Clark Masters

[Holysmit]

Nelson has had his chance, he had enough before the season started but I thought he deserved another chance under Leroy. In the last 3 games, he should have saved Knight's second and has had two very bad rushes of blood to the head, which has seen a Bournemouth player shoot over and a Luton player shoot wide. Masters looks to be the future for the number one jersey anyway and it would be better to get him in now. Before Nelson makes it third time lucky for Chesterfield on Saturday with one of his rushes of blood to the head.

 

[The H]

i'd drop O'connor too, he let Knight cut inside and last night his team conceded 3 to Luton...

 

[Les Beeavinu]

So you would weaken a side short on experience further by putting a 19 year old goalkeeper in? Sorry, I can't agree with that. That would be bad for the team and potentially disastrous for Masters. I can't see that Nelson's done too much wrong this season and I've actually been impressed with his claiming of catches which seems to have improved.

 

[Inappropriate Smilies Bee]

completely agree (with holysmit). masters should definitely have a run in the team. how many chances does stuart nelson get before he is dropped!!!?!?!??!

 

[Edmundo]

Time to hand the captaincy to Carder-Andrews, I think.

 

[bigmac]

Its a huge ask to throw in a kid in a team that is so inexperienced, i know they can only get experience from playing, but we can't have so many. I can understand what you are saying but I think it would be a mistake at the moment to put in Master's instead of Nelson. Let him be around the first team, and take his chance when called upon, but too big a risk at the moment. In the future he will be fantastic for us.

 

[golferbee]

Have to say that on Master's performance in the 1st game of season, b'cos of Nelson being suspended i thought it slightly harsh to drop him to the bench as soon as Nels's suspension was over.

In saying that i think Nels has performed well, and is deserving of his place in the starting 11, i am with Les Beavinu nelson has the experience and with the team we have and the players we have brought in we do need som e stability in goal.

 

[jay1310]

Nelson has had his chance, he had enough before the season started but I thought he deserved another chance under Leroy. In the last 3 games, he should have saved Knight's second and has had two very bad rushes of blood to the head, which has seen a Bournemouth player shoot over and a Luton player shoot wide. Masters looks to be the future for the number one jersey anyway and it would be better to get him in now. Before Nelson makes it third time lucky for Chesterfield on Saturday with one of his rushes of blood to the head.

Why should he had saved the two against Swansea they were two quality strikes?
The second in particular, Knight should not have even got the shot off - there was two defenders near him!
As always its the easy player to blame...........

 

[nocoat]

Nelson is proper sh*t lol

People always go on about the saves keepers make as if another keeper in their position would never had made those saves, equally with mistakes I grant you.

I say give the other lad a run

 

[golferbee]

Get back to work, stop slacking, just cos the missus is away!!!!


rofl

 

[North London Bee]

Nelson is an above average keeper for a Div one team.

Believe me we have more pressing problems in the squad than the keeper !

What we need is MORE experience rather than less.

Nelson has performed reasonably well so far and in my view the time is not right to drop him.

Masters's time will come - but not yet.

 

[jay1310]

Get back to work, stop slacking, just cos the missus is away!!!!


rofl

lol
I am working thanks.....

 

[golferbee]

must be the lunch break!!!

 

[Holysmit]

First thing i'll say about age. If your good enough your old enough and I think Masters is good enough.

Also i'm not blaming him for the first Swansea goal only the second. His rushes of blood to the head versus both Bournemouth and Luton were so poor it was untrue. The man has made many mistakes before and to be honest as quite simply isn't good enough. How many times are we going to let him off, he has continually made clangers since the first time he played for the club and was sent off on his debut. I agree about experience but can Nelson's erratic running about all over the place be a calming influence for the young players? The man is a hot head and that is just as un settling as a young inexperienced but very talented young goalkeeper.

 

[Westlad]

and why not drop Kuffour he hasn't scored in three matches

 

[jay1310]

First thing i'll say about age. If your good enough your old enough and I think Masters is good enough.

