Igor Thiago

[stomalomalus]

IT has had an xG of 3.1 over the season so far...so it's not like he's awful, he's just being teamed up. His xG/90 is also not too far off last season, 0.52, compared to 0.56 last season. He just slightly overperformed last season, and is slightly under so far this season. +1.4 last year, -2.1 so far this.

But if he scores a few, suddenly that'll look different.

He's being ganged up on, and it doesn't help that we're being ganged up on, too, as a big threat this season.

 

[brentford born & bred]

People can dress it up and put a positive spin on it as much as they like. Working hard. Great holding up play. Brings others into it, etc,etc. no one is questioning his effort

But your no. 9 is there to score goals. And he isn't. Nor does he look like doing so. Form is temporary and class is permanent we know, but anyone saying they're happy with how he's been this season isn't being truthful, imo

I think Matt Benham would disagree with you.

Everton news: Brentford owner Matthew Benham on Beto

Everton news: Brentford owner Matthew Benham on Beto

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[w6bee]

Ever since the first call up to Brazil around the middle of March, it seems to have changed for Igor. He has scored 2 non-pen goals since in about15 games (with one off his butt).

I am not sure if he has been over thinking things since or teams just worked out how to counter him (or maybe a bit of both).

 

[jlove]

Ever since the first call up to Brazil around the middle of March, it seems to have changed for Igor. He has scored 2 non-pen goals since in about15 games (with one off his butt).

I am not sure if he has been over thinking things since or teams just worked out how to counter him (or maybe a bit of both).

He can't be expected to perform miracles when two opposition centre backs have free rein to mark him. Schade always provides more pressure on those CB's but we've been swapping about with the other wide attacker and attacking midfielder. The whole attack needs to settle into a unit playing together, then there'll be more opportunities for that unit to score goals, onto which you can overlay Keith's chaos, like Lewis-Potter's goal yesterday.

 

[GABS]

He failed the "eye test" for a lot of us yesterday. I was interested to see what a couple of the main stats sites rated him at, also compared to his teammates, interesting stuff TBF

 

[VML87]

Toney > Thiago sorry

 

[alexinho]

Toney > Thiago sorry

Toney at his best > Thiago out of form

Toney at his worst < Thiago out of form

Thiago at his best > Toney at his best

 

[Andrelux]

Toney at his best > Thiago out of form

Toney at his worst < Thiago out of form

Thiago at his best > Toney at his best

I do think that Ivan should take a few hours of his time to give Igor a master class in how to buy a free kick when you're back to goal waiting for a clearance.
Then, Thiago >> Toney.

 

[mundee4england]

I do think that Ivan should take a few hours of his time to give Igor a master class in how to buy a free kick when you're back to goal waiting for a clearance.
Then, Thiago >> Toney.

Ivan was the absolute master at that to be fair! Everyone, including the ref, knew what was about to happen, yet most of the time a free kick was given!

 

[aawharris]

Toney > Thiago sorry

Thiago plays for us > Toney doesnt play for us

 

[VML87]

Thiago plays for us > Toney doesnt play for us

And just a heads up: mbappe is better than Thiago.

 

[VML87]

Toney at his best > Thiago out of form

Toney at his worst < Thiago out of form

Thiago at his best > Toney at his best

Not sure.

Ivan was better in the air, more creative and set pieces. Not sure who’s the better finisher. Just my opinion, I think Thiago is a fantastic striker and has won us games on his own.

 

[aawharris]

And just a heads up: mbappe is better than Thiago.

But doesnt play for us, so therefore isnt.

 

[GABS]

Toney > Thiago sorry

But... **** Brentford

 

[Banana]

I think Matt Benham would disagree with you.

Everton news: Brentford owner Matthew Benham on Beto

Everton news: Brentford owner Matthew Benham on Beto

www.bbc.co.uk

Exactly

 

[Banana]

Igor is being battered by refs this season. It's criminal.

Name my another forward that has got 4 yellows in 4 games. EVER.

And the yellow he got vs Liverpool was a crime.

 

[North London Bee]

I wonder if it’s time or even any point in a discussion with Howard Webb about how we are being perceived and treated by refs this season.

To a degree it’s a compliment as it means we’re seen as contenders but it’s also getting beyond a joke.

