Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

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Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

No one criticised Raya for his supersonic dives when he knew he had no chance of saving a shot … not really sure what your point is, but I’m not a huge fan of a keeper who likes to play statues
My point is keepers look like dickheads when they dive for balls they have no chance in saving, it may appease a few fans "oooh at least he made an effort )yeah, he was 12 foot from it)" , but why risk injury just for the cameras?
Thats the point with Turner for Maupays goal - he looks stupid.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Give PL attackers enough time and space on the ball and they'll find the corners every time
Of course, but goalkeepers can often anticipate where the shot will go and do dive to make saves in the corners. I can't remember Flekken doing that any time recently.

Look at slow motion replays. Keepers are often already moving when or fractionally before the ball is kicked. That's how they get down to the corners in time. If a keeper doesn't move till after the ball is kicked within 20 yards, he's never making a save if the ball is more than 6 feet either side of him.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Compare and contrast the Forest keepers response to Neal's goal which probably had a slightly smaller reaction time. He wasn't going to save it but he anticipated it and dived the correct way. If the shot wasn't hit as truly, he had a chance of saving it.
 
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Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

The comments he made in the interview were slightly worrying to me. Not sure what’s going on his personal life, but it does seem to be affecting his confidence IMO. For what it’s worth, I’m one of the few who actually like him, but he probably needs to start finding that confidence otherwise it might be wise to give Strak a go. Watching it live yesterday it did seem like he should have dived for the first goal, but after watching the highlights, there’s no way he would have saved it regardless.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

I noticed this on MOTD in the slow motions, he seems flat footed, on his heels a lot. If we see it so will the gk coach. Hopefully we will see an improvement soon.
When you see a keeper remain rooted like that you often imagine there must have been a big deflection and make a mental note to check a replay later. Maybe Mark is anticipating a deflection that never comes. ??
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Blaming him his getting really boring and tedious. Vita and Ben Mee had about 5 goes between them at clearing the ball and couldn't get it any further than the fella stood 5 yards outside our box. Rest of the midfield nowhere to be seen and the defence far too slow to react.
Mental how people can watch that series of f***ups and moan about Flekken.

Said the same yesterday. Vitaly and Ben Mee were pathetic in the build up to that goal.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Exactly sliding on knees and looking over your shoulder is not goal keeping, if the opposing team has more shots on target we lose it’s that simple.

He’s on his heals all the time, comes for crosses then changes his mind, and doesn’t move with play within his goal. The defending hasn’t been great either yanelt as an example. But it has to start with the keeper.

I think the fans have shown patience he would have been called out a lot earlier by other supporters. Changes have to be made.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Compare and contrast the Forest keepers reaction to Neal's goal which probably had a slightly less reaction time. He wasn't going to save it but he anticipated it and dived the correct way. If the shot wasn't hit as truly, he had a chance of saving it.

That's interesting @Les Beeavinu ✅

When penalties are taken do keepers guess, take a chance or react to the strike?

Flekken seems to just stand still which is also an option. There were 2 occasions yesterday in the 2nd half when Forest shots left him standing still with no reaction.

He seems to not react or be instinctive, like he is stuck in treacle. Raya was the opposite to this which makes it a tough watch at times.

Hopefully it's just a confidence issue. He can't have been helped with the fact that it's not our full side and the fact he's adapting to a new league.

My overriding feeling is that he doesn't save very much and having watched a bit of his interview, he seems distracted.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Any GK’s on here? Look at his feet position on Mangala’s shot from behind the other goal. Should his feet be that far apart?
 

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Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Any GK’s on here? Look at his feet position on Mangala’s shot from behind the other goal. Should his feet be that far apart?
He’d just moved his left foot left anticipating the shot to go that side.
Everyone please stop looking at the resultants and start looking at the causes.
Cheap give aways, poor clearances, crap marking, poor challenges were the reasons for their chances/goals yesterday - not sh1t goalkeeping.
And I’m not having a pop at the outfield players; it’s just the way it goes when confidence is low and we’re in a rut.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

He’d just moved his left foot left anticipating the shot to go that side.
Everyone please stop looking at the resultants and start looking at the causes.
Cheap give aways, poor clearances, crap marking, poor challenges were the reasons for their chances/goals yesterday - not sh1t goalkeeping.
And I’m not having a pop at the outfield players; it’s just the way it goes when confidence is low and we’re in a rut.
Are you in the Union, though? ??

Seriously, though, what strikes me about stills of that first goal, are that Flekken wasn’t quite in the centre of his goal. He was on the correct side and did look as if he was anticipating a shot to his left. Further, the images suggest that the shot wasn’t quite absolutely in the corner. So why he didn’t at least attempt a dive, I’m not sure, even if he might have ended up beaten for pace.
 