Also i'm not blaming him for the first Swansea goal only the second. His rushes of blood to the head versus both Bournemouth and Luton were so poor it was untrue. The man has made many mistakes before and to be honest as quite simply isn't good enough. How many times are we going to let him off, he has continually made clangers since the first time he played for the club and was sent off on his debut. I agree about experience but can Nelson's erratic running about all over the place be a calming influence for the young players? The man is a hot head and that is just as un settling as a young inexperienced but very talented young goalkeeper.

OK, fair enough, if you are good enough you are old enough.
I agree Masters had a good debut, IMO though he was lucky on a couple of times in the first half, where the ball fell kindly to him - would you be saying that if he wasn't so lucky?

 

[jay1310]

and why not drop Kuffour he hasn't scored in three matches

Theres an idea

lol

 

[red'n'white rick]

How many times has nelson saved us this season??????????????

 

[Holysmit]

I can accept peoples arguement over experience fair enough but as I said on another thread. When we have O'Connor, Frampton, Heywood and Griffiths fit it is hardly a young defence in front of him.

As I said before if your good enough your old enough and I genuinely believe that. I personally think Masters is good enough.

While I can accept the experience arguement, I personally think players should be picked on peformance. Ok in the main you do need some experience but players like Heywood, O'Connor, Frampton, Pinault, Brooker, Owusu and Kuffour have all played for several season now and are all experienced players. They are all also in my eyes first team players so when they are all fit I don't think we'll be that short of experience. Anyway it didn't stop Man Utd winning the league years back did it? Ok in the main you do need experience but it isn't the most important thing talent. When it comes to goalkeeper it should be who is least likely to make a mistake and cost us a goal. At the moment with the way Nelson is reacting (and the mistakes he made in the past) I think Masters is least likely to make a mistake. Nelson has always been a hot head and prone to a mistake and I haven't seen anything to suggest that this will change. Until he can work on that he's had his chance here imo.

I personally think we have a team which if we keep together the main frame of it for two years will be very good. However that will only be if they get games under thier belt. As Masters isn't going to be loaned out how else is he going to learn?

 

[The H]

O'Connor was at fault for the 2nd Swansea goal, but we can't have any of that can we...

 

[North London Bee]

I can accept peoples arguement over experience fair enough but as I said on another thread. When we have O'Connor, Frampton, Heywood and Griffiths fit it is hardly a young defence in front of him.

As I said before if your good enough your old enough and I genuinely believe that. I personally think Masters is good enough.

While I can accept the experience arguement, I personally think players should be picked on peformance. When it comes to goalkeeper it should be who is least likely to make a mistake and cost us a goal. At the moment with the way Nelson is reacting (and the mistakes he made in the past) I think Masters is least likely to make a mistake. Nelson has always been a hot head and prone to a mistake and I haven't seen anything to suggest that this will change. Until he can work on that he's had his chance here imo.

Quick question - beyond the Blackpool game where he showed that he had a good temperament a reasonable technique and a streak of good fortune, how much more have you seen of Clark to justify him being given a run in the team?

 

[NorthamptonBee]

How many times has nelson saved us this season??????????????

Massively at Orient even though he had a rush to the head there also, loads of times at Scunny, 3 or 4 top saves at Northampton spring off the head easily.
Nelson looks far more at ease than last season.

 

[Holysmit]

Quick question - beyond the Blackpool game where he showed that he had a good temperament a reasonable technique and a streak of good fortune, how much more have you seen of Clark to justify him being given a run in the team?

I saw him briefly play against Leyton Orient in a pre season friendly last season. I thought he was excellent on crosses (that was all he had to do during the game) and looked very calm on it. I have also read very favourable match reports on him from his time on loan last season. Furthermore I spoke to another gpger who is a regular down the training ground (I won't name him thats up to him to come forward if he wants to) who didn't see the Blackpool game but last night stated that Masters looks a much better keeper then Nelson. This was before the rush of blood to the head as well.