 

[Baubaul]

I have an appointment at Spalecsavers later on so save your jokes or call me crazy:

But I see a slow but steady improvement

- last season he was lucky a lot times scoring goals but you could see he’s technically harsh, I always joked with my friends that they need to check his passport to see if he’s really Brazilian at the amount of first touches that just bounced off him like from a training pole.

-This season he hasn’t bagged them in yet, but he’s more aware of his surroundings (looking at you Dango), as always works hard defensively and his movement in the box has improved fmpov compared to Villa; Not talking about set pieces but going forward he got in the right positions and it was just the subtle details like VVD’s presence that the he couldn’t tap it in.

I think this season it’s the second hardest album but it might be a coming of age season for a lot of players

Bonus baiting question : Would you rather have Gyokeres or Igor?

 

[ruislip bee]

Been poor pretty much all season. His first touch, hold up play has been largely sketchy, he has stopped jumping for headers and gives the defence a free run all game. His decision making on the ball has been horrible most of the time.

I think he needs to play through it, dropping him won’t help, it can turn around very quickly.

But he put in a super cross for KLP to score from. Just saying.

 

[hanworthbee]

Igor is being battered by refs this season. It's criminal.

Name my another forward that has got 4 yellows in 4 games. EVER.

And the yellow he got vs Liverpool was a crime.

Can he get a "not deliberate yellow " Vs Hull and miss the Sunderland game?

 

[Les Beeavinu]

Can he get a "not deliberate yellow " Vs Hull and miss the Sunderland game?

The 5 yellow ban is only for EPL games. For that reason.

 

[TadB]

Igor is being battered by refs this season. It's criminal.

Name my another forward that has got 4 yellows in 4 games. EVER.

And the yellow he got vs Liverpool was a crime.

It is not just Igor, it is criminal how the entire team is being treated. Every single game, even against other smaller teams we never get fair even handed treatment.

 

[lanzabee]

Ever since the first call up to Brazil around the middle of March, it seems to have changed for Igor. He has scored 2 non-pen goals since in about15 games (with one off his butt).

I am not sure if he has been over thinking things since or teams just worked out how to counter him (or maybe a bit of both).

I think it's possibly more to do with not cutting the mustard with the national team - and impact upon confidence, but who knows?

 

[Phreebee]

Bereft of confidence - happens to the best of strikers. Chances he was instinctively finishing last season are currently shanked or a moment of hesitation leads to him being crowded out or the opportunity blocked. Never a graceful player when he's struggling a bit he can look a bit clumsy.

The effort and work rate and positive attitude are still there though and he doesn't hide at all. Back him.and he will come good, his physicality and presence are vital to the way we play.

Best thing we can do is back him because he is a massive confidence player. @aawharris is correct doesn't matter if Thiago only nets half as many goals as last season if the other forwards step-up and get into double figures as oppo defences concentrate on stopping the Brazillian Battering Ram.

I don’t see a player who is ‘bereft of confidence’ - he’s certainly attracted the attention of defenders and opposition coaches this season and is having to work harder - the question is, can he go up a level? I think he can.

Remember our performance on Saturday before Yarmo got sent off. Without Schade I thought we looked more fluent, Jaidon was having flashes of brilliance, Dango was finding space and causing some havoc and Igor was moving about using his intelligence to drag defenders all over the place and link up play.

And his awareness of other players and ability to find them is helping to spread the goals across the team.

 

[beeeehive]

He was brilliant at the weekend, especially in the first half, his defending in the final third is also so important to how we play, Wilson just doesn't have that energy.

 

[mhead bee]

But he put in a super cross for KLP to score from. Just saying.

So that’s ok then? We shouldn’t think about the 5 times he was in a good position and made a bad decision giving the ball away and that he isn’t attacking the ball like he usually does or winning headers and bullying defenders?

We need him back to his best, and this can change very quickly with 1 goal, but let’s not pretend 1 good cross means all is going well with him

The reality is, we are not bombarding him with chances, I would say Dango and Kev are both hit and miss with the final product, and if IT isn’t bang on it we have an erratic strike force.

We need him smiling and leading again, at the moment he is struggling.

We all know when he is on form the other two compliment him perfectly whatever their strength and weaknesses, and Anthony has a better final ball then all of them but is still getting into his stride.

 

[mhead bee]

Toney at his best > Thiago out of form

Toney at his worst < Thiago out of form

Thiago at his best > Toney at his best

Different players.

