Roy King's replacement

[abee]

You will be pleased to know that BU are moving into the 21st century, with work streams , finance, issues and suggestions all being transferred onto a forum like this one, enabling us to do the work and resolve issues away from Board meetings.
You never know the BFC Board might catch up soon!

I am still unsure which is the cart, which is the horse and who is the man in the driving seat with the whip in this BFC/BU partnership. I take it that the "work streams, finance, issues and suggestions" about which you write are those concerning Brentford Football Club rather than the operation of Bees United.

Let me put it another way and perhaps you could make it clearer for me.

If I know someone whom I would be anxious to recommend to the Club because in my opinion he would be a perfect replacement for Roy King and could do the jobs of King and Alistair Hill combined (and cheaper than the two of them together because he is semi-financially independent) who conducts the interviews and makes the final decision on the appointment.......Bees United (the owners), the BFC board (seemingly the executive run by non-executives) or Andrew Finch (the man responsible for delivering the operational plan).

I (along with others I suppose) have been waiting for the job to be advertised (I take it that we have heard of equal opportunities at BU and BFC) in order than formal applications can be submitted but so far........nothing. Is your idea of "moving into the 21st century" merely a slogan however and in fact it's gonna be the same old Brentford with the job being filled by "a mate of a mate". I dunno eghambee........you tell me.

We were told how wonderful King was and how vital his job was (see official programmes p9 ad nauseam) and of course the staff and management at BFC were we were advised close to collective mass suicide when King left. So in my naivety (and knowing that it was all gonna be different now) I was expecting a job description to have been posted on the official web site almost immediately following King's departure and with interviews well underway by this time. This practical and indeed very current example will be useful to me in my endeavours to understand exactly how the relationships between BU, BFC and the CEO at BFC interlock. Who makes the call, who writes the job description, who conducts the interview, who sets the remuneration package, who agrees the final contract and who ends up with the right to turn this appointment (and what I take it will be a probationary period to start with) into a permanent job by issuing in due course the now standard BFC secret side letter.

I would of course in gentler times have emailed the club but given that :-

1) The executive doesn't generally respond to emails and

2) The "weekly Q&A" has been turned into an "occasional forum" which in turn has been turned into a "never ever".....(copyright All Saints) non feature of the BFC website.

.........then it would seem to be a waste of energy.

I'm just asking like 'cos me........well I believe that the current structure is madness........I don't understand it and I cannot for the life of me fathom exactly how it works. As King's replacement is one that concerns me personally and I am keen to see these "21st century practices" (as you describe them) in operation at dear old 17th century BFC then any time that you have to educate me will be much appreciated.

 

[eghambee]

Abee,

I did not explain it properly.
I was merely talking about the notion the at people only meet 12 times a year, that is why i just quoted a very small part of the post.

My comment was irrelevant of policies etc, just saying that BU, although having on paper just 12 Board meetings a year, now use 'work streams' and a discussion forum to do the work for BU on any day they so wish, thus not having to wait for a Board Meeting to suddenly say, 'what are we doing about.......?'

My comments are about BU and BU finances, fundraising.

I am not happy about how things are done at the club but my comment about '...21st century' was purely to do with the BU Board taking the initiative on making the work of the BU Board as effective and efficient as we can.
Nothing more.

Do i think the structure is right, and the lines of responsibility are correct yet? - no.

 

[Les Beeavinu]

Is 12 people meeting 12 times better than 6 people meeting 24 times? I would've thought that a cumbersome executive actually has to meet more because there are more views to be considered and less chance of agreement. I do hope that at least some of the board members give BFC a little more attention than 12 times a year for a couple of hours.

I suppose that raises another question. What are the roles and responsibilties of the 12 board members? Greg Dyke is a "non-executive titular head". John Herting has never had any day to day involvement. Joe Bourke does the books. What specific responsibilites has everyone else got?

 

[abee]

abee,

I did not explain it properly.
I was merely talking about the notion the at people only meet 12 times a year, that is why i just quoted a very small part of the post.

My comment was irrelevant of policies etc, just saying that BU, although having on paper just 12 Board meetings a year, now use 'work streams' and a discussion forum to do the work for BU on any day they so wish, thus not having to wait for a Board Meeting to suddenly say, 'what are we doing about.......?'

