Reporting Hateful Behaviour

[BFC1997]

BTW "Killer Bee" posted this removed post earlier: "Sorry but we don’t want Asians with their half and half scarves."

They also post from the same IP address as former user "Thorne in the Side" and has an email address containing the name "Hester"

Really? Wow.

 

[Banana]

Difficult subject this. Gut instinct is that I’m glad Brentford football club takes these issues seriously.

Do I want racist/sexist/homophobic jokes in the stands at Griffin Park? No.

But do I think the club* should decide what constitutes racism/sexism/homophobia and therefore warrants punishment? Not sure I do.

*More accurately, a person at the club.

It's not going to be black and white is it (oh dear, sorry), hopefully it's about making people understand and behave better by considering those around them

 

[A Real Mysteron]

Well hopefully we'll find out then won't we.

I doubt we will, because I’m fairly certain it will never be used.

 

[Banana]

I doubt we will, because I’m fairly certain it will never be used.

As I said. I hope not. But IF IT IS, then we will find out the club's attitude to this: a "box ticking" exercise, or a real, genuine effort to be inclusive of all walks of life and backgrounds.

Personally I hope it's the latter, and I would be disappointed if anyone thought differently. In fact we should be demanding that is the case.

 

[sonofabee]

If we were at GP and we witnessed an Asian family being racially abused, maybe because they're wearing a half and half scarf, would we all not want a way to report it? Or is that grassing and we should ignore it?

If anyone believes that's political correctness gone made then i think they've gone mad

 

[A Real Mysteron]

As I said. I hope not. But IF IT IS, then we will find out the club's attitude to this: a "box ticking" exercise, or a real, genuine effort to be inclusive of all walks of life and backgrounds.

Personally I hope it's the latter, and I would be disappointed if anyone thought differently. In fact we should be demanding that is the case.

any of us right minded folk would hope it would be the latter, but I think we would be disappointed.

 

[Judio1999]

So is anyone going to report a traditional chant of

Get you T#ts out for the Lads

As a Hate Crime ???

 

[Doovster]

I don't see a major issue. I think most of us know where the line is. If I saw someone genuinely abusing anyone for any reason I would personally have a word. If that fails then the stewards should deal with it anyway.

 

[Voice from the Braemar]

We'll find out if *if there is a problem* if BFC will take if seriously. Comparing with Wembley and making up your mind on that isn't really valid is it.

If there's an LGBT supporters that feels threatened by someone, then BFC need to act. What's wrong with that? We live in a different, more enlightened world than 50 years ago.

Surely you back the fact that supporters can come from all walks of live. In fact I am sure that I know that you do. We need to encourage that. This should be seen as pro-active, positive action by the club. And should be welcomed. Instead we have some saying it is all about snowflakes and the end of society/democracy.

The point is that no one actually gives 2 flying ducks what someones sexuality is at gp...we go to watch football not to discuss whether they are martha or arthur....i can only speak for myself and probably the 589 people i know quite well there, but its of no interest to anyone.....its just not of any interest and brentford trying to highlight a problem that doesnt actually exist is just strange ? lol still something for somebody somewhere to get offended on behalf of someone else is always going to be a winner in some parallel universe.....the world gets more mental by the minute lol

 

[Doovster]

So is anyone going to report a traditional chant of

Get you T#ts out for the Lads

As a Hate Crime ???

Are you taking the p1ss? As I said in an earlier post, I think most of us know what is hateful/abusive compared to traditional football/terrace chants.

I don't think is an attempt to sanitise the place. Football has become far more sanitised anyway over the years, for better or worse, depending on your view point.

 

[Banana]

The point is that no one actually gives 2 flying ducks what someones sexuality is at gp...we go to watch football not to discuss whether they are martha or arthur....i can only speak for myself and probably the 589 people i know quite well there, but its of no interest to anyone.....its just not of any interest and brentford trying to highlight a problem that doesnt actually exist is just strange ? lol still something for somebody somewhere to get offended on behalf of someone else is always going to be a winner in some parallel universe.....the world gets more mental by the minute lol

I think you are wrong Voice.

If you think it's a fuss over nothing then more power to you. However to some people it IS an issue. Why shouldn't we give those that have historically been marginalised have a channel to report if they are threatened by some Troglodyte?

If doesn't affect you or me, so why get such a head of steam up about it. We want more people from different backgrounds at BFC. Hopefully this will help that. What's not to like? An image problem that BFC are indicating that they want to eradicate some behaviours at GP? or ensure that it doesn't exist? What's wrong with that????

