Andy Scott

[Guildford Bee]

Rosenoir was appointed because the Board new that the budget was too low to survive in L1 and wanted someone with experience of bringing a cash strapped side out of L2 - forward planning you might call it. Plan to fail is another description.



!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Rubbish. If he was appointed to bring us back up why was he sacked before we were relegated?

 

[To Bee Someone]

AS has enough common sense (just) to realise things need to change and I dont see him leaving any time soon. But he must find different ways for us to play. He has to bring Forster and Wood into the game more often IMo. Every team in our league hates playing against Forster, and Wood scares the shizzle out of defenders when he runs at them

 

[Doovster]

He needs to change the playing system simple as that. Read Gary Alexander's post match comments, "we don't create enough", at last someone on the inside has said it!

 

[beebopalula]

He needs to change the playing system simple as that. Read Gary Alexander's post match comments, "we don't create enough", at last someone on the inside has said it!

Woooo. I wonder if he'll be playing against Brighton?

 

[Kingston Bee]

Well if he does go there will be no shortage of takers, there are plenty of budding managers on this thread who know what they are talking about.........

 

[Ambrose_1889]

You're always biggin him up, so please answer this:

What was the point of bringing Forster on in the 87th minute ?

He isn't fit enough to play more than 20 odd minutes.

 

[mnccm]

Who would you drop for McCracken then?

I'd play him alongside Pim who has also played at a higher level. He only played 45 mins against carlisle and hasn't figured since - why? Looked alright in pre season to me. Look at the stats as well, they are the biggest pairing.

 

[Doovster]

I'd play him alongside Pim who has also played at a higher level. He only played 45 mins against carlisle and hasn't figured since - why? Looked alright in pre season to me. Look at the stats as well, they are the biggest pairing.

To be fair I think the back four are fine. Also it would extremely harsh to drop Karleigh who has been very consistant of late.

The problem is in front of the back four.

 

[bees52 bomber]

sorry but is the thread ,should he stay or go not about players over the hill ??

 

[Ambrose_1889]

I'd play him alongside Pim who has also played at a higher level. He only played 45 mins against carlisle and hasn't figured since - why? Looked alright in pre season to me. Look at the stats as well, they are the biggest pairing.

Drop Osborne? lol God, you've just lot your right to comment. He has been phenomenal so far this season and you want to drop him for McCracken for no real reason. Jesus...

 

[love and mercy]

To be fair I think the back four are fine. Also it would extremely harsh to drop Karleigh who has been very consistant of late.

The problem is in front of the back four.

and in the technical area

 

[mnccm]

To be fair I think the back four are fine. Also it would extremely harsh to drop Karleigh who has been very consistant of late.

The problem is in front of the back four.

We keep shipping goals though, whilst we aren't scoring we need to plug the back. Karleigh has played well but I still don't think experienced enough. I agree, we also look weak in other areas. I'd like to see sam saunders more, he looks creative to me. I think we have the balance wrong, the team on the whole is too young and inexperienced. Look at MK now with Hamman in the middle (38ish?), what a signing that was! We could do with someone like that in front of the back four as well.

 

[Deleted member 2202]

I think the time has come for him to go.

He seems to go one of two ways:
1) Fairly attacking play which results in us losing, e.g. the early season period last season after which we reverted to...
2) Very defensive play resulting in very few goals, but in fairness very few goals conceded. We may scrape a 1-0 but there are lots of 0-0s and 0-1s. E.g. the last few league games this season.

We need someone that can strike a balance. With the players we have we should be far higher up the league. We don't have the excuse of the lowest budget in the league any more. Also his man management is questionable at best, and dropping Richard Lee after his display in midweek was mindless, as it gives fringe players the impression that no matter what they do they won't get in the side.

I thought he did very well to get us out of League 2, but even that wasn't without its questionable moments - I'm thinking about all the defeats in the North West. And last season we owed a lot to the goalkeeping of Szczesny who must have earned us about 5-7 points on his own.

I think he's taken us as far as he can. We have good players, now we need someone to turn them into a team.