My comments are about BU and BU finances, fundraising.

I am not happy about how things are done at the club but my comment about '...21st century' was purely to do with the BU Board taking the initiative on making the work of the BU Board as effective and efficient as we can.
Nothing more.

Do i think the structure is right, and the lines of responsibility are correct yet? - no.

Thanks eghambee......my mistake then. Personally I believe that 99% of the Bees fans who actually care about off the field affairs (in total maybe 3% of the support base) don't give the proverbial monkeys about how Bees United is run and are only interested in how BFC is run. Bees United for me is now just a sideshow and in my view if the "great and the good" have their way it will be consigned to the task of "raising monies and shaking buckets". In the meantime the thirteen man board will be "empowered".....(is that the current buzz word) on running around rubber stamping decisions that have already been taken.

I haven't forgotten that I promised to cover the costs of the season tickets for you and yours if things didn't change (was it by the end of the season......I can't recall right now) and I would have thought that you were well on course to collect frankly.

I'm not a "management by slogan" fan. The email that I had from Andrew Finch telling me effectively to " **** off " was signed off "Onwards and upwards" which I thought remarkable at the time but never mind.

I have always run businesses large and small with one major instruction to the management and staff and that is :-

"Sod the good news. It's the bad news that gets you into bankruptcy and I wanna hear about any five seconds after you do. I may be ****ed off but it's nothing to what I'm gonna be if you wait before telling me".

(Well it works for me anyway........ )

Meanwhile back to Roy King's replacement....is the BU board involved in this and if so when will it be advertised.

 

[eghambee]

Thanks eghambee......my mistake then. Personally I believe that 99% of the Bees fans who actually care about off the field affairs (in total maybe 3% of the support base) don't give the proverbial monkeys about how Bees United is run and are only interested in how BFC is run. Bees United for me is now just a sideshow and in my view if the "great and the good" have their way it will be consigned to the task of "raising monies and shaking buckets". In the meantime the thirteen man board will be "empowered".....(is that the current buzz word) on running around rubber stamping decisions that have already been taken.

I haven't forgotten that I promised to cover the costs of the season tickets for you and yours if things didn't change (was it by the end of the season......I can't recall right now) and I would have thought that you were well on course to collect frankly.

I'm not a "management by slogan" fan. The email that I had from Andrew Finch telling me effectively to " **** off " was signed off "Onwards and upwards" which I thought remarkable at the time but never mind.

I have always run businesses large and small with one major instruction to the management and staff and that is :-

"Sod the good news. It's the bad news that gets you into bankruptcy and I wanna hear about any five seconds after you do. I may be ****ed off but it's nothing to what I'm gonna be if you wait before telling me".

(Well it works for me anyway........ )

Meanwhile back to Roy King's replacement....is the BU board involved in this and if so when will it be advertised.

abee

I believe you are correct that people arent interested in how BU run as an organisation.
I said in an answer to the election questions that we didnt particularly need business types on the BU Board, as i would hope the BFC Board would be doing what was right.
BU has two roles,imo, and that is to fundraise and to hold the BFC Board to account where we feel the decisions are either not in the best interests of the club or we believe are not being taken at all.
We will kick and scream through our nominees to get the changes that are required.


When i see the monthly accounts i want all the BU Board to ask why?, what ? who? and things that dont look right.
When people raise concerns about freebies, employment policy etc these need to be taken up by us again.
We may be told not to worry, but we will continue to raise them as they are crucial to the perception of BU and BFC and therefore crucial for the customer base and the revenue raising efforts .

Just to put your mind at rest, we dont have any slogans that we use to do our jobs - unless you count 'that's b@ll@cks!' as a slogan!

The BU Board are not involved in any recruitment for the Ops Mgr role.
We have however, stressed that the role needs to be advertised inside and outside the club to ensure no more accusations of 'jobs for the boys' and more importantly the club might end up with the right person.

We were advised that the permanent replacement process had not started, - but as you raise it here i will find out what the current status is.

PS i wont rubber stamp anything that has already been agreed - thats not what i got involved for.
We have a good BU Board now that raises issue early enough to avoid them being too late to do anything about.