 

[Voice from the Braemar]

I think you are wrong Voice.

If you think it's a fuss over nothing then more power to you. However to some people it IS an issue. Why shouldn't we give those that have historically been marginalised have a channel to report if they are threatened by some Troglodyte?

If doesn't affect you or me, so why get such a head of steam up about it. We want more people from different backgrounds at BFC. Hopefully this will help that. What's not to like? An image problem that BFC are indicating that they want to eradicate some behaviours at GP? or ensure that it doesn't exist? What's wrong with that????

Theres nothing wrong with that at all.....but the way its been put out, is that there is a problem at gp....there is no problem....you cant please all the people all the time i suppose....we will just have to agree to disagree on how its been done but agree on the sentiment....(you proper melon or should i say banana lol lol)

 

[rebus]

Really? Wow.

No real surprise, is it?

 

[LostBee]

BTW "Killer Bee" posted this removed post earlier: "Sorry but we don’t want Asians with their half and half scarves."

They also post from the same IP address as former user "Thorne in the Side" and has an email address containing the name "Hester"

I’d rather sit next to an Asian in a half and half scarf than those pair of vile ***** any day of the week.

 

[Guildford Bee]

So is anyone going to report a traditional chant of

Get you T#ts out for the Lads

As a Hate Crime ???

No, obviously not. I haven’t heard that at a Bees game for about six years anyway!

 

[belvederebee]

The thread title is wrong. A hate crime is stated as " crime motivated by racial, sexual, or other prejudice, typically one involving violence." and I would hope that anyone in their right mind wouldn't condone that at all. Would they?

This states "hateful behavior". I don't know what that is - another thing for the "PC gone mad" people to froth over maybe? I predict zero calls. I also predict that anyone getting anxious that the world has actually gone mad will be completely unaffected by this.

I'm interested in why such an infrequent visitor to this site has chosen to highlight this. I don't think I'll get an honest answer there. lol

A crime is a crime, whatever the motivation. The "hate" element doesn't make it more serious.

 

[nocoat]

A crime is a crime, whatever the motivation. The "hate" element doesn't make it more serious.

I think the law disagrees with you there

 

[belvederebee]

While we're on this subject - it's easy to wear fancy laces. How you behave and think is more important. I find the whole Pride (not Fullers) thing a load of baloney - as do some homosexual people I know.

 

[beetee]

I don't see a major issue. I think most of us know where the line is. If I saw someone genuinely abusing anyone for any reason I would personally have a word. If that fails then the stewards should deal with it anyway.

Agree with this but hey if it ticks a box fair enough.
Still not sure why it has to be "Hateful" behaviour though... Should be any unacceptable behaviour.

 

[BFC1997]

It's not going to be black and white is it (oh dear, sorry), hopefully it's about making people understand and behave better by considering those around them

I agree that hopefully it will make people more behave in a considerate manner.

Honestly I believe Griffin Park is a pretty hostile environment at times so I’m happy that the club at least appear to take that seriously.

But it still doesn’t sit easy with me that basically it’s just down to a person at the club to review and to make a decision over what reports truly constitute ‘offensive behaviour’ and what punishment the offenders deserve.

Do we know who this person is?

 

[Banana]

I agree that hopefully it will make people more behave in a considerate manner.

Honestly I believe Griffin Park is a pretty hostile environment at times so I’m happy that the club at least appear to take that seriously.

But it still doesn’t sit easy with me that basically it’s just down to a person at the club to review and to make a decision over what reports truly constitute ‘offensive behaviour’ and what punishment the offenders deserve.

Do we know who this person is?

Why do you think it is one person? There's no indication of that.

One thing I've learnt recently is that Kick It Out is all about learning rather than exclusion. So I don't think there's anything to get uptight about. Besides someone has to use the service first, which the majority on here seem to believe will never happen :shrug:

 

[Doovster]

Agree with this but hey if it ticks a box fair enough.
Still not sure why it has to be "Hateful" behaviour though... Should be any unacceptable behaviour.

But in reality if you saw something you considered unacceptable behaviour I'm guessing you would report it anyway, regardless of the club advertising this new hotline or not.

 

[belvederebee]

I think the law disagrees with you there

I think you'll find that the sentencing guidelines are different.