Now I know this isn't going to a game NLB but i'm sure a man who knows football so well yourself, must have formed opinions on young players who you hadn't seen that much from reading reports and having been told things about them by other people. Although obviously they probably have more merit then this but you have more resources then me on this matters.

Personally it is also down to the fact that I don't rate Nelson, I don't think he's good enough and these rushes of blood to the head aren't a new thing. I wouldn't adovacate playing Masters if I didn't genuinely believe that Nelson isn't up to it anyway.

Some people will disagree with me on this and others won't. Some people don't like Brooker but I do, so its only fair that they defend Nelson, I personally think that he isn't good enough.

 

[Westlad]

It's the old problem of always blaming the keeper. He needs to make one mistake and everyone notices, a striker can miss a chance and then tuck one away and everyone will think he's Brentford's answer and is going to the premiership in January

 

[golferbee]

fair enough some poeple dont rate certain players

if you weigh up the number of times nelson has saved us this sesaon and last season then i think he is the obvious choice,
i also believe that to gain experience you need to play.
If Masters is best than Nelson, i have only seen him against Blackpool, then surely big Jim Stannard will be nagging in LR's ear to get Masters between the sticks. Afterall if we don't concede we won't lose!!

 

[The H]

i always thought that Sam Moore was better than Masters

ps in Training, the only time you really see Masters is in the 11-a-side matches, where Nelson has nothing to do :shrug:

 

[jay1310]

Quick question - beyond the Blackpool game where he showed that he had a good temperament a reasonable technique and a streak of good fortune, how much more have you seen of Clark to justify him being given a run in the team?

So Holysmit, you think that he should be the number one on one match plus a little from a friendly when he only had to deal with a few crosses... impressive....

Have you thought about being a Scout for the club

 

[North London Bee]

I saw him briefly play against Leyton Orient in a pre season friendly last season. I thought he was excellent on crosses (that was all he had to do during the game) and looked very calm on it. I have also read very favourable match reports on him from his time on loan last season. Furthermore I spoke to another gpger who is a regular down the training ground (I won't name him thats up to him to come forward if he wants to) who didn't see the Blackpool game but last night stated that Masters looks a much better keeper then Nelson. This was before the rush of blood to the head as well.

Now I know this isn't going to a game NLB but i'm sure a man who knows football so well yourself, must have formed opinions on young players who you hadn't seen that much from reading reports and having been told things about them by other people. Although obviously they probably have more merit then this but you have more resources then me on this matters.

Personally it is also down to the fact that I don't rate Nelson, I don't think he's good enough and these rushes of blood to the head aren't a new thing. I wouldn't adovacate playing Masters if I didn't genuinely believe that Nelson isn't up to it anyway.

Some people will disagree with me on this and others won't. Some people don't like Brooker but I do, so its only fair that they defend Nelson, I personally think that he isn't good enough.

I genuinely have not made my mind up about him.

There have been a litany of mistakes over the past couple of seasons but there is also an immense potential to work with.

I find him exasperating and not as sound as I like my keepers to be.

I much prefer the safe and consistent to the flashy and inconsistent.

I know from a horse's mouth that Nelson's coaching last season was poor in the extreme and assuming that this situation has been rectified I want to give him this season to prove his potential andput in a series of consistent performances.

In my view to a degree he has already done so.

Masters might well be the better bet in the long term and hopefully training ground performances might mean that he puts more pressure upon the incumbent.

I suspect that Masters will get a little run of games later thsi season when it will be up to him to prove his case but for the present, as I said, I would stick with Nelson as we have far more pressing problems than easing yet another youngster into the team.

 

[Simon W]

Its funny that a minority on here seem to really have it in for Nelson

They seem to remember the mistakes he makes but seem to forget the blinding saves and stops he makes on a regular basis ..