 

[To Bee Someone]

We keep shipping goals though, whilst we aren't scoring we need to plug the back. Karleigh has played well but I still don't think experienced enough. I agree, we also look weak in other areas. I'd like to see sam saunders more, he looks creative to me. I think we have the balance wrong, the team on the whole is too young and inexperienced. Look at MK now with Hamman in the middle (38ish?), what a signing that was! We could do with someone like that in front of the back four as well.

yes 1 goal in four league games. someone call a roofer, that is some leak! The back four, especially the CB pairing, is fine. we just need to sort out the midfield.

 

[Owlsmoor_Bee]

yes 1 goal in four league games. someone call a roofer, that is some leak! The back four, especially the CB pairing, is fine. we just need to sort out the midfield.

It's off topic and no for this thread but any suggestion that Karleigh should be dropped is absolutely laughable. There's no debate on this as far as I'm concerned, he's been the stand out performer so far this season.

 

[JumboJet]

Under no circumstances should he go - what a fickle lot you are - pull yourselves together and get behind the Manager and the team he has put together. Its far too early in the season for this sought of talk - show a bit of loyalty to the man who got us back into League 1 as Champions. If we go down at the end of the season - then it's time to have a re-think, but not before then.

 

[beebopalula]

Under no circumstances should he go - what a fickle lot you are - pull yourselves together and get behind the Manager and the team he has put together. Its far too early in the season for this sought of talk - show a bit of loyalty to the man who gut us back into League 1 as Champions. If we go down at the end of the season - then it's time to have a re-think, but not before then.

I 'd rather have a rethink before then.

 

[readingbee]

Under no circumstances should he go - what a fickle lot you are - pull yourselves together and get behind the Manager and the team he has put together. Its far too early in the season for this sought of talk - show a bit of loyalty to the man who gut us back into League 1 as Champions. If we go down at the end of the season - then it's time to have a re-think, but not before then.

Tell me you are joking

 

[gj]

why anyone would want to wait until we are relegated to make a change of manager is beyond me

 

[larrysigny]

He isn't fit enough to play more than 20 odd minutes.

Is that over a whole season?

 

[Hullbee]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sz28S94OrIM&feature=related

Watch this an take a chill pill

 

[Markybee]

So did I and Deano would have been my first choice this time if we did not have MB money.

Last season Southampton started with a ten point deduction and just missed the play-offs so for the me the only man for the job is Alan Pardew.

MB likes to have a big name because it brings publicity and puts the players in the shop window if we are doing well. It would also highlight them in a negative way if they continue on current form which they of course would not want plus they would be playing to impress the new manager.

Expect a change on Weds if we fail to come away from withdean with a win,
Pardew in place Thurs in time to face Charlton on Saturday.

Pardew has lots of respect for Brentford :grey:

Can't see anything on Wednesday if we lose/draw and feel Andy deserves time.

 

[longdistancebee]

Touche, how quickly some people on here forget. We have a good manager in Andy Scott, just because we have a bit of money now people have turned into cutthroats.

He is still learning his trade as a manager, I think he can still take the club further.

Good point - as others have made - re Andy's record for 08/09 and 09/10, but saying that we should give him time is like saying, yes i know we crash-landed but the pilot is still learning his trade so its ok. No, I am afraid it isnt. Andy has shown to be unable to manage at this level. I am firmly of the belief that had we not had Szczesny last season, it would have been touch and go at the end.

Yes, AS has proved to be very astute in his player database, but having got the squad, he is unable to make it work. I am not party to the dressing room, but i would be staggered if there was not a few puzzled faces - Hudson waltzes onto the bench while others are kept waiting, and just what has Lee got to do to be accepted?

No, i am sorry, it's been fun Andy, but now we need somebody who can take us somewhere. I always thought Brighton were v average, but under Poyet we see them clear top. That's the marker.

 

[marlowbee]

I for one would like AS to succeed, but as many have said our play is very predictable anyone who watches us will soon work out a game plan as how to stop us, at the moment more or less everything goes through weston as adams has not clicked, and at the moment weston is very on & off nothing comes through the middle and we hit too many long hopeful balls, AS seems unable/unwilling to change formation or tactics, we seem to be a better team
when we pass the ball than getting the ball forward early but only play a passing game rarely

 

[NorthamptonBee]

Under Noades I felt like a hinderance to the club, we fans were there to be put up with whilst he worked his magic. I've never felt it since up until Scott arrived, the mutual respect that is so important between fans and manager just isn't there and never really has been. I know I am not alone and speak to loads of fans at games etc and not one has disagreed with that perception, I really wanted Leroy to work as having such a personable fella in the hotseat makes any gains as a club feel that bit sweeter. Sadly Leroy was lacking on a few fronts and it went wrong, MA had pulled us in and for a few seasons made us believe that anything was possible, nice times, I actually that we are back to a them and us situation regarding the manager and his shocking lack of being able to make his team perform on a regular basis makes it a right hard time to follow BFC.
I'm going out to get pissed.