Ivan had the X factor and has the ability to score a goal out of nothing, he was clever, crafty and had great ability to try the unexpected.

Igor is far more traditional, runs harder, more of a team player, more of a bully.

If I had money on who I wanted to score a 1 on 1 or take a pen, it’s Ivan, if I wanted a player to start for us today, I am going Igor, he suits today’s style.

 

[teesbee]

Igor is actually a very skilful footballer, IMO. At the moment though, he seems to be struggling to find that balance between using those skills to make goal opportunities for others, and being the last man waiting to stick the ball in the net. It'll come - I think this team is still settling.

 

[aslan]

Igor is being battered by refs this season. It's criminal.

Name my another forward that has got 4 yellows in 4 games. EVER.

And the yellow he got vs Liverpool was a crime.

It's absolutely mental when you look at what defenders get away with on him, he doesn't even get a freekick, and then he makes a challenge half as bad as the one the ref has just waved away and he gets booked for it!

 

[Jakalo]

Hat-trick incoming on Sunday.

 

[alexinho]

It's absolutely mental when you look at what defenders get away with on him, he doesn't even get a freekick, and then he makes a challenge half as bad as the one the ref has just waved away and he gets booked for it!

Perfect example of that on Saturday was when he won the ball absolutely fairly when the defender went shoulder to shoulder with him and lost out - immediate foul given to Liverpool. Same defender then wins a header against him less than five minutes later with both arms around his body holding him down and stopping him from jumping - nothing given. It is infuriating.

 

[TadB]

It's absolutely mental when you look at what defenders get away with on him, he doesn't even get a freekick, and then he makes a challenge half as bad as the one the ref has just waved away and he gets booked for it!

You could say that about most members of our team. When anyone protests they end up in the book - example Janelt v Liverpool.

 

[Les Beeavinu]

His last two bookings have been ridiculously soft. He'll likely get a ban soon where he should really only be on two cards.

Footnote: Mamoush has just scored a goal following a similar action that Igor got booked for on Saturday.

 

[TadB]

His last two bookings have been ridiculously soft. He'll likely get a ban soon where he should really only be on two cards.

Footnote: Mamoush has just scored a goal following a similar action that Igor got booked for on Saturday.

It is almost as if the Booking of our players is concerted action by Refereees in order to make things difficult for us. Getting our players suspended is a step up from just not giving us anything during the game. Paranoia, maybe, but to be honest I feel frustrated by it, I really feel that they do not want our club in this league,and are doing all they can to be rid of us.

 

[Miss Isabella]

It is almost as if the Booking of our players is concerted action by Refereees in order to make things difficult for us. Getting our players suspended is a step up from just not giving us anything during the game. Paranoia, maybe, but to be honest I feel frustrated by it, I really feel that they do not want our club in this league,and are doing all they can to be rid of us.

Yes I think that too.There is a feeling they want us out.

 

[Beelated]

His last two bookings have been ridiculously soft. He'll likely get a ban soon where he should really only be on two cards.

Footnote: Mamoush has just scored a goal following a similar action that Igor got booked for on Saturday.

Mr T has a habit of giving his opponent a little push as the ball is going out of play which has resulted in him getting booked for it. It’s called ‘leaving something on your opponent’ and players do it throughout the pitch during the game. The trouble is, with Mr T it’s not very subtle and as he’s a big, competitive guy it’s noticed by top referees and assistants because they expect it to happen.

This is another technique that he’s got to learn to improve.

 

[Les Beeavinu]

Mr T has a habit of giving his opponent a little push as the ball is going out of play which has resulted in him getting booked for it. It’s called ‘leaving something on your opponent’ and players do it throughout the pitch during the game. The trouble is, with Mr T it’s not very subtle and as he’s a big, competitive guy it’s noticed by top referees and assistants because they expect it to happen.

This is another technique that he’s got to learn to improve.

I don't quite get the point here, neither of the two bookings I'm referring to were for that. I can't say I've noticed it excessively either.

 

[Beelated]

I don't quite get the point here, neither of the two bookings I'm referring to were for that. I can't say I've noticed it excessively either.

This is a general idea observation on my part. It has happened on several occasions where Mr T is penalised for ‘excessive’ combativeness, although he hasn’t been booked every time.