 

[rebus]

Meanwhile back to Roy King's replacement....is the BU board involved in this and if so when will it be advertised.

I take it this post has been filled then already by one of Finch's cronies? :shrug:

 

[Brickie Chap]

This would be the consultant from Fulham...GREAT....

 

[abee]

I take it this post has been filled then already by one of Finch's cronies? :shrug:

What the **** are you on about???

:sad:

 

[abee]

This would be the consultant from Fulham...GREAT....

Please tell me that you and Mark are having an elaborate joke at my expense.........

:mad1: :mad1:

 

[abee]

abee

I believe you are correct that people arent interested in how BU run as an organisation.
I said in an answer to the election questions that we didnt particularly need business types on the BU Board, as i would hope the BFC Board would be doing what was right.
BU has two roles,imo, and that is to fundraise and to hold the BFC Board to account where we feel the decisions are either not in the best interests of the club or we believe are not being taken at all.
We will kick and scream through our nominees to get the changes that are required.


When i see the monthly accounts i want all the BU Board to ask why?, what ? who? and things that dont look right.
When people raise concerns about freebies, employment policy etc these need to be taken up by us again.
We may be told not to worry, but we will continue to raise them as they are crucial to the perception of BU and BFC and therefore crucial for the customer base and the revenue raising efforts .

Just to put your mind at rest, we dont have any slogans that we use to do our jobs - unless you count 'that's b@ll@cks!' as a slogan!

The BU Board are not involved in any recruitment for the Ops Mgr role.
We have however, stressed that the role needs to be advertised inside and outside the club to ensure no more accusations of 'jobs for the boys' and more importantly the club might end up with the right person.

We were advised that the permanent replacement process had not started, - but as you raise it here i will find out what the current status is.

PS i wont rubber stamp anything that has already been agreed - thats not what i got involved for.
We have a good BU Board now that raises issue early enough to avoid them being too late to do anything about.

Thanks eghambee and I appreciate your prompt and forthright responses.

 

[Brickie Chap]

Very strong rumours from GP that a friend of Mr Finch's from his time at Fulham has been 'helping' out at GP whilst Mr King was unfit or should be be absent from his duties. As a result no job advert is being placed and this chap is/has been given the job...

 

[Edmundo]

I do hope that the process of replacing Roy King starts with getting answers to the question, "Do we need to replace Roy King?" I would have thought that we don't need another chief in there, but they could use a few more Indians.

 

[Les Beeavinu]

I do hope that the process of replacing Roy King starts with getting answers to the question, "Do we need to replace Roy King?" I would have thought that we don't need another chief in there, but they could use a few more Indians.

I'd rather have Darren Pratley.

 

[rebus]

I'd rather have Darren Pratley.

I'd rather have some more grafters in admin.

 

[abee]

Very strong rumours from GP that a friend of Mr Finch's from his time at Fulham has been 'helping' out at GP whilst Mr King was unfit or should be be absent from his duties. As a result no job advert is being placed and this chap is/has been given the job...

Hand me down my AK16........I'll be gone for a couple of hours......:mad1: :mad1:

 

[Ace Face]

Sorry abee, but with all the twits still in place from before the majority shareholding change, what did you expect?

We are losing money hand over fist and yet nobody is prepared to stand up and attempt to block a replacement for King.

Just look at the salaries some of these 9 to 5rs at the top are on and look at our turnover, BFC was and is a gravy train for some. Nice deal for Mr Hill as well.

It is criminal it really is, what is going on, but we are told BU don`t take a role in anything day to day at BFC once a budget is set.

 

[beezy babe]

There is a new operations manager in place - a Stuart Farrar I think. He was working in an 'acting' capacity while RK was on suspension and has now been employed on a month to month basis.

That's all I know though (and I may have got some of that wrong!)

 

[Banana]

There is a new operations manager in place - a Stuart Farrar I think. He was working in an 'acting' capacity while RK was on suspension and has now been employed on a month to month basis.

That's all I know though (and I may have got some of that wrong!)

Isn't everyone that is on 4 weeks notice employed on a "month to month" basis until they've been somewhere for at least a year?

 

[rebus]

The bottom line is that we do not need an Operations Manager AND a safety officer. Both jobs can be done by one person.