 

[Owlsmoor_Bee]

Andy has shown to be unable to manage at this level. I am firmly of the belief that had we not had Szczesny last season, it would have been touch and go at the end.

I'm sorry but this is utter garbage. We finished 9th last season, extremely respectable for a newly promoted team and even more so when compared to the finishing positions of the other teams promoted with us.

To suggest that Szczesny played a big part in when we finished is absolutely correct, but to find an angle to use this as a way of questioning Scott's managerial capabilities is sodding ridiculous. It's like suggesting Benitez was lucky in signing Torres because without him Liverpool wouldn't score any goals. It's an utter non-argument as far as I'm concerned and I'm getting tired of it being trotted out as some poor way of suggesting Andy's not up to managing at this level.

We're struggling at the moment and Scott is under real pressure. I wouldn't sack him now as I would expect more patience to be shown with any manager, never mind one who's already presided over two highly successful seasons. That said, performances such as last night's or the games against Hartlepool and Rochdale aren't acceptable and must be addressed urgently.

I think it's clear to most that we lack flexibility and although I accept he's a young manager learning on the job, Andy and his backroom staff must find a way of addressing this tactical flaw if we're to turn some of these tepid performances into draws and wins.

I've no idea how long to give him to resolve these problems, but I'm absolutely sure that letting him go now would be too soon.

 

[sonofabee]

We keep shipping goals though, whilst we aren't scoring we need to plug the back. Karleigh has played well but I still don't think experienced enough. I agree, we also look weak in other areas. I'd like to see sam saunders more, he looks creative to me. I think we have the balance wrong, the team on the whole is too young and inexperienced. Look at MK now with Hamman in the middle (38ish?), what a signing that was! We could do with someone like that in front of the back four as well.

Shipping goals, one in the last 5?

 

[beebopalula]

Sorry Owlsmoor but I can't agree with you. If you rely on a keeper to get you out of jail week in week out rather than good dominating performances, then you are ignoring a problem. Last year AS introduced the current highly negative style and at one stage we just couldn't score. The keeper was very important and I doubt that any other loanee in goal would have been so outstanding and our points total would have been significantly less. Personally, I'd give him October to show a significant improvement and then decide pretty quickly whether to stick with him or change.

 

[wanderer paul]

Under Noades I felt like a hinderance to the club, we fans were there to be put up with whilst he worked his magic. I've never felt it since up until Scott arrived, the mutual respect that is so important between fans and manager just isn't there and never really has been. I know I am not alone and speak to loads of fans at games etc and not one has disagreed with that perception, I really wanted Leroy to work as having such a personable fella in the hotseat makes any gains as a club feel that bit sweeter. Sadly Leroy was lacking on a few fronts and it went wrong, MA had pulled us in and for a few seasons made us believe that anything was possible, nice times, I actually that we are back to a them and us situation regarding the manager and his shocking lack of being able to make his team perform on a regular basis makes it a right hard time to follow BFC.
I'm going out to get pissed.

We were lucky against Everton, our best scalp in my time, but that was on penalties, Lee playing out of his skin and getting a huge amount of luck in that Yakubu and Fellaini were sh*te in front of goal, IF Everton had a goalscorer we'd have lost by 3 or 4 goals.

Scott is an arrogant arse. Check out the number of players that have come and gone in his period as Brentford manager, it's mind numbing. 80% all his own work. We got lucky with Wojiech, he saved our season last year, we need a good CM and a goalscorer, they won't come cheap.