I appreciate that everyone has an opinion and that they are entitled to make it .. but like its been said .. we have far more worrying positions to worry about ... 3 homes games and no goals scored.

If we had a keeper who never made mistakes , always pulled off blinding saves , kicked accurately and had teflon gloves at corners .... he would be playing in the Premiership and not for us..

Also .. I know Masters was man of the match against Blackpool and quite rightly so .. but I seem to remember he rode his luck quite a few times when he spilled a few saves and looked quite nervy at times ..

 

[nocoat]

People always go on about the saves keepers make as if another keeper in their position would never had made those saves, equally with mistakes I grant you.

How many times has nelson saved us this season??????????????

if you weigh up the number of times nelson has saved us this sesaon and last season then i think he is the obvious choice,

Its funny that a minority on here seem to really have it in for Nelson

They seem to remember the mistakes he makes but seem to forget the blinding saves and stops he makes on a regular basis ..

Golfer bee, weigh up what exactly?????????????? Are you talking about the number of times he has saved the ball? lol

 

[Holysmit]

So Holysmit, you think that he should be the number one on one match plus a little from a friendly when he only had to deal with a few crosses... impressive....

Have you thought about being a Scout for the club

Yes but i'm also basing it due to my views on Nelson as well who I have seen plenty of times. I will agree that I think Nelson is improving on the techincal side of his game this season, however its his temperament that I think will always be the problem and I see no signs of that improving. As long as he has that problem I don't feel safe with him in goal and in my eyes if you don't feel safe with a keeper in goal there not good enough. Nelson has been given his chances, I think its time Master was given his. If he doesn't play soon hopefully, he'll get some time in the LDV where he'll prove his worth.

I geniunely hope and believe that by the end of this season Masters will prove his worth as number one as sadly in my eyes Nelson hasn't proved this to me yet.

 

[golferbee]

yeah, thats what keepers do isn't it??? well at least they try to

 

[jay1310]

Yes but i'm also basing it due to my views on Nelson as well who I have seen plenty of times. I will agree that I think Nelson is improving on the techincal side of his game this season, however its his temperament that I think will always be the problem and I see no signs of that improving. As long as he has that problem I don't feel safe with him in goal and in my eyes if you don't feel safe with a keeper in goal there not good enough. Nelson has been given his chances, I think its time Master was given his. If he doesn't play soon hopefully, he'll get some time in the LDV where he'll prove his worth.

I geniunely hope and believe that by the end of this season Masters will prove his worth as number one as sadly in my eyes Nelson hasn't proved this to me yet.

So in affect you would drop Nelson for his temperament?
I disagree, I think Nelson is a good keeper and regularly makes good saves and I dont see that many mistakes that he has made to warrent the team lacking the confidence in him to be honest......

I also believe that another area of the pitch needs addressing before the goalkeeper...... the lack of goals in the last three games is the biggest worry!

 

[Holysmit]

So in affect you would drop Nelson for his temperament?
I disagree, I think Nelson is a good keeper and regularly makes good saves and I dont see that many mistakes that he has made to warrent the team lacking the confidence in him to be honest......

I also believe that another area of the pitch needs addressing before the goalkeeper...... the lack of goals in the last three games is the biggest worry!

Temperament is a big thing when it comes to any sports man, in particular a goalkeeper. A rush of the blood to the head is a huge deal for the goalkeeper and he is very lucky that neither Luton or Bournemouth didn't score because of it. There was no need for what he did on either occasion.

Also his descion to rush out last week against Swansea against and through himself at Leon Britton could have got him sent off, how good would it have been to have him suspended for four games. Nelson makes mistakes because of his temperment and they have cost us on numerous occasions, when dealing with crosses etc. This is as I have mentioned unsettling for defenders and can't exactly be considered a calming influence on the younger players thanks to this.

Other people are angry with Chris Moore and that was due to his temperament last night what makes that any difference.

Nelson is let down by his tempermant, it clouds his judgements and he is prone to errors due to it, if he doesn't sort that out he will always be a liablity.