 

[Banana]

This is a general idea observation on my part. It has happened on several occasions where Mr T is penalised for ‘excessive’ combativeness, although he hasn’t been booked every time.

I don't quite get the point here, neither of the two bookings I'm referring to were for that. I can't say I've noticed it excessively either.

Someone need to snip the 4 bookings he's had and send them to Webb for his "thoughts"

 

[hanworthbee]

Yes I think that too.There is a feeling they want us out.

I dont agree. Whatever he's doing to get himself booked just stop doing it and wise up a bit it can't be that hard . Same goes for Vitaly

 

[To Bee Someone]

I'm in a clear minority because big chance missed aside, he had a good game. Lots of hard work, good bit of hold up play at times and an assist.
It doesn't help that teams are marshalling him well even doubling up on him. This meant getting into areas where he could be more effective..like the aforementioned goal

 

[BuzzingBee95]

I'm in a clear minority because big chance missed aside, he had a good game. Lots of hard work, good bit of hold up play at times and an assist.
It doesn't help that teams are marshalling him well even doubling up on him. This meant getting into areas where he could be more effective..like the aforementioned goal

I don’t think you’re quite in the minority you think you are.

Most of us have highlighted his team play, the assist being the clear example.

We’re all just hoping he can start knocking more in again soon

 

[Les Beeavinu]

I dont agree. Whatever he's doing to get himself booked just stop doing it and wise up a bit it can't be that hard . Same goes for Vitaly

Have you seen the last two bookings? What is he supposed to do, stand still away from everyone?

 

[snorbee]

I'm in a clear minority because big chance missed aside, he had a good game. Lots of hard work, good bit of hold up play at times and an assist.
It doesn't help that teams are marshalling him well even doubling up on him. This meant getting into areas where he could be more effective..like the aforementioned goal

I’m with you on this.

 

[longtimeagobee]

It is almost as if the Booking of our players is concerted action by Refereees in order to make things difficult for us. Getting our players suspended is a step up from just not giving us anything during the game. Paranoia, maybe, but to be honest I feel frustrated by it, I really feel that they do not want our club in this league,and are doing all they can to be rid of us.

No maybe about it, that’s definitely paranoia!
Who are the mysterious “they” that want us out of the league? Not the pesky Russians interfering again

 

[Gazza Bee]

I dont agree. Whatever he's doing to get himself booked just stop doing it and wise up a bit it can't be that hard . Same goes for Vitaly

Stop challenging for the ball - yeah that'll work He gets absolutely zero protection from referees to the point where I am wondering if they all have colluded and agreed not to let him win a foul - every game he is jumped over or pulled and nothing given, ridiculous.

As for his form - just needs a goal to get him going, hopefully on Sunday as he is playing OK for the team.

 

[HMDBFC]

Like others I see a frustrated player combating against bigger stronger CBs every week without any protection from the officials. It's obviously the case that teams have worked him out and are able to stifle his hold up potential by swamping him both legally and illegally. He's never been the best at winning aerial duals and invariably he is jumping from a standing position with an opposition player either holding him or climbing all over him. IMO we play the long high ball to him too often.
KS on the other hand is fantastic at getting off the ground especially when he is able to run and jump for the ball. Why not play KS more centrally occasionally with Thiago running off him? Thiago draws defenders with him and KS might profit from the extra available time and space.
Just a thought...

 

[aawharris]

I think it's possibly more to do with not cutting the mustard with the national team - and impact upon confidence, but who knows?

I think that was all media based.
He played one game at the WC, missed a chance but played well overall and was scapegoated by the fans and press because he doesnt play for a big club

 

[JCMcBee]

I hope he scores a brace on Sunday

 

[TadB]

No maybe about it, that’s definitely paranoia!
Who are the mysterious “they” that want us out of the league? Not the pesky Russians interfering again

Quite obvious that I am referring to Referees, and in particular to their approach to the management of each of our games. If you attend games in person then you must be blind if you consider that Brentford get a fair rub of the green from the officials. I personally have given up expecting an even handed approach, and, never, getting a 50/50 decision. Sometimes decisions are outrageous where our players treatment is completely different to the opposition. Other teams are permitted to appeal to the Referee whilst anything from us is stamped on.
This last match v Liverpool was clearly a step up with the treatment of Janelt & Yarmoluk.
I suggest that you concentrate when watching the next game, or perhaps you are an armchair supporter.