What do BIAS think?

[Boston Bee]

Are we selling GP or not?

 

[Leicester Bee]

I'd like to know too please. What is this C&M deal? Who are Barratts? Why are they involved? I thought that Joe Bourke stated that GP would NOT be sold (edit) unless it was to refinance the new stadium. Does this mean the new stadium is imminent? What the FECK IS GOING ON? Why are we not blooming told what's going on, in a clear and concise manner?

 

[Brickie Chap]

Are we selling GP or not?

In my opinion, if we are ever to fully repay the debts that RN, GH & Co created, we will have to sell GP. I think this is fairly obvious.

Of course we could provide an option to sell to a particular developer without a time clause, although if you listen to BB & JM, you would think this option wasnt on any table...

 

[Banana]

Of course we could provide an option to sell to a particular developer without a time clause, although if you listen to BB & JM, you would think this option wasnt on any table...

I don't understand this "sell to a particular developer without a time clause" - so we take the money and say - see you in a few thousand years? Doesn't smell right to me.

 

[Leicester Bee]

So is this imminent then? What's the point in raising the money for GP improvements then? Why aren't the fans being told about this?

This gets worse and worse.


Move us from GP, and alot of fans will not bother, especially after the ground improvements were announced. Regardless of it, doesn't that leave us vulnerable to outside developers?

 

[Gee Bee]

Of course we could provide an option to sell to a particular developer without a time clause, although if you listen to BB & JM, you would think this option wasnt on any table...

So someone will give us cash for GP then allow us to stay indefinitely?
There has to be a catch, what is the annual rental to BFC following their purchase?

 

[Brickie Chap]

I don't understand this "sell to a particular developer without a time clause" - so we take the money and say - see you in a few thousand years? Doesn't smell right to me.

So you've never heard of a property developer building up their land bank then Waiting for more favourable planning guidelines to be in place

 

[Banana]

So you've never heard of a property developer building up their land bank then Waiting for more favourable planning guidelines to be in place

Not without the ability to occupy the land at some point.

 

[Boston Bee]

So are we selling GP or not? C'mon, people out there know and it's going to be announced to the "general public" in about 35 hours anyway.

Are we selling our only real asset so that RN can retile his patio. Or are we not selling. Are we about to sell Griffin Park or not.

 

[Gee Bee]

So you've never heard of a property developer building up their land bank then Waiting for more favourable planning guidelines to be in place

Yes, but not without a clause that allows occupation when they require it.
A time clause of 5 years as an example may be more beneficial than a period of notice to quit when it suits the developer.

 

[King Bee]

So you've never heard of a property developer building up their land bank then Waiting for more favourable planning guidelines to be in place

Absolutely right Brickie. Most property companies build up land banks with 10-15 year horizons. Not uncommon. They then press the local authority with various different plans for the site until both sides agree on one particular development scheme.

 

[Brickie Chap]

So someone will give us cash for GP then allow us to stay indefinitely?
There has to be a catch, what is the annual rental to BFC following their purchase?

I dont have a clue what might actually be on the table, I'm only asking people to consider what might be out there. Be creative folks, ask for the deal that works for us rather than a property developer, we are the ones with the asset. Land values in West London are only going to continue to rise over time. Yes there may be some fluctuations but they will rise overall in the years ahead.

As for what it will or may cost us, who knows, that would be the small print and I know I would rather have DW, a property developer, looking out for us, than either BB & JM, whose only experience in these matters is likely to have been their own personal residential property transactions...

 

[Bigbee]

The major developers will pay substantial sums to hold out option on parcels of land .A lot will never get developed ,but they of course make a fortune on the ones they get planning permission on .I wouldnt think it too difficult to tie up a deal for GP with out any dates being agreed .

 

[Banana]

I still wonder why we're not doing what anyone with interest for an asset from multiple people would be doing and that is getting a better deal by playing one off against the other.

 

[Brickie Chap]

Yes, but not without a clause that allows occupation when they require it.
A time clause of 5 years as an example may be more beneficial than a period of notice to quit when it suits the developer.

Like I've said, that would be in the small print

 

[Brickie Chap]

I still wonder why we're not doing what anyone with interest for an asset from multiple people would be doing and that is getting a better deal by playing one off against the other.