 

[Holysmit]

I also believe that another area of the pitch needs addressing before the goalkeeper...... the lack of goals in the last three games is the biggest worry!

[/QUOTE]

I agree about that but two things firstly on line with goalkeeping, in the last three games we have come up against three excellent goalkeepers. Gurrett who is one of the top two in the division (between him and Smithy) who's command of the area was excellent and stopped two very realistic goal chances. One a low cross on the 6 yard box which he claimed (something Nelson didn't do last night). Secondly Stewart of Bournemouth who was solid rather then inspired and was a calm and effiecent goalkeeper and Marlon Beresford who should be playing for a much better club then Luton in all honesty. All three keepers are calm and focused and do their job, they don't get carried away with rushes of blood to the head they focus on doing their job and letting there defence do the rest.

Secondly we need a big bloke upfront to help Joe out. I saw Winjhard at the ground last night and I took that as a sign that he'll probably sign and he was huge and looks like exactly the sort of player we need .

 

[Matty D]

in the last three games we have come up against three excellent goalkeepers. Gurrett who is one of the top two in the division (between him and Smithy) who's command of the area was excellent and stopped two very realistic goal chances. One a low cross on the 6 yard box which he claimed (something Nelson didn't do last night). Secondly Stewart of Bournemouth who was solid rather then inspired and was a calm and effiecent goalkeeper and Marlon Beresford who should be playing for a much better club then Luton in all honesty. All three keepers are calm and focused and do their job, they don't get carried away with rushes of blood to the head they focus on doing their job and letting there defence do the rest.

Stewart is regarded as a liability by Bournemouth fans, and most Northampton fans went away from the game at Sixfields saying "I wish we had a keeper like Nelson". (OK partly becasue a clanger from theirs cost them the game, but equally Nelson won it with a string of great saves).

 

[jay1310]

Temperament is a big thing when it comes to any sports man, in particular a goalkeeper. A rush of the blood to the head is a huge deal for the goalkeeper and he is very lucky that neither Luton or Bournemouth didn't score because of it. There was no need for what he did on either occasion.

Also his descion to rush out last week against Swansea against and through himself at Leon Britton could have got him sent off, how good would it have been to have him suspended for four games. Nelson makes mistakes because of his temperment and they have cost us on numerous occasions, when dealing with crosses etc. This is as I have mentioned unsettling for defenders and can't exactly be considered a calming influence on the younger players thanks to this.

Other people are angry with Chris Moore and that was due to his temperament last night what makes that any difference.

Nelson is let down by his tempermant, it clouds his judgements and he is prone to errors due to it, if he doesn't sort that out he will always be a liablity.

I wouldn't drop Nelson for his temperament though it would be for the goalkeeping in general, which on whole has been good this season. Yes he maybe could have done better for a couple of goals but.... mistakes happen.

I certainly wouldn't drop Nelson for the unknown quantity that Masters is, one appearance in which he played well, but was fortunate with the way the ball fell favourably on a couple of occasions.

 

[jay1310]

Stewart is regarded as a liability by Bournemouth fans, and most Northampton fans went away from the game at Sixfields saying "I wish we had a keeper like Nelson". (OK partly becasue a clanger from theirs cost them the game, but equally Nelson won it with a string of great saves).

 

[Holysmit]

Stewart is regarded as a liability by Bournemouth fans, and most Northampton fans went away from the game at Sixfields saying "I wish we had a keeper like Nelson". (OK partly becasue a clanger from theirs cost them the game, but equally Nelson won it with a string of great saves).

Thats a good point well made and obviously i've only seen Stewart twice that I can remember (not sure if he played at GP last year as well) so I can see your point. I didn't see the Northampton game so can't comment, however sadly the only time I felt Nelson played well during his time with us was towards the very end of Allen's first full season in charge. Since then his peformances have gone back to his more regular standard, makes some decent saves and occaisonally good on crosses for a while then horrible clangers and not great at dealing with crosses for a while. He's not consistent enough and he has cost us far too many times due to basic errors to still be number one without being dropped once.