 

[Paul_T]

While we're on this subject - it's easy to wear fancy laces. How you behave and think is more important. I find the whole Pride (not Fullers) thing a load of baloney - as do some homosexual people I know.

think you'll find that most homosexual people don't describe themselves as homosexual in the first place my love, let alone some of them x

 

[belvederebee]

think you'll find that most homosexual people don't describe themselves as homosexual in the first place my love, let alone some of them x

Sorry - hatters

 

[Vid]

If you are really worried enough to ring or email or facebook or tweet and want something done dial this easy to remember number 999 and ask for the police. There's usually a few of them hanging around outside with nothing to do.

 

[nanny58]

Are there any other groups bfc have leftout of the equation while we are it.will these crimes bee endorsed by some of our northern brethren if they misbehave

 

[hughbee]

A crime is a crime, whatever the motivation. The "hate" element doesn't make it more serious.

The police often admit that they are rarely able to follow up hate crime. I haven’t looked but I bet the conviction rates are low for reported hate crimes.

Of course GP is a very welcoming place where you will rarely if ever hear this kind of abuse. but it does exist and can have a nasty impact. Why would GP be immune? The evidence from one of the deleted posts, quoted by Banana shows that the possibility is there.

So it is good that Bfc are being proactive about it.

 

[nocoat]

I think you'll find that the sentencing guidelines are different.

Which surely to all intents and purpose is the same thing? The sentences are longer as the law thinks it’s more serious. What am I missing ?!

 

[grutter]

So, reading through these posts, no one seems to have been the victim of a hate crime at GP, nor knows anyone that has, so this seems a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. It does seem like window dressing, when there are already channels to report crime or hateful behaviour. I would have thought players or officials are the most likely to use the service, as they get more verbal abuse in a game than the rest of GP put together. They need to have a line for reporting if you've been mauled by a hippo at GP next.

 

[nocoat]

So, reading through these posts, no one seems to have been the victim of a hate crime at GP, nor knows anyone that has, so this seems a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. It does seem like window dressing, when there are already channels to report crime or hateful behaviour. I would have thought players or officials are the most likely to use the service, as they get more verbal abuse in a game than the rest of GP put together. They need to have a line for reporting if you've been mauled by a hippo at GP next.

I used to sit in the paddock and when the fatties celebrated a goal that hotline would have run off the hook

 

[RoyBee]

What about bullying and sexual harassment? Equally vile and not to be tolerated at BFC or anywhere else. Hopefully all fellow Bees agree with this.

 

[Gee Bee]

What about bullying and sexual harassment? Equally vile and not to be tolerated at BFC or anywhere else. Hopefully all fellow Bees agree with this.

Wouldn’t that also fall in hateful behaviour anyway?

 

[mhead bee]

Can I report the phantom Braemar Farter?

 

[RoyBee]

Wouldn’t that also fall in hateful behaviour anyway?

I would think so.

 

[mhead bee]

I would have no issue sharing a changing room, playing football or sitting next to a gay person at a match. I have never shouted personal abuse at anyone at a game other than to call an opposition player a ****** for cheating or celebrating in front of me and they deserve that. However I don't get this rainbow thing. If you are gay you need to come out and face up to it and be brave, you will probably be surprised by the reaction.

Next they will want us to wear a dress to the game in order to stand up for women's rights. Getting really tired of people being offended.

 

[Jambo]

I agree that hopefully it will make people more behave in a considerate manner.

Honestly I believe Griffin Park is a pretty hostile environment at times so I’m happy that the club at least appear to take that seriously.

But it still doesn’t sit easy with me that basically it’s just down to a person at the club to review and to make a decision over what reports truly constitute ‘offensive behaviour’ and what punishment the offenders deserve.

Do we know who this person is?

Griffin Park is far from being a a hostile environment

Come down to The Railway Tavern in Stanford-le-Hope when West Ham have just lost. Or Johannesburg at midnight. Or take a wrong turn in Kingston Jamaica. That's hostile.

 

[Les Beeavinu]

I would have no issue sharing a changing room, playing football or sitting next to a gay person at a match. I have never shouted personal abuse at anyone at a game other than to call an opposition player a ****** for cheating or celebrating in front of me and they deserve that. However I don't get this rainbow thing. If you are gay you need to come out and face up to it and be brave, you will probably be surprised by the reaction.

Next they will want us to wear a dress to the game in order to stand up for women's rights. Getting really tired of people being offended.

You're tired of people being offended, yet you appear to by offended by this "rainbow thing" (for some odd reason, not sure why it would be something that affects you), I don't think that you will be asked to wear a dress to a match, just like you've never been forced to wear rainbow laces, a motif in support of a Cancer charity, a poppy etc etc.

