GP Redevelopment

[Luton Bee]

News on the official site here Just one question, how are we going to pay for it?

 

[Simon C]

It's been said before that we have alot of unclaimed grants from the Football Trust which we can use for ground maintenance but not for building a new one.

 

[Bigbee]

You' better start collecting them toners real hard boys !

 

[PJ]

News on the official site here Just one question, how are we going to pay for it?

Possibly £1.6m available in grants.
A % of this would need to be found by BFC but the precise % figure isn`t known until the application(s) have been accepted. In some cases up to 90% is grant funded.

 

[Claire]

yes that is what they have previously said, which means we would not have to pay much if at all. this money we would not be able to get hold of if we moved to lionel road. ( i think anyway)

 

[Sweepy]

Very exciting scenes, as I have stated elsewhere.

In this respect, I suppose we are lucky that SP and W£bb didn't give a sh*t while they were at the club, neither could be bothered to investigate this opportunity. This has enabled us to.

 

[handbag]

I live near Griffin Park, have attended residents meetings and at these meetings, most of the residents (me included) are happy with the club as a neighbour.
As long as these plans don't completely mess up light, access, etc, then I'm all for them

 

[BenMoses]

At least there will be more toilet facilities!

 

[Boston Bee]

This is wonderful to hear, Handbag sir! We are eager to be good tenents, neighbors and members of your community and hope that N***es era can be forgotten by one and all eventually. I'm sure that the powers that currently be at BFC will be aggressive in their consultation with council and community.

Together - a Brentford future!!

I live near Griffin Park, have attended residents meetings and at these meetings, most of the residents (me included) are happy with the club as a neighbour.
As long as these plans don't completely mess up light, access, etc, then I'm all for them

 

[Brain-dead Bee]

I don't want to sound too much of a miserable git, and I'd love us to keep playing at Griffin Park, but I don't see how these developments help our financial situation. We need to get in more cash off the pitch, and I don't see how these plans will do anything in that direction... unless the expanded lounge and study centre are potential money-spinners.

If it's just about increasing our capacity, we may need a reality check. Only QPR and Sheff Wed would get us gates anywhere near our current capacity, and I don't see much change in the foreseeable future - a good run might add 1-2,000 to the gates but I can't see us being regularly over 7,000 unless we get into Div 1.

I hope someone can point out what I'm missing, as staying at GP and solvent would be my ideal, but this seems to be an irrelevance.

 

[JBN]

The new lounges/corporate boxes and study centre should help. As will the increase in toilet facilities and improvement in catering facilities. Better facilities should attract bigger crowds, that and a good performance on the pitch!!

However, I do have to agree, we are averaging just over 5,000 per game, we have a derby game on Saturday and will probably be lucky to get a gate of 8,000. Why move to a brand new 15-20,000 seat stadium when we can only just fill 30% of our current home?

That said, I would like to see BFC in a new stadium with facilities that provide an income outside football, that meet the requirements of todays supporter and see Brentford live rather than struggle.

 

[Simon C]

I don't want to sound too much of a miserable git, and I'd love us to keep playing at Griffin Park, but I don't see how these developments help our financial situation. We need to get in more cash off the pitch, and I don't see how these plans will do anything in that direction... unless the expanded lounge and study centre are potential money-spinners.

If it's just about increasing our capacity, we may need a reality check. Only QPR and Sheff Wed would get us gates anywhere near our current capacity, and I don't see much change in the foreseeable future - a good run might add 1-2,000 to the gates but I can't see us being regularly over 7,000 unless we get into Div 1.

I hope someone can point out what I'm missing, as staying at GP and solvent would be my ideal, but this seems to be an irrelevance.

Putting a roof on Ealing Road could be massive for raising funds from away funds. At the moment because the stand has no roof it is deemed to be inferior to the facilities in the Brook Road. Putting a roof on could mean we can fleece away fans for £14 on the day.

 

[Les Beeavinu]

If we made Ealing Road a half decent stand, would it be practical to make it the Home end? I would have thought that opening up access to all three stands for home supporters would be a lot more attarctive than at present.