Although it's unclear whether he was dropped for Bankhole last year before the Forest and Huddersfield games.

 

[Holysmit]

I wouldn't drop Nelson for his temperament though it would be for the goalkeeping in general, which on whole has been good this season. Yes he maybe could have done better for a couple of goals but.... mistakes happen.

I certainly wouldn't drop Nelson for the unknown quantity that Masters is, one appearance in which he played well, but was fortunate with the way the ball fell favourably on a couple of occasions.

I would say his temperament affect his goalkeeping in general. We're never gonna agree on this so agree to disagree?

 

[JBN]

So you would weaken a side short on experience further by putting a 19 year old goalkeeper in? Sorry, I can't agree with that. That would be bad for the team and potentially disastrous for Masters. I can't see that Nelson's done too much wrong this season and I've actually been impressed with his claiming of catches which seems to have improved.

I thought I was having a good day, then I find myself agreeing with Les and everything goes pearshaped.

 

[Les Beeavinu]

I thought I was having a good day, then I find myself agreeing with Les and everything goes pearshaped.

Well you can't be wrong all time can you? It's just not possible.

 

[golferbee]

I also believe that another area of the pitch needs addressing before the goalkeeper...... the lack of goals in the last three games is the biggest worry!

I agree about that but two things firstly on line with goalkeeping, in the last three games we have come up against three excellent goalkeepers. Gurrett who is one of the top two in the division (between him and Smithy) who's command of the area was excellent and stopped two very realistic goal chances. One a low cross on the 6 yard box which he claimed (something Nelson didn't do last night). Secondly Stewart of Bournemouth who was solid rather then inspired and was a calm and effiecent goalkeeper and Marlon Beresford who should be playing for a much better club then Luton in all honesty. All three keepers are calm and focused and do their job, they don't get carried away with rushes of blood to the head they focus on doing their job and letting there defence do the rest.

Just wondering whether you saw Forests first defeat?? Smith was at fault for both goals and the 2nd was an absolute howler of a msitake, he mis-judged a cross by at least 4feet and the first he spilt a low powder puff shot straight into the path of the oldham player.
I would agree the gurret is probably the best keeper in the league, i would imagine however that the majority of the 24 teams in our division would love to have nelson as their first choice keeper.

 

[jay1310]

Although it's unclear whether he was dropped for Bankhole last year before the Forest and Huddersfield games.

He was rested, if I recall correctly, if he was booked he would miss the Sunderland game in the cup. I am sure Markbfc would correct me if I am wrong!

 

[golferbee]

He was rested, if I recall correctly, if he was booked he would miss the Sunderland game in the cup. I am sure Markbfc would correct me if I am wrong!

as i was led to believe you are right he was rested, or protected for the sunderland game last season

 

[JBN]

Well you can't be wrong all time can you? It's just not possible.

I will agree with you over Nelson and I will rectify the situation and get myself back on the allways right track straight after.

 

[jay1310]

I would say his temperament affect his goalkeeping in general. We're never gonna agree on this so agree to disagree?

Fair enough

I am not saying that temperament will not effect the goalkeeping...... what I am saying is that his goalkeeping this season does not merit being dropped, especially for an unknown quantity Masters.

 

[Les Beeavinu]

I will agree with you over Nelson and I will rectify the situation and get myself back on the allways right track straight after.

I said you not I.

 

[Salford Bee]

With a back four of Charles, Heywood, Osbourne and Mousinho Nelson should play in goal. Masters should get a game in the Johnstone's Paint Trophy definately. Depending on how our season pans out if we have nothing to play for in the last 5 games then give Masters a run. When we get Frampton, Kev and Griffiths back then there is more of a case

 

[Jakalo]

You can't really have the club captain on the bench, even though I do think Masters is the better 'keeper.