We can all go on about needing a creative midfielder too now as WEB is not around to say we have Kev and Dave anymore due to a self banning i believe

 

[Owlsmoor_Bee]

Sorry Owlsmoor but I can't agree with you. If you rely on a keeper to get you out of jail week in week out rather than good dominating performances, then you are ignoring a problem. Last year AS introduced the current highly negative style and at one stage we just couldn't score. The keeper was very important and I doubt that any other loanee in goal would have been so outstanding and our points total would have been significantly less. Personally, I'd give him October to show a significant improvement and then decide pretty quickly whether to stick with him or change.

To suggest we relied on him as heavily as you are is just revisionist history as far as I'm concerned. Yes he was fantastic but to suggest that a single player was the difference between us finishing in the top ten or being stuck in a relegation fight won't wash with me I'm afraid.

Of course there were deficiencies last year but I didn't hear too many people suggesting Scott wasn't up to it after the curtain came down on the season. There's plenty suggesting that was their opinion now though. All terribly convenient if you ask me.

 

[detours]

You're always biggin him up, so please answer this:

What was the point of bringing Forster on in the 87th minute ?

When am I always 'biggin him up'? all I want is him given a 3-4 more games, that has been my position since Everton.

 

[mhead bee]

I am as frustrated as every one else but I do not buy into this sack the manager cobblers.

I have read comparisons on here about leroy and butcher but IMO there are no comparisons.

The BIG BIG BIG FKIN difference here is that AS has won us a championship and taken us to 9th last year. On top of that we have a really good squad, 2 excellent keepers, more CB's then you can shake a stick at, 3 of the best wingers in the division in weston, adams and simpson with wood and saunders as back up and 3 or our 4 forwards have a 1 in 2 goal ratio throughout their careers.

When leroy and Butcher were in charge you could tell from the pre season that we were building a complete mish mash of non league and incapable players and no manager in the world was ever going to stop them being relegated.
With Wally we had a someone who took over a very strong squad of players and turned them into a miserable hopeless rabble.

AS is different gravy. I think he is stubborn, sometimes brash, I disagree with his tactics sometimes and feel he is currently not producing, but to be fair I am more concerned about the misery of another anonymous mid table finish then i am of being in a relagation fight in 3 months time. We are in a false position and if AS does not turn it around in the next 6 weeks i will start to wonder if he has lost the players and change could be the only option.

The reality is that we will climb out of this soon enough but hopefully it will not be too late to make the season interesting. AS needs to change his formation and tactics but if he does he will be fine. Lets not chuck the baby out with the bathwater.

 

[RoyalOakBee]

Rubbish. If he was appointed to bring us back up why was he sacked before we were relegated?

Public opinion.
There were some horrible discussions regarding Leroy at the time that did nothing for us as a club. Also there was the team performances which were not good enough because they never could be because some of the players bought in were not good enough coupled with some he herited (one in particular) being overpaid and pure sh*te.
Finally there was a run of results including some shocking home defeats that just gave those who should have been removed from the club, a scapegoat!

It was a terrible appointment made for all the wrong reasons and a nice man had to go through stuff he should never have had to experience.
I was embarassed to be a Bees fan at times.

 

[sonofabee]

Public opinion.
There were some horrible discussions regarding Leroy at the time that did nothing for us as a club. Also there was the team performances which were not good enough because they never could be because some of the players bought in were not good enough coupled with some he herited (one in particular) being overpaid and pure sh*te.
Finally there was a run of results including some shocking home defeats that just gave those who should have been removed from the club, a scapegoat!

It was a terrible appointment made for all the wrong reasons and a nice man had to go through stuff he should never have had to experience.
I was embarassed to be a Bees fan at times.

You should be more embarrassed at your "I'm the only one in the know" posts!

 

[south coast bees]

I am as frustrated as every one else but I do not buy into this sack the manager cobblers.

I have read comparisons on here about leroy and butcher but IMO there are no comparisons.

The BIG BIG BIG FKIN difference here is that AS has won us a championship and taken us to 9th last year. On top of that we have a really good squad, 2 excellent keepers, more CB's then you can shake a stick at, 3 of the best wingers in the division in weston, adams and simpson with wood and saunders as back up and 3 or our 4 forwards have a 1 in 2 goal ratio throughout their careers.

When leroy and Butcher were in charge you could tell from the pre season that we were building a complete mish mash of non league and incapable players and no manager in the world was ever going to stop them being relegated.
With Wally we had a someone who took over a very strong squad of players and turned them into a miserable hopeless rabble.