 

[handbag]

This is wonderful to hear, Handbag sir![\b] [\quote]

Handbag Madam if you don't mind. its bad enough with my mates thinking I'm a bloke for liking football!

 

[handbag]

And like a woman, don't get this quoting lark.....

 

[Mulitinovic]

Putting a roof on Ealing Road could be massive for raising funds from away funds. At the moment because the stand has no roof it is deemed to be inferior to the facilities in the Brook Road. Putting a roof on could mean we can fleece away fans for £14 on the day.

The diagram on the official site looks like there are seats too. By my reckoning that entitles us to at least £21 of the away fans' cash....

The plans are very positive, although it's quite strange to do renovation work when you don't own your property...

Not sure how the residents will react though - the Griffin Park Residents Association messageboard ain't too encouraging https://griffinpark.org.uk/Message_Board/message_board.html.

 

[BenMoses]

Just out of interest, how much did the club lose last year?
500 extra fans paying £17 per game for 20 games would bring in £170,000 a season

 

[KGB]

I believe that the original idea was to make Ealing Rd the home end again or has this changed?

 

[BenMoses]

The players like it with Brook Road as the home end, so I can't see it changing, but which end has the bigger capacity?

 

[Ace Face]

Home end would be a coverted terrace at the Ealing Road with improved facilities. Away end would be front extended and side extended Brook Rd.

I thought Doug was very good again last night and if we could get 1000 fans with his enthusiasm the club would definately survive.

 

[Simon C]

Home end would be a coverted terrace at the Ealing Road with improved facilities. Away end would be front extended and side extended Brook Rd.

That makes sense. We can then open up the whole of the New Road and Braemar Road without any segregation aswell as cramming more away spectators in.

 

[Banana]

Not sure how the residents will react though - the Griffin Park Residents Association messageboard ain't too encouraging https://griffinpark.org.uk/Message_Board/message_board.html.

There are no messages on the message board you reference above about the Ealing Road stand since July last year. So please get your facts right before stirring up things with people whose support and help we need.

 

[Perivale Bee]

The plans are very positive, although it's quite strange to do renovation work when you don't own your property...

We do own it.

 

[Boston Bee]

There seems to me no contradiction between renovations to GP and the pursuit of LR - in fact they're simpatico. Lionel Road is the ambition and the plans but, as is often remarked here, there is no fallback position. With a renovated and expanded GP, there is a fallback! With a little creativity in terms of construction plans, the site becomes much more an integrated part of the community life.

The money is there for this, and can only be used for this. We'd be a fool not to invest in our short-term health while planning for the long-term.

Only wondering though: If a renovated and improved GP was possible, with a 17k capacity and proper crowd segregation, wouldn't this be almost as attractive as LR? Sure we're still in debt and scrambling around with mortgages and such to survive at GP. But after we pay off the creditors by selling GP, how much is left for Lionel Road construction anyway?

 

[Ace Face]

Boston - LR will provide much more revenue than GP ever could simply.
Also like any old property we have large maintenance costs for GP.

 

[larrysigny]

Quiet Man - it's been said from the outset that putting a roof over Ealing Road would allow the home fans to move back there, leaving away supporters in the Wendy House.

With a roof, Ealing Road would generate the same noise (and backing for the team) as at present - and it would also release the blank segregation end in New Road. All that, it is hoped, will help swell our home support (*).

Oh yeah, as someone else mentioned - more toilets and food outlets would also be available to bring in more cash.

If you have any doubts - ask BU direct - and Doug White in particular.

*with a winning team, of course. But like all Bees fans, I know that's what we're going to have - NEXT SEASON.

 

[Boston Bee]

I'm a LR fan Accie, just thought the question should be asked.

Boston - LR will provide much more revenue than GP ever could simply.
Also like any old property we have large maintenance costs for GP.

 

[Stanley]

There seems to me no contradiction between renovations to GP and the pursuit of LR - in fact they're simpatico. Lionel Road is the ambition and the plans but, as is often remarked here, there is no fallback position. With a renovated and expanded GP, there is a fallback! With a little creativity in terms of construction plans, the site becomes much more an integrated part of the community life.