Ask JM & BB on Thursday night

 

[Lokster]

Can someone tell me who C&M are? I'd like to know. I know who Barratt's are but can't seem to find any information on this other company.

 

[SmiffyBee]

what about pushing for a ground share in Milton Keynes...we could become the MK Bees.....problem sorted

 

[Banana]

The major developers will pay substantial sums to hold out option on parcels of land .A lot will never get developed ,but they of course make a fortune on the ones they get planning permission on .I wouldnt think it too difficult to tie up a deal for GP with out any dates being agreed .

Bigbee, give me £100 to have an option to buy my house at the open market value (at the exercise date) but without me having to sell it to you if I (or anyone else) wants to live in it.

An option without an exercise date is worthless

 

[Banana]

Can someone tell me who C&M are? I'd like to know. I know who Barratt's are but can't seem to find any information on this other company.

http://www.candmhomes.com/

 

[Leicester Bee]

Hang on. So we've come to the point where the board have agreed a deal with C&M to buy some time at GP with a bit of money. Correct?

So, somebody else on the SAME board of directors has come up with a better deal and they can't work out who to use. Correct? The better deal being more money and time at GP.

So GP is not going to be sold from under our feet quite yet, but depending on the time it takes to agree the Lionel Road site, we could actually find ourselve homeless. Fooking great. Sounds like we'll be moving to Woking then.

I know, why don't we up and move to Kingstonian instead.

Basically, all this openess from the board is overwhelming. Other than it NOT being Ron Noades, it sounds like we're back to square one. Marvellous. Lucky I kept my No to Woking t-shirt. We'll be needing it again by the sounds of it.

 

[Brickie Chap]

I think its fair to say LB is not correct on his assumptions

 

[Gee Bee]

Absolutely right Brickie. Most property companies build up land banks with 10-15 year horizons. Not uncommon. They then press the local authority with various different plans for the site until both sides agree on one particular development scheme.

BFC would surely have pay a rental income to the developers for the continued use of GP as a football ground until it suited them.
I believe this is what Sothend are doing, however they have now eroded all their cash from the sale, whilst waiting for a new site to be identified, accepted and planning permission granted.
They are also always on a moments notice to quit.

 

[The H]

that's almost a straight answer BC .... is there a 'but' in there i should be worried about

 

[Boston Bee]

Really, you pompous fool? What is the deal then? Are we selling GP to one of these two? What are the totals? Why, if people know what EXACTLY is going on, can't they say? No wonder people have told BFC, BU and Brentford generally that they can't be bothered any more (well, "go **** yourselves", but whatever).

It's less than 35 hours 'til we get the news. Why don't you hypothesise what they'll say?

I think its fair to say LB is not correct on his assumptions

 

[rebus]

Joe told me last night that there'll be no sale until some fruition happens (post 42).

What he said was

Boston,

The sale of Griffin Park to whoever, is part of the financing for the new stadium, if and when that project comes to fruition.

Note the word part. This could mean: GP sold this summer for a downpayment to level the overdraft. With a time limit set on eviction, BFC will have, say 5 years to look for a new ground before the bulldozers move in.

This is exactly the same sort of deal that Ron was looking at three years ago when he tried to move us to Kingstonian.

BU know that even with the sale of GP there is too much of a gap in funding for us to build a new stadium. They know it! Time for some honesty for once...

 

[Boston Bee]

Hoorah. Sounds like where our brilliant generals are taking us.

BFC would surely have pay a rental income to the developers for the continued use of GP as a football ground until it suited them.
I believe this is what Sothend are doing, however they have now eroded all their cash from the sale, whilst waiting for a new site to be identified, accepted and planning permission granted.
They are also always on a moments notice to quit.

 

[thefatcd]

Really, you pompous fool? What is the deal then? Are we selling GP to one of these two? What are the totals? Why, if people know what EXACTLY is going on, can't they say? No wonder people have told BFC, BU and Brentford generally that they can't be bothered any more (well, "go **** yourselves", but whatever).

It's less than 35 hours 'til we get the news. Why don't you hypothesise what they'll say?

What "news" are you expecting in 35 hours time?

 

[Boston Bee]

Dude, "if and when" means not selling until there's a new development in the works. "Part" means it's some but not all of the financing.