AS is different gravy. I think he is stubborn, sometimes brash, I disagree with his tactics sometimes and feel he is currently not producing, but to be fair I am more concerned about the misery of another anonymous mid table finish then i am of being in a relagation fight in 3 months time. We are in a false position and if AS does not turn it around in the next 6 weeks i will start to wonder if he has lost the players and change could be the only option.

The reality is that we will climb out of this soon enough but hopefully it will not be too late to make the season interesting. AS needs to change his formation and tactics but if he does he will be fine. Lets not chuck the baby out with the bathwater.

I second everything written by mhead bee, AS must be given time to turn things around,no need to panic yet.

 

[Wise old Bee]

Under no circumstances should he go - what a fickle lot you are - pull yourselves together and get behind the Manager and the team he has put together. Its far too early in the season for this sought of talk - show a bit of loyalty to the man who got us back into League 1 as Champions. If we go down at the end of the season - then it's time to have a re-think, but not before then.

It doesn't work like that I'm afraid. Managers who have had success at GP like Bill Dodgin and Phil Holder have been sacked pretty ruthlessly in the past and there is no room for sentiment when things are clearly not working out. To wait and see how the season ends is far too risky and I would make a decision based on the next six games.

 

[nick logan]

) I won't be back to watch my team till this pratt is sacked.

See ya

 

[longdistancebee]

I'm sorry but this is utter garbage. We finished 9th last season, extremely respectable for a newly promoted team and even more so when compared to the finishing positions of the other teams promoted with us.

To suggest that Szczesny played a big part in when we finished is absolutely correct, but to find an angle to use this as a way of questioning Scott's managerial capabilities is sodding ridiculous. It's like suggesting Benitez was lucky in signing Torres because without him Liverpool wouldn't score any goals. It's an utter non-argument as far as I'm concerned and I'm getting tired of it being trotted out as some poor way of suggesting Andy's not up to managing at this level.

We're struggling at the moment and Scott is under real pressure. I wouldn't sack him now as I would expect more patience to be shown with any manager, never mind one who's already presided over two highly successful seasons. That said, performances such as last night's or the games against Hartlepool and Rochdale aren't acceptable and must be addressed urgently.

I think it's clear to most that we lack flexibility and although I accept he's a young manager learning on the job, Andy and his backroom staff must find a way of addressing this tactical flaw if we're to turn some of these tepid performances into draws and wins.

I've no idea how long to give him to resolve these problems, but I'm absolutely sure that letting him go now would be too soon.

Thank you Owlsmoor, for your considered reply! I would however take issue on two points: firstly, my reference to Chesney was more to reinforce the veiw that we would not have finished nearly so high had it not been for the Pole in goal, and then we would have been saying, well, we finished our first season back in Lg 1 in, say 19th. Not brilliant, but we survived. - just.

My second point is that i do not think we have the luxury of giving AS any more time. Brilliant as the results against Hull and Everton were, they are only concealing the truth: we have played eight games, won only one, scored only four goals (although thankfully we are not shipping them alarmingly either), and are in the bottom four. It is your prerogative to adopt a somewhat Micawberish approach and hope something will happen, but i believe that he has had enough time.

However, lets wait until after Brighton and Charlton. If we get four or more points, maybe your way will prove to be the right option. If, as i fear, we get rogered on both occasions, i will await your response with interest!!

 

[detours]

To people that are saying 'he has shown that he cant manage at this level' really?

We finished 9th last season, if that is not a decent achievement I dont know what is. We have put in some great performances so far this season and have a good squad, AS just needs to transfer it into wins in the league.

I dont think we will make the play offs this season now, but I still have faith that AS will come good. I think if we sack him now, after he has done well the past 2 seasons would just lead to instability and us possibly getting relegated, which is something I dont want to even consider at the moment.