The money is there for this, and can only be used for this. We'd be a fool not to invest in our short-term health while planning for the long-term.

Spot on, for decades it has been death by a thousand slices as our Heritage, GP, has been slowly declining and shrinking. LR without a fallback position is potentialy suicidal.

This is possibly the most positive thing to happen at GP since the Harry Curtis era..........

I wouldn't underestimate the feelgood factor in raising crowd numbers if GP became a better stadium and with a "bigger ground" feel than the decaying image portrayed by the half derelict New Rd.

 

[Snappy]

I think the plans are a very positive and very intelligent of the board, especially considering how busy the last months must have been for transfers, on-the-pitch goings on, Lionel Road, Wally etc.

It's great to see that there has still been a lot of thought into exploring every avenue available, and not just setting our sights solely on LR.

With a new set of lounges and the study centre, not to mention the improved facilities and capacity, it will no doubt go some way to yet further improving our finacial position and make staying at GP in the short term even more viable.

Fingers crossed for the plans to be passed by the council and the grants to be readily available as and wen we need them!

 

[West Wilts Bee]

Gp redevelopment.

Well done to Doug , and everyone involved in this plan. It makes me laugh at the negativity of a lot off our fans. Ron Noades says Griffin park cant be developed cos Ron says this, most people believe him. Then Ron says there's no site for us in the borough, again most people beleive him. Bees utd and Doug come out with some positives, what do we get apathy.
Come on guys lets all get involved, this will happen, especially if eveyone has faith. This is our club lets be proud of it

 

[Luton Bee]

It's been said before that we have alot of unclaimed grants from the Football Trust which we can use for ground maintenance but not for building a new one.

OK then but do we still need 50k for a feasability study for this work?

Does this work involve redeveloping the Braemar Rd forecourt in any way?

Who would pay for any proposed purchase of 3rd party properties in Braemar, Ealing, New Roads?

 

[Mulitinovic]

There are no messages on the message board you reference above about the Ealing Road stand since July last year. So please get your facts right before stirring up things with people whose support and help we need.

It is not a question of "stirring up things" or needing to "get facts right", it's a question of quoting past precedent, that's all. Planning processes are traditionally lengthy and even with the support of most residents, there will always be some opposition. I quoted the board to provide a little background. My apologies.

 

[Garybaldbee]

Home end would be a coverted terrace at the Ealing Road with improved facilities. Away end would be front extended and side extended Brook Rd.

Am I right in thinking that roofing the Ealing Road end will also increase the capacity of the terrace? I seem to recall some mention previously that allowance currently has to be made in the calculations for the steps being slippery in wet weather.

 

[Alex]

Am I right in thinking that roofing the Ealing Road end will also increase the capacity of the terrace? I seem to recall some mention previously that allowance currently has to be made in the calculations for the steps being slippery in wet weather.

Yes

 

[King Bee]

Re: Gp redevelopment.

Well done to Doug , and everyone involved in this plan. It makes me laugh at the negativity of a lot off our fans. Ron Noades says Griffin park cant be developed cos Ron says this, most people believe him. Then Ron says there's no site for us in the borough, again most people beleive him. Bees utd and Doug come out with some positives, what do we get apathy.
Come on guys lets all get involved, this will happen, especially if eveyone has faith. This is our club lets be proud of it

I think the problem here West Wilts is that there have been numerous plans/suggestions about improving GP ever since I started supporting the club in the mid 80s.

A number of issues need to be resolved, not least in the cost of repainting the new road stand once a sponsor is found to fixing up the ageing Braemar roof and various other minor details.
We've lost a couple of key corporate sponsors this year - Geoff Buckingham, Office Smart and I don't think many of the current sponsors in the Vice Presidents Lounge are particularly happy with the way things are being run at the moment.