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Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

He’d just moved his left foot left anticipating the shot to go that side.
Everyone please stop looking at the resultants and start looking at the causes.
Cheap give aways, poor clearances, crap marking, poor challenges were the reasons for their chances/goals yesterday - not sh1t goalkeeping.
And I’m not having a pop at the outfield players; it’s just the way it goes when confidence is low and we’re in a rut.
Everyone has acknowledged the poor defending. If defenders were perfect, a keeper would never have a save to make.

Ours just never seems to pull off any difficult saves. That's what separates great keepers from average ones.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

If we could go back to last summer in hindsight, how many people would pick Flekken again to be number 1 for this season?

He hasn't been bad, that would completely unfair. Although something isn't right. Dropped from Netherlands and his interview smacked of no confidence. He knows that his performances should be a level above what they are right now.

There are worse goalkeepers in the PL league, that an absolute fact.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

If we could go back to last summer in hindsight, how many people would pick Flekken again to be number 1 for this season?

He hasn't been bad, that would completely unfair. Although something isn't right. Dropped from Netherlands and his interview smacked of no confidence. He knows that his performances should be a level above what they are right now.

There are worse goalkeepers in the PL league, that an absolute fact.

The Forest one for a start.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Let's bring a bit of balance to this.

His play with his feet is outstanding. In the top 3 or 4 keepers in the league in that department.

However, I expect oppo managers to increasingly encourage shooting on sight aiming for the corners against us, due to the amount of times Flekken is caught flat footed across a increasingly broader sample of matches.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

I don’t think he was at fault last night. However, whatever spin you try to put on it he is statistically the worst keeper in the league this season. If you don’t think the Football Operations team are not aware of this fact, you haven’t been playing close attention for the last 10 years. I trust them to sort it though, be it through coaching or the transfer market.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Any GK’s on here? Look at his feet position on Mangala’s shot from behind the other goal. Should his feet be that far apart?
I think his left foot should be 2.37cm to the right and his right foot should be 1.94cm to the left. He should bend his knee less but crouch lower. His gloves don't seem tight enough for me either and if I'm being really critical, his left arm is slightly lower than the right when it should be the other way arou.. Oh, the shot went wide anyway?
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

I feel he is deliberately trying to f*** me off with those reverse chipped ball across our goal ?

Maybe Chelsea he got away with one. ?

It'll go wrong sometime soon and no doubt cost us points.

I'm sure it's integral to how we play but the cost/benefit analysis would be good to see.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

I feel he is deliberately trying to f*** me off with those reverse chipped ball across our goal ?

Maybe Chelsea he got away with one. ?

It'll go wrong sometime soon and no doubt cost us points.

I'm sure it's integral to how we play but the cost/benefit analysis would be good to see.

Haha those reverse passes are unbelievable good, but unbelievable dangerous!
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Of all the goals I’ve seen us concede this season (I’ve seen most) I would personally only fault him for one and that was the equaliser at Forest away. He really could do with a MOM performance to get his and our confidence in him though. He certainly doesn’t seem to dominate the box but maybe he is just what used to be referred to as a ‘line goalkeeper’. If that’s the case though this doesn’t suit us IMO
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

I feel he is deliberately trying to f*** me off with those reverse chipped ball across our goal ?

Maybe Chelsea he got away with one. ?

It'll go wrong sometime soon and no doubt cost us points.

I'm sure it's integral to how we play but the cost/benefit analysis would be good to see.
I think he is brilliant with the ball at his feet. One of the best in the league. But I too disapprove of the chipped pass. The ball is too long in arriving. Any zealous presser is given time to arrive on the scene. And then there’s the added complication of the defender having to bring the ball under control with what needs to be the perfect first touch (to avoid being dispossessed).
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

I think he is brilliant with the ball at his feet. One of the best in the league. But I too disapprove of the chipped pass. The ball is too long in arriving. Any zealous presser is given time to arrive on the scene. And then there’s the added complication of the defender having to bring the ball under control with what needs to be the perfect first touch (to avoid being dispossessed).