 

[JimLevack]

It's not often I feel compelled to write on the gpg these days but some of the posts on this thread beggar belief.
It's strange that a manager who won us the title and finished ninth in a tough division last is now being publicly pilloried.
I have worked with brentford managers since perryman and yes I have had a few fall outs With andy Scott but I can honestly say he is totally committed to the club, has a strong feeling for the fans and has, for the most part, brought in some decent players.
Stubborn he may be but only publicly....privately he will be questioning himself and seeking the views of bullivant and co.
He is arguably one of the best young managers about so I'm frankly staggered that people are reaching for the ejector seat button eight games in.
Four goals scored is worrying but at least it's a tangible and solvable problem that will be sorted with a tweak here and there.
I am an eternal pessimist when it comes to brentford as Scott himself will testify but to get rid of him now would be a huge mistake.
I still believe we will be top seven but you have to keep the faith.

 

[wayfarer172]

Under no circumstances should he go - what a fickle lot you are - pull yourselves together and get behind the Manager and the team he has put together. Its far too early in the season for this sought of talk - show a bit of loyalty to the man who got us back into League 1 as Champions. If we go down at the end of the season - then it's time to have a re-think, but not before then.

So what you are saying is, we get relgated first then sack AS? That is what you are saying isn't it? If so you are talking nonsense.

 

[Wise old Bee]

Four goals scored is worrying but at least it's a tangible and solvable problem that will be sorted with a tweak here and there.

Wise words Jim but surely the problems are more fundamental and require more than just a tweak. It's the inability to respond during games with anything other than late substitutions. The size of our squad should be a major strength but we appear to be wasting it. I am also less than convinced by the over-reliance on loan players over the last two seasons. It may have worked to an extent but does nothing for squad morale and the present situation regarding the goalkeeping position does not help at all.

 

[2826 claire]

Haven't read everything but are you all buying this Forster stomach problem story? IF it is true - and I am VERY cynical about this - then I think it raises even more questions about Scott's decisions.

If he can only play 20 minutes, then why not give him 20 minutes rather than 4?

If he can only play 4 then why are the likes of Saunders being dropped from the bench for someone that can only play that amount of time?

Either way is it's not good IMO

 

[nick logan]

Only came on to escape x factor , but some posts on here are ludicrous. The lack of respect towards a manager who has done so well for us is staggering. To call for him to be sacked is just madness. . All the players talk of how this is the best spirit in any squad they have played in but according to the experts on here everyone is unhappy. We have 2 defeats in 8 games and let in 2 goals in 5 gamesffs. Last night was gutting but we didn't deserve to lose. I don't understand this dislike of a good young manager.

 

[beebopalula]

Only came on to escape x factor , but some posts on here are ludicrous. The lack of respect towards a manager who has done so well for us is staggering. To call for him to be sacked is just madness. . All the players talk of how this is the best spirit in any squad they have played in but according to the experts on here everyone is unhappy. We have 2 defeats in 8 games and let in 2 goals in 5 gamesffs. Last night was gutting but we didn't deserve to lose. I don't understand this dislike of a good young manager.

Just out of interest Nick, at what point would you consider that we might have to part company with a manager?

 

[2826 claire]

To suggest we relied on him as heavily as you are is just revisionist history as far as I'm concerned.

Scott himself said he earnt us at least 10 points. Take them away from the 62 we finished with we would have ended on 52, 2 points above relegation. Them's the facts

 

[brooks]

Only came on to escape x factor , but some posts on here are ludicrous. The lack of respect towards a manager who has done so well for us is staggering. To call for him to be sacked is just madness. . All the players talk of how this is the best spirit in any squad they have played in but according to the experts on here everyone is unhappy. We have 2 defeats in 8 games and let in 2 goals in 5 gamesffs. Last night was gutting but we didn't deserve to lose. I don't understand this dislike of a good young manager.

Actually, 2 in 7.

 

[sonofabee]

Only came on to escape x factor , but some posts on here are ludicrous. The lack of respect towards a manager who has done so well for us is staggering. To call for him to be sacked is just madness. . All the players talk of how this is the best spirit in any squad they have played in but according to the experts on here everyone is unhappy. We have 2 defeats in 8 games and let in 2 goals in 5 gamesffs. Last night was gutting but we didn't deserve to lose. I don't understand this dislike of a good young manager.

I'm with you on this one, it's turning into a witch hunt

 

[westwing]

Scott must stay

 

[Ealingbee]

I'm with you on this one, it's turning into a witch hunt

Agree, and nobody can seem to put forward a decent alternative.

It just seems to be get him out with no care or consideration on who should replace him