That said, the plans do look achievable and I will always offer my support in positive schemes such as this. I remember coming back from the Madjeski stadium not so long ago and seeing a coach load of Andersen Consulting staff heading back to London from the game - you can't say they had come to watch the football !! - so offering more facilities for corporate entertainment can only be good thing.
At the same time I still feel the product on the pitch needs to be improved first and foremost before you're going to see improvement in attendance. We're competing with QPRscum, Chelsea, Fulham, and Reading - all offering a better standard of football to sway floating support.

The new management team at Brentford have pissed off a lot of people largely due to inexperience and naivety. This is a step in the right direction.

 

[smiffy superbee]

NOIZY_Boyz moved?

With a roof, Ealing Road would generate the same noise (and backing for the team) as at present

Hmmmm.......just hope you're right Larry!

As one that campaigned hard to get Brook Road end back after too many seasons of hearing 300 away fans taunting us with..."you're supposed to be a home!" I have my doubts.
We NEVER want to go back to that!
When the NOIZY-BOYZ came to fruition at the Brook Road end, the players remarked on the transformation in atmosphere which helped spur them on to the play-off final.
We would only need 2000+ capacity for a couple of games a season, so IMHO we defo don't want to give the advantage of the 'Echo Chamber' back to away fans to hastily!
Wouldn't mind quite so much though, if we could GUARANTEE filling the Ealing Road end (with roof!) every match, to negate the threat above!
Even if it meant drawing people off from Braemar and the New Road!

How do the rest of you see it?

 

[CJC]

We could have both ends for home fans and make half the New Road for away fans, increasing to 3500 when QPR, Notts Forest, Sheffield Weds come.

 

[Snappy]

Re: NOIZY_Boyz moved?

Hmmmm.......just hope you're right Larry!

As one that campaigned hard to get Brook Road end back after too many seasons of hearing 300 away fans taunting us with..."you're supposed to be a home!" I have my doubts.
We NEVER want to go back to that!
When the NOIZY-BOYZ came to fruition at the Brook Road end, the players remarked on the transformation in atmosphere which helped spur them on to the play-off final.
We would only need 2000+ capacity for a couple of games a season, so IMHO we defo don't want to give the advantage of the 'Echo Chamber' back to away fans to hastily!
Wouldn't mind quite so much though, if we could GUARANTEE filling the Ealing Road end (with roof!) every match, to negate the threat above!
Even if it meant drawing people off from Braemar and the New Road!

How do the rest of you see it?

I think you're spot on SSB.

I'm sure I read somewhere that noise studies had been done into how much the proposed ER roof would affect the levels, but even so, it is a little worrying that moving back to ER could affect the vocal support we give to our team.

We must make sure that whichever end we are at come the completion of the roof erection, it is the end which can create the most noise and give the most support to our team.

Personally, a move back to ER as the home end would make sense as far as segregation (no more rival fans spilling out onto the forecourt and BR together) and capacity (removal of the covering at the end of NR and reinstating the current away seating as the Family Stand) is concerned, but we must take note of these other factors as well.

 

[MissMarpledidit]

I personaly dont like Brook Road as the home end as I think the noise we make is not carried out well. I used to sit in New Road and thought our singing was quite poor until I moved in to Brook Road and realised that we are loud its just that the sound seems to bounce backwards off of the steep concrete roof. I think with a roof on ER our singing would be much more noticable and would also give us a decent sized 'End' which would be great, almost like the old days of The Royal Oak end. Almost. But an 'End' nonetheless.
Far from diminishing the noise we make I think this scheme would enhance it.

 

[richy]

"At the same time I still feel the product on the pitch needs to be improved first and foremost before you're going to see improvement in attendance. We're competing with QPRscum, Chelsea, Fulham, and Reading - all offering a better standard of football to sway floating support."


OK, I may be biased but I took some Chelsea mates to the Port Vale game and then I went to the Chelsea v Charlton game on Sunday. £37 for a very average game with no atmosphere. Against £9 (BR season ticket) for a 3-2 with twice as much noise!

I don't think floating support amounts to much. I mean how many people are really making a decision between us and Chelsea at the weekend? Our league position has the biggest bearing.

 

[The Joker]

Am I right in thinking that roofing the Ealing Road end will also increase the capacity of the terrace? I seem to recall some mention previously that allowance currently has to be made in the calculations for the steps being slippery in wet weather.

