helping Brentford FC find sites for a new stadium when Brentford is a Private company??? I don't remember Hounslow Council doing this for Glaxo.

 

[Alan D]

In other words happy to never be a Championship team.

If we build this new stadium with capacity of 15,000 we might as well not bother.

I 100% agree with you. We should be looking at a capacity of around 25,000

 

[Hullbee]

So we have'nt been repeatedly knocked back with plans to put a roof on ealing road since the demolishing of the old 'royal oak' end then.?

Perhaps they didn't want to approve a scheme that caused harm to neighbouring properties (After all these people are council tax paying residents too)

If you think the scheme was so acceptable why did Brentford not win the appeal.

 

[WILTSHIREBEE]

More council bashing by people who can't see the bigger picture

Hounslow Council has other residents to consider not just those who support Brentford FC. I am afraid we live in a demcracy and as such a council cannot just go bang there you go build your stadium on this piece of land under the flight path in green belt land with no public transport.

When Brentford submit a planning application for Lionel Road then perhaps the council will have something to work on/with.

I want to build an extension on my house do I critcise the council for not granting me permission. Even though I have not even bothered to submit a planning application please explain what the difference is

Why should public money be wasted on helping Brentford FC find sites for a new stadium when Brentford is a Private company??? I don't remember Hounslow Council doing this for Glaxo.

I for one don't blame he council for our demise,we all know its down to mismanagement over the last 50 odd years.

The ground has been repeatedly butchered over the years with nobody really attempting to rectify our crumbling stadia.

 

[WILTSHIREBEE]

Perhaps they didn't want to approve a scheme that caused harm to neighbouring properties (After all these people are council tax paying residents too)

If you think the scheme was so acceptable why did Brentford not win the appeal.

I didn't think it was aceptable, however i do think it shouldn't have been the only answer to our survival(please see above post).

 

[Hullbee]

I didn't think it was aceptable, however i do think it shouldn't have been the only answer to our survival(please see above post).

I really wish Hounslow, Richmond, Spelthone, Ealing councils were in a similar position to Hull City Council a few years ago. After they sold Kingston Communications they had money to burn on building a new stadium that the football and rugby teams could play in rent free for the first 3 years (to help them rebalance the books) After that period of time both teams had to pay competitive rents to the Council. So the general public were happy. The new stadium has helped to put the city on the map e.g england under 21 games. A local park has also been done up and the Council, Football and Rugby clubs all have a nice stadium that the Hull public is proud of.

If only Brentford could pull this out of the bag perhaps Doug White still will rofl

 

[VTG]

Problem with sharing with a rugby club would be the pitch. Considering our hardships, our pitch is bloody brilliant, puts Chelsea's craphole to shame that's for sure, and have you seen the amount of sliding about and gouging up rugby does to a pitch? Especially the valleys left in the pitch from sliding in for tries and the scrums if it's union. Only as a last resort thanks!

 

[muchtodonow]

Problem with sharing with a rugby club would be the pitch. Considering our hardships, our pitch is bloody brilliant, puts Chelsea's craphole to shame that's for sure, and have you seen the amount of sliding about and gouging up rugby does to a pitch? Especially the valleys left in the pitch from sliding in for tries and the scrums if it's union. Only as a last resort thanks!

.strops itlum fo sseldrager etaroireted ot eunitnoc lliw hctip ehT

 

[WisBee]

................?os yhw...........................



(....no, I haven't been taking Welsh tablets.................)






what about taking out a 99-year sub-lease from the RFU, and have Twickenham as our home ground.......we could sell GP, have money in our pockets, and actually be able to move forward in a decent ground, with all the capacity we could ever need.............?


someone tell me why not..................where does this fall down?.......

 

[wanderer paul]

richmond council won't allow football at twickenham, and the RFU of England won't allow it either....................................

 

[rebus]

and the RFU of England won't allow it either....................................

They would allow it in like a shot if they thought for one minute the council would let them. Unfortunately Richmomd Council still think football is like it was in 1985.

So Rod Stewart at Twickenham it is then...

 

[The H]

we'd have had more tries against Italy..... :laugh:

 

[muchtodonow]

................?os yhw...........................



...I want tnaw taht snaeco sti ,revir a ees I