Having a quick look at google, Mr Farrar was safety officer at Fulham so bye bye Mr Hill, is it not?

 

[rfr100]

Out of interest, excluding all those on the playing side, what is the permanent Headcount of BFC ?

Because from my seat, we look a little top heavy.

 

[rebus]

Out of interest, excluding all those on the playing side, what is the permanent Headcount of BFC ?

Because from my seat, we look a little top heavy.

We've top heavy in senior positions, understrength in what I call the "doing" positions.

 

[jlove]

Hand me down my AK16........I'll be gone for a couple of hours......:mad1: :mad1:

You need to re-check with your armourer, abee, either an AK47 or an M16 but I'd be a bit suspicious of a "bitza" and it's accuracy!

Slightly more seriously... there should be a defined and documented process: starting with the 'needs analysis'; then the job description; then the market testing for the salary level; then open advertising of the position. As this is the first under the "New Model Army", it must be 'whiter-than-white' (no racial slur or name pun intended).

 

[JBN]

Both jobs can be done by one person.

Isn't it a bit early to be looking to recruit a school leaver

 

[Les Beeavinu]

Juts out of interest, what would a Safety Officer be doing on the 220 odd working days when there isn't a football match at GP?

 

[rebus]

Juts out of interest, what would a Safety Officer be doing on the 220 odd working days when there isn't a football match at GP?

It's quite easy, being an operations manager for the rest of the building. Why we need two people cannot be explained.

 

[rfr100]

We've top heavy in senior positions, understrength in what I call the "doing" positions.

I agree Mark, any ideas on the numbers though ?

Juts out of interest, what would a Safety Officer be doing on the 220 odd working days when there isn't a football match at GP?

Interesting point.

Although I'm sure this wouldn't be a Full Time role.
Even we're not that stupid ? :shrug:

 

[rebus]

I agree Mark, any ideas on the numbers though ?

http://www.brentfordfc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/WhosWho/0,,10421~117055,00.html

Although I'm sure this wouldn't be a Full Time role.

From what I've heard it's full time wages though.

 

[Brickie Chap]

There is a new operations manager in place - a Stuart Farrar I think. He was working in an 'acting' capacity while RK was on suspension and has now been employed on a month to month basis.

That's all I know though (and I may have got some of that wrong!)

How come Brian Burgess can boast about making http://www.beesunited.org.uk/2006/walsall040206.php tough decisions on player sales...but cant when it comes to reducing non-playing head count and unneeded salary costslol

Someone is pulling our chain

 

[abee]

How come Brian Burgess can boast about making http://www.beesunited.org.uk/2006/walsall040206.php tough decisions on player sales...but cant when it comes to reducing non-playing head count and unneeded salary costslol

Someone is pulling our chain

And it will mean staying true to our philosophy of providing opportunities for talented individuals to develop their careers, bringing success for us and them and encouraging everyone to realise their potential.

When I read that I rather assumed that Brian Burgess had the executive management at Griffin Park in his mind. In this area the Brentford tradition is that you hopelessly overpromote people by handing them remuneration packages and other benefits that they could only dream about, they come in and then "learn on the job" at our expense, fumble their way to disaster and we subsequently learn that they either have "side letters" or more likely that they can't just be drop kicked back to whence they came 'cos we can't afford to pony up the readies to see them on their way. In the meantime they bring their mates in with absolutely no control from above and on the "come and get yer snouts into this trough lads" philosophy.

However that was then and this is now.......erm..... righto then.....

 

[Brickie Chap]

I'm still blaming North London Bee...if he hadnt of put forward that **** Finch, we wouldnt be stuck with this latest wate of space

 

[Ace Face]

I am sorry to say this style of recruiting your mates has got us into the mess we are in now.

I am staggered that there is still no open and honest recruitment process.

While MA takes us forward the club is still run by amateurs on fecking good salaries laughing at us.

 

[Hungerford Bee]

I feel lucky in Google reveals - from the Fulham Website

Staff Profiles: Stuart Farrar



Position: Safety Officer
Department: Safety
Joined: 1996
Pastimes: Sailing
Ambitions: To die without having to say 'I wish I'd done that'


----- although one A. Finch is also listed

Is this some reverse takeover by stealth?