In theory yes. However, exit routes and possibly capacity at incoming turnstiles also need to be increased. Which is why the club wants to buy either the Sportsmark property in the north east corner, or the Princess Royal function hall in the south east corner. Not sure how we can afford this though...

 

[scaramanga]

We could have both ends for home fans and make half the New Road for away fans, increasing to 3500 when QPR, Notts Forest, Sheffield Weds come.

Absolutely right CJC.

 

[Simon C]

The atmosphere coming from the Brook Road is not as good as it was two years ago when we first made the switch. I generally move around to different areas of the ground each game and from the far end of the New Road you can hardly hear the Brook Road these days.

 

[Snappy]

The atmosphere coming from the Brook Road is not as good as it was two years ago when we first made the switch. I generally move around to different areas of the ground each game and from the far end of the New Road you can hardly hear the Brook Road these days.

Probably because there hasn't been so much to sing about this season so not as many people have been joining in with us. It very well the usual 100 or so starting off and joining in with the chants, but it's very difficult to sustain it when people are so miserable at seeing the team losing again and so won't join in.

Now that's perfectly understandable, but Franchise FC have shown how difficult it is to play with virtually no crowd, so why not give the boys a boost all through the game, whether winning or losing?

Surely you must have heard us against Tranmere and Port Vale though

 

[Simon C]

Surely you must have heard us against Tranmere and Port Vale though

I was in the Braemar for those games. Along with Brighton and Oldham the atmosphere was cracking for those games as the whole ground joined in.

 

[Snappy]

the atmosphere was cracking for those games as the whole ground joined in.

Sadly it seems a bit of a rarity these days. It's only occasionally that you hear any singing or shouting from NR or BR, certainly to start it all off.

Maybe it's because the inhabitants are on average older and maybe more reserved. Maybe it's because they're all sitting down and so you can't be as vocal.

Undoubtedly they're as passionate as those who stand in Brook Road, in some cases more so, so why not show it by singing your hearts out and get the ground rocking on all sides?

 

[solobee]

Some of the residents are not happy with Doug White or John Mac and it seems with good reason.

Doug White has broken a number of committments to them regarding the stand and consultation.

John Mac, I hear, turned up at a recent residents' meeting and gave the impression nothing was being planned except work on the New Road stand.

Now they hear a planning application has been lodged.

It seems nothing has been learnt from the Hargreaves affair.

 

[King Bee]

Some of the residents are not happy with Doug White or John Mac and it seems with good reason.

Doug White has broken a number of committments to them regarding the stand and consultation.

John Mac, I hear, turned up at a recent residents' meeting and gave the impression nothing was being planned except work on the New Road stand.

Now they hear a planning application has been lodged.

It seems nothing has been learnt from the Hargreaves affair.

Oh dear Brentford...still being parsimonious with the truth. And I thought it would be different with us fans running the show

 

[JTofBFC]

John Mac, I hear, turned up at a recent residents' meeting and gave the impression nothing was being planned except work on the New Road stand.

Now they hear a planning application has been lodged.

Whoa. Just read what you have accused them of.

"nothing planned except work on New Rd stand".

Well if you read the official site bulletin that is exactly what planning permission has been submitted for. Nothing else.

I think we are all well aware that we need the residents onside but there are two sides to this. If the residents are going to be difficult about every single issue then we may as well pack up now.

It sounds as though the club have involved the residents in the New Rd issue so what exactly is your complaint?

I wouldnt worry though it wont happen anyway. I mean who ever heard of a conference club with executive boxes.

 

[Snappy]

I wouldnt worry though it wont happen anyway. I mean who ever heard of a conference club with executive boxes.

For f@cks sake, will you please cheer up!

I can understand a degree of pessimism with the situation we're in, but will you at least credit the club and board with a bit of intelligence on this and other matters instead of continually putting them down and saying we're as good as relegated/will soon be out of business/have no future/Lionel Rd will never happen etc etc.

If everyone had your attitude, there would no longer be a club to support, so try and look on the bright side of things now and then. Please.