I'm not playing silly spin games here. If we're selling GP now, we're selling now. If we're selling "if and when" then we're not selling now.

The bit about this being meaninglessly differnent from RN's plans I agree with.

What he said was



Note the word part. This could mean: GP sold this summer for a downpayment to level the overdraft. With a time limit set on eviction, BFC will have, say 5 years to look for a new ground before the bulldozers move in.

This is exactly the same sort of deal that Ron was looking at three years ago when he tried to move us to Kingstonian.

BU know that even with the sale of GP there is too much of a gap in funding for us to build a new stadium. They know it! Time for some honesty for once...

 

[Boston Bee]

Aren't we going to be let in on the situation Thursday night? You're going to go in all guns blazin', remember?

What "news" are you expecting in 35 hours time?

 

[Gee Bee]

What "news" are you expecting in 35 hours time?

Well I'm sure a question will be asked at the BU forum about this subject. Therefore the answer, even if hidden behing confidentiality clauses, will still be news.

 

[rebus]

Dude, "if and when" means not selling until there's a new development in the works. "Part" means it's some but not all of the financing.

I'm not playing silly spin games here. If we're selling GP now, we're selling now. If we're selling "if and when" then we're not selling now.

The bit about this being meaninglessly differnent from RN's plans I agree with.

Hey "dude" - I don't wish to be rude but I'm quite good at it.

Wake up and smell the coffee!

If the board are apparently talking to two developers about the SALE of Griffin Park, then that is exactly what it is. A SALE. The "If and when" bit does not come into it.

Feltham Arenas would satisfy the the Section 106 agreement and John Mac, etc know it.

 

[Banana]

Therefore the answer, even if hidden behing confidentiality clauses, will still be news.

How can a Fans' Forum hear confidential news? :scratch:

Saying that Bees United operating in "every we say most remain top-secret, we most not let anyone know what we are doing". Excellent. Bees United is the most closed organisation I know. It's an organisation where everything should be open UNLESS there is a proven case for confidentially - not the other way around.

 

[Banana]

Feltham Arenas would satisfy the the Section 106 agreement and John Mac, etc know it.

Are Woking and Kingstonian in adjoining boroughs?

 

[Boston Bee]

Fair enough (yes, you are by the way).

So it's a sale. Sorry that I'm not sufficiently in the know and care.

Joe wasn't misleading and I'm a thick pratt.

Hey "dude" - I don't wish to be rude but I'm quite good at it.

Wake up and smell the coffee!

If the board are apparently talking to two developers about the SALE of Griffin Park, then that is exactly what it is. A SALE. The "If and when" bit does not come into it.

Feltham Arenas would satisfy the the Section 106 agreement and John Mac, etc know it.

 

[Gee Bee]

How can a Fans' Forum hear confidential news? :scratch:

Saying that Bees United operating in "every we say most remain top-secret, we most not let anyone know what we are doing". Excellent. Bees United is the most closed organisation I know. It's an organisation where everything should be open UNLESS there is a proven case for confidentially - not the other way around.

What I meant was any answer that relates to this in any forum tomorrow will be considered news. I was actually being slightly sarcastic to thefatcd, who obviously knows everything from a particular persons viewpoint already.

 

[Pauly Paul]

Are Woking and Kingstonian in adjoining boroughs?

Nope. Adjoining boroughs are Ealing, Hammersmith & Fulham, Richmond, Spelthorne and Hillingdon.

 

[Banana]

Nope. Adjoining boroughs are Ealing, Hammersmith & Fulham, Richmond, Spelthorne and Hillingdon.

Viking Sports - here we come!

 

[The H]

Viking Sports - here we come!

i wonderered why they merged the women's teams

 

[abee]

And the best thing is I borrowed this £500 off my mate abee! Jesus Christ!

abee rules on personal relationships:-

1) A friend in need is a pain in the arse

2) A friend in need is no friend of mine........

 

[beesbeesbarmyarmy]

I wasn't suggesting we enter into a personal relationship, please don't flatter yourself.

Is Brentford Football Club a friend of yours?

 

[Dangerous]

What do Bias do for the fans as I have not a clue????????????????????????

 

[abee]

Is Brentford Football Club a friend of yours?

Erm.......I think of BFC as more like a very high maintenance mistress......a sort of downmarket Abi Titmuss if you follow my drift.........