That nearly went wrong for Ethan yesterday ?
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

My fear is that at some point he will make a howler. All keepers do sometimes but this thread will then really go into meltdown
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

My point is keepers look like dickheads when they dive for balls they have no chance in saving, it may appease a few fans "oooh at least he made an effort )yeah, he was 12 foot from it)" , but why risk injury just for the cameras?
Thats the point with Turner for Maupays goal - he looks stupid.
But you don’t know that you’re not going to save it unless you try!
By your argument, Gordon Banks should have stood still and applauded Pele’s header rather than “risking injury” by making a spectacular save…
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

I think his left foot should be 2.37cm to the right and his right foot should be 1.94cm to the left. He should bend his knee less but crouch lower. His gloves don't seem tight enough for me either and if I'm being really critical, his left arm is slightly lower than the right when it should be the other way arou.. Oh, the shot went wide anyway?
Ask a genuine question and get a childish answer. I’d just like an informed opinion on whether he is not diving by choice or because he is unable to because of his feet position and weight distribution.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

I noticed this on MOTD in the slow motions, he seems flat footed, on his heels a lot.
His apparent flat footedness was previously mentioned by another poster on here and that is what I feel is the crux of the matter. There have been lots of goals where he has just been rooted to the spot and I just can't remember any great saves that he's made which is slightly worrying as we're more than halfway through the season.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

My views on Flekken are “well-documented”, but anyone suggesting that he had a chance of saving the first goal last night and that it was “not right in the corner” is on another planet.

This “rooted to the spot” thing - it is not a great look for a goalkeeper - it just gives off the wrong vibes, regardless of the quality of the shot. Maybe unfair, but a lot of fans see it like that.

From his interview, it seems after all that his pre-season performances had an effect on him, despite what some experts on here were saying. Of course, the results did not matter, but by his own admission his confidence was affected and here we are six months on with him stating he is not happy with his performances.

For what it’s worth, I thought he was solid enough yesterday.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

But you don’t know that you’re not going to save it unless you try!
By your argument, Gordon Banks should have stood still and applauded Pele’s header rather than “risking injury” by making a spectacular save…
No, because that was saveable, it was about a foot away from him, he just had to get down quickly.
If a ball is about 8 feet away from you and its nearly past you , its unsaveable.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

My views on Flekken are “well-documented”, but anyone suggesting that he had a chance of saving the first goal last night and that it was “not right in the corner” is on another planet.

This “rooted to the spot” thing - it is not a great look for a goalkeeper - it just gives off the wrong vibes, regardless of the quality of the shot. Maybe unfair, but a lot of fans see it like that.

From his interview, it seems after all that his pre-season performances had an effect on him, despite what some experts on here were saying. Of course, the results did not matter, but by his own admission his confidence was affected and here we are six months on with him stating he is not happy with his performances.

For what it’s worth, I thought he was solid enough yesterday.
This!
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

My point is keepers look like dickheads when they dive for balls they have no chance in saving, it may appease a few fans "oooh at least he made an effort )yeah, he was 12 foot from it)" , but why risk injury just for the cameras?
Thats the point with Turner for Maupays goal - he looks stupid.
Have to agree to differ on that. He at least had a go at saving it, and got a lot closer to doing so than he would have if he’d just stood by and watched it. It’s many years since I’ve played as a keeper, but I do recollect making the occasional save from shots that my instantaneous reaction when the shot was dispatched was ‘I’m in big trouble here’, but I dived and got an unexpected hand to the ball. That ain’t going to happen if you decide that’s beaten me, so I’ll do my cardboard cutout impression.

Also, I do wonder whether opposition strikers might be more tempted and encouraged to take a speculative shot, rather than pass, if a keeper has a reputation for not leaping for every shot, which if that is the case, invites on more pressure.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Let's bring a bit of balance to this.

His play with his feet is outstanding. In the top 3 or 4 keepers in the league in that department.

However, I expect oppo managers to increasingly encourage shooting on sight aiming for the corners against us, due to the amount of times Flekken is caught flat footed across a increasingly broader sample of matches.
I absolutely agree with this.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

That's interesting @Les Beeavinu ✅

When penalties are taken do keepers guess, take a chance or react to the strike?

Flekken seems to just stand still which is also an option. There were 2 occasions yesterday in the 2nd half when Forest shots left him standing still with no reaction.

He seems to not react or be instinctive, like he is stuck in treacle. Raya was the opposite to this which makes it a tough watch at times.

Hopefully it's just a confidence issue. He can't have been helped with the fact that it's not our full side and the fact he's adapting to a new league.

My overriding feeling is that he doesn't save very much and having watched a bit of his interview, he seems distracted.
I said the same thing to one of my sons yesterday - he doesn’t save a lot. With him, it seems to be either a goal or wide. I don’t know if there is a stat about expected saves (?) like there is expected goals but for me, I don’t have a lot of confidence when an opposition player has the ball on the edge of our box and is shaping up to shoot.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

I. can't understand the fuss. IMO he's a decent Prem standard keeper for the pond we fish in . His distribution is also very good if occasionally a bit nerve wrackng.That gives him an edge over Strakosha who is also v good.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

It’s also the shots that go just wide.