Maybe that's why there two Bentley's in the Braemar forecourt this evening

 

[chippendale]

abee

Just give up mate. looks like weve been screwed again.

I thought all jobs were going to be advertised. Lets hear from BU about this little turn of events.

abbe,

Can you pull your money out or is it in place for a set period of time.

 

[abee]

abee,

Can you pull your money out or is it in place for a set period of time.

No I wouldn't do that under any circumstances. Anyway it's for a fixed term and presently is due for repayment 31 January 2009.

I have a note in my diary to expect a call on 30 January 2009 inviting me to the directors box to enjoy the hospitality.......:bound: :bound:

 

[chippendale]

No I wouldn't do that under any circumstances. Anyway it's for a fixed term and presently is due for repayment 31 January 2009.

I have a note in my diary to expect a call on 30 January 2009 inviting me to the directors box to enjoy the hospitality.......:bound: :bound:

Believe that when I see it. rofl rofl rofl

 

[Banana]

No I wouldn't do that under any circumstances. Anyway it's for a fixed term and presently is due for repayment 31 January 2009.

I have a note in my diary to expect a call on 30 January 2009 inviting me to the directors box to enjoy the hospitality.......:bound: :bound:

Wouldn't bother abee. There was a bowl of fruit and a hot plate - really not worth it.

However I'm sure the Directors' hospitality at Charlton will mean that they up their game for any replay - just you watch. The "League One sausage rolls" will be out and the "FA Cup Sterlet caviar" will be supplied to not bring shame upon the club.

 

[abee]

Wouldn't bother abee. There was a bowl of fruit and a hot plate - really not worth it.

However I'm sure the Directors' hospitality at Charlton will mean that they up their game for any replay - just you watch. The "League One sausage rolls" will be out and the "FA Cup Sterlet caviar" will be supplied to not bring shame upon the club.

How the heck do you get invited to the boardroom???

The personal guest of whom may I ask........

 

[Banana]

How the heck do you get invited to the boardroom???

The personal guest of whom may I ask........

I'm surprised you don't know

 

[abee]

I'm surprised you don't know

No I really don't. You are not telling me that it was Bee H are you???

 

[Banana]

Rank has its privileges

 

[rambo]

I would hope that the new board of BFC would now be having a good look at the exact set up of the off field staff and exact roles that they perform. Then make some decisions about what needs to be changed and any new positions that need to be filled!

Hopefully someone on the board has already suggested this!!!

If not can some suggest that BU have have one of the directors suggest this as an urgent matter!!

Would have thought this would be a very normal process when en existing business is taken over!

 

[Banana]

I would hope that the new board of BFC would now be having a good look at the exact set up of the off field staff and exact roles that they perform. Then make some decisions about what needs to be changed and any new positions that need to be filled!

Hopefully someone on the board has already suggested this!!!

If not can some suggest that BU have have one of the directors suggest this as an urgent matter!!

Would have thought this would be a very normal process when en existing business is taken over!

You say something like
"We WERE thinking of taking over this company in 5 years - therefore all of the freeloaders can carry freeloading for 5 years - simple innit"

 

[abee]

Rank has its privileges

Well nobody's more rank than you.........

 

[abee]

I would hope that the new board of BFC would now be having a good look at the exact set up of the off field staff and exact roles that they perform.

That was supposed to be the deal.........

Don't get me anymore upset than I already am...... "I don't wanna talk about it" (copyright Rod Stewart 1977)

 

[Banana]

Well nobody's more rank than you.........

Jealously abee, pure jealously.

Next you'll be wanting an autographed copy of my book on "Successfully Delivering Leaflets - the 'Aggresive Way'"

 

[abee]

Jealously abee, pure jealously.

Next you'll be wanting an autographed copy of my book on "Successfully Delivering Leaflets - the 'Aggresive Way'"

I've just had an email advising me that the way the BFC board gets around the freeloaders problem is to dish out passes to those making the most fuss. Well as far as I'm concerned you can go and ..........(the rest of this disgusting post has been edited by the mods on the grounds that three of the acts described by abee are still illegal in the UK and the others are not suitable for publication on a website available to families. abee is hereby warned as to his future conduct)

 

[WarrenBee]

I can just picture abee in one of those Polyester ties.