 

[belvederebee]

Which surely to all intents and purpose is the same thing? The sentences are longer as the law thinks it’s more serious. What am I missing ?!

Point taken. I really meant the effect on the individual. Although difficult to generalise. EG whatever the motivation, someone being threatened by a machete wielding attacker is going to be crapping themselves.

 

[Holysmit]

I would have no issue sharing a changing room, playing football or sitting next to a gay person at a match. I have never shouted personal abuse at anyone at a game other than to call an opposition player a ****** for cheating or celebrating in front of me and they deserve that. However I don't get this rainbow thing. If you are gay you need to come out and face up to it and be brave, you will probably be surprised by the reaction.

Next they will want us to wear a dress to the game in order to stand up for women's rights. Getting really tired of people being offended.

I would say posts like this is exactly why the rainbow needs to be included. Why do they need to be brave and face up? Surely if it wasn't an issue coming out wouldn't be seen as brave as no one would bat an eyelid and everyone would treat the person the same way as they have always treated them?

I would suggest that until it gets to the point where a person doesn't feel they have to come out and say they are gay then there is an issue, as heterosexuals don't have to go around going you know what I'm straight. The fact that a lot of people find it an ordeal is exactly why campaigns like the rainbow laces are a good thing.

 

[rebus]

What about bullying and sexual harassment? Equally vile and not to be tolerated at BFC or anywhere else. Hopefully all fellow Bees agree with this.

Perhaps they should also extend it for sticking up for racist mates, eh?

 

[Dave Bond]

More irrelevant virtuous signaling but perhaps I am living in the bubble of the Inverness club and paddock and that's why all this hate crime passes me by. If I am wrong no doubt others will be eager to put me right outlining all the recent cases of hate crime that needed urgent addressing by the club.

 

[RoyBee]

Perhaps they should also extend it for sticking up for racist mates, eh?

I'm not sticking up for anyone. Any racist stuff is wrong and I'll happily tell anyone that, mate or not. Thank you.

I do find some of the sanctimonious and self righteous posts on here quite incredible though.

 

[Houghton Bee]

More irrelevant virtuous signaling but perhaps I am living in the bubble of the Inverness club and paddock and that's why all this hate crime passes me by. If I am wrong no doubt others will be eager to put me right outlining all the recent cases of hate crime that needed urgent addressing by the club.

There isn't an urgent need, it's there if you or anyone else feels they need it. In fact I remember one being launched a few years ago at BFC without anyone really caring (or presumably feeling the need to use it).

 

[DidntYouUsedToBee]

I wouldn’t worry too much.
I used the one at Wembley three times in 45 minutes to report a group of absolute James Hunts, who were ruining my sons birthday treat with some of the most appalling racist behaviour I have ever seen and heard.
Nobody responded and they carried on all game. And before any keyboard Chuck Norris’ ask why I didn’t sort it out myself, I’m reasonably handy but have no desire for my son to watch me get ironed out by 10 drunken louts.

These things are window dressing to please kick it out and other lefties.

Nothing to do with left or right

 

[Doovster]

Surely hot line or not, anyone witnessing what they believe to be genuinely hostile, threatening or hateful behaviour towards fellow fans, employees of the club etc would not be tolerated and either dealt with or reported. The fact there's a specific phone line doesn't really change anything does it and therefore no need for any fuss or outrage?

 

[nanny58]

I used to sit in the paddock and when the fatties celebrated a goal that hotline would have run off the hook

 

[nanny58]

No coat surely your comment is totally out of order if not worth reporting to the hotline the paddock is full of responsible food eaters lol

 

[BFC1997]

Griffin Park is far from being a a hostile environment

Come down to The Railway Tavern in Stanford-le-Hope when West Ham have just lost. Or Johannesburg at midnight. Or take a wrong turn in Kingston Jamaica. That's hostile.

That's a fallacious argument.
Just because a problem is worse somewhere else, it doesn't mean that we shouldn't acknowledge there's a problem at all.

 

[Vid]

Surely hot line or not, anyone witnessing what they believe to be genuinely hostile, threatening or hateful behaviour towards fellow fans, employees of the club etc would not be tolerated and either dealt with or reported. The fact there's a specific phone line doesn't really change anything does it and therefore no need for any fuss or outrage?

Without going back to the first post what is the phone number ?

If you are really concerned to ring someone ring the police. The number is 999.