 

[abee]

What do Bias do for the fans as I have not a clue????????????????????????

They write to the Club and have lots of meetings with the people there and then they er........ :scratch: ..........can I get back to you........I need to think.......

 

[Boston Bee]

abee: if there were/are people out there with substantial sums of which they might be persuaded to help BFC, do you think that selling the ground impresses them as to the board's business nous? Why do you think they started a 4-month push for £1m when they knew all along that they were just going to sell the ground anyway?

Erm.......I think of BFC as more like a very high maintenance mistress......a sort of downmarket Abi Titmuss if you follow my drift.........

 

[Bigbee]

They write to the Club and have lots of meetings with the people there and then they er........ :scratch: ..........can I get back to you........I need to think.......

lol

 

[abee]

abee: if there were/are people out there with substantial sums of which they might be persuaded to help BFC, do you think that selling the ground impresses them as to the board's business nous? Why do you think they started a 4-month push for £1m when they knew all along that they were just going to sell the ground anyway?

Exactly.....

I do not for one minute believe the rumours that certain parties perhaps feel that doing a deal with a property development company adds er.......more longevity to their tenure at BFC.

Such thoughts are baseless, unkind and almost certainly untrue.......

So there........

 

[JoeBourke]

I almost get to the point of blubbing when I read posts like this, god knows how abee and BeeH react. For ****s sake, Joe admit mistakes were made, draw a line over this, remove JM's powers and move forward otherwise eternally be damned.

Do you not appreciate the irony of the situation? Both JM and others were routinely dissmissing my and others concerns throughout the last couple of years, putting it down to jealousy or vested interests, and now you're cap in hand to the very people you were dismissive to? I know one of the investors who you've contacted that wants nothing to do with the current regime, such is his dislike of what has happened.

It is ****ing ridiculous

King Bee,

The supporters trust programme has been clear from the beginning. It is not backed by all fans with perhaps around 25% of regular supporters being members.

That management errors have been made is clear and was particularly highlighted recently with the distribution of tickets for the Southampton cup tie. Operational deficiencies at the club have been addressed with recent appointments. They do not however deflect the trust from it's principal objectives.

The BU option and the strategies for exercise have been debated ad infinitum. Consultations, public meetings, numerous articles and updates have been undertaken over the past couple of years and decisions made on the way forward.

Budgets and financial updates and explanations have been regularly posted by the club, including the 2004/2005 season budget back in August of last year. The bottomline figures for next years preliminary budget, have already been advised by the club and plans to maintain cash reserves for the close season.

The issues before us now are not entirely dissimiliar to those in the spring of 2003.

1. Seek a compromise agreement with Altonwood.
2. Withdraw from involvement and leave Altonwood to look for another exit.

I think I can guarantee you that the Bees United membership will back No. 1, if it can be done.

The supporters trust is a mutual society not a private consortium of investors, as abee has eloquently pointed out in recent days. Arrangements need to be developed so that loan investors that are supportive of the trusts aims, can have a high degree of confidence in the management at the club and are satisfied with the trusts plans for the club. Management arrangements do not in any way change the ethos or the mission of the supporters trust. I know full well what the concerns of abee and others are and have every confidence that the trust can address the issues to the satisfaction of both loan investors and the BU membership.

If Doug White has made considerable progress with a plan for the financing of the new stadium project, then I am sure it will be presented and reviewed in due course.

 

[abee]

If Doug White (or any other BFC director) (my addition and highlighting.... ) has made considerable progress with a plan for the financing of the new stadium project, then I am sure it will be presented and reviewed in due course.

The current uproar is no doubt down to the pecking order for receiving the "presentation" Joe.

Should the Bees United nominees on the BFC board discuss with the BU board first of all and then go to the BFC board with the comments of the BU board............or do they run it through the BFC board and have it either approved or kicked out and then tell the "outer circle" on the BU board what the decision is.

I know that we've done all of this before but with the excitement and all I have forgotten which is the shaftor and which the shaftee............

 

[Boston Bee]

Slipped that in there at the end, huh. Has it been decided to sell GP? Is there any truth to the widely held belief that it's just down to a bidding war between C&M and Barratts?

If Doug White has made considerable progress with a plan for the financing of the new stadium project, then I am sure it will be presented and reviewed in due course.