He never seems to make a move towards the ball and I don’t think it’s because he has uncanny levels of anticipation.

Often he seems to put his weight on the other foot so he cannot move towards the ball.

It’s hard to put it into words but it just doesn’t look right.
Agree with this.

An example in last night's game was the Mangala effort that hit his water bottle. His trigger movement was towards the other corner of the goal, and he'd have been nowhere near the ball if the shot had been on target.

I think he did OK last night, but he does display some worrying tendencies.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Everyone has acknowledged the poor defending. If defenders were perfect, a keeper would never have a save to make.

Ours just never seems to pull off any difficult saves. That's what separates great keepers from average ones.
He did make good saves last night, just nothing he could do about the goals.
Simple.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Any GK’s on here? Look at his feet position on Mangala’s shot from behind the other goal. Should his feet be that far apart?
I played in goal to a reasonable standard some years ago, not professional nor at a pro academy. I also coached goalkeepers in my early 20s. Being that MF is 6’5 he’s compensating for that by trying to get lower to decrease the distance/time to low shots, the issue with that is anything that goes low within his diving range (anything that’ll land between the length from his foot to his head not including fully extended arms) will probably go under him because his feet are too wide for his to get low quickly enough which will explain why he makes/attempts to make foot saves more often than not, on a shot like this where it has gone into the bottom corner the width of his foot placement won’t make much difference, he’d have been able to get full stretch had he been able to, which I can’t diagnose why he can’t/hasn’t.

A lot of goals we’ve conceded this season that have been earmarked for him to take the blame have been similar, defence not doing their job, poor clearances/not blocking/not tackling and probably Flekken not being proactive in his attempts to make the save. But for me as a GK the defence needs to tighten up before I’ll accept the blame for a soft goal, if they don’t think I’m good enough they need to do a better job of defending.

Flekken’s confidence is through the floor at the moment, he’ll ping a lovely pass and he’s still got people on his back, so he can’t even take any confidence from that.

I found on a few occasions when I was playing as I was a goalkeeper when times are bad everything goes in. But and this might be purely anecdotal when you don’t play and an outfielder goes in goal the defence does tighten up more and then the outfielder in goal looks like a world beater. For me people saying the defence has no faith in Flekken makes me no sense because you know what he’s going to do, so they are not second guessing.

the main thing is the whole defensive situation is a shambles and it needs to be addressed next season, albeit once Rico/Hickey are back we’ve got as good a defence as any in this league. I like the bloke, hopefully he can have a game where he saves absolutely everything and it has a good old clear out in his head.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Are you in the Union, though? ??

Seriously, though, what strikes me about stills of that first goal, are that Flekken wasn’t quite in the centre of his goal. He was on the correct side and did look as if he was anticipating a shot to his left. Further, the images suggest that the shot wasn’t quite absolutely in the corner. So why he didn’t at least attempt a dive, I’m not sure, even if he might have ended up beaten for pace.
I’m not I’m afraid, was just a sh1t midfielder who just ran around a lot getting in the way.
The shot hit the side netting, couldn’t get much ‘corner’ than that.
But what winds me up is that it’s Flekkens fault when Damsgaard gives the ball away, Janelt can’t clear it and, if you want to be really picky, Toney doesn’t track back hard enough to put a challenge in.
Let’s all please remember it’s a game of inexactitude and that why it’s so great.
Our coaching/recruitment staff have proved time and time and time again that they know what they’re doing do give the guy a chance FFS.
As a team we’re obviously low in confidence and the worse player we want to suffer with this is the keeper.
Obviously from his distribution he’s not suffering at the moment so let’s hope (and try) to keep it that way.
We’ll be USCWAP if he doesn’t ?
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Think it’s a bit harsh to blame him for either goal, but his lack of movement does himself 0 favours. Never seen a keeper stand still as much as he does, at least if he dives he gives himself an outside chance of pulling off the odd wondersave like Raya used to. His inability to come out and deal with crosses doesn’t help us defensively either, look at Raya for Arsenal’s 3rd goal yesterday, then Flekken for every cross or corner Forest put in yesterday…
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

I’m not I’m afraid, was just a sh1t midfielder who just ran around a lot getting in the way.
The shot hit the side netting, couldn’t get much ‘corner’ than that.
But what winds me up is that it’s Flekkens fault when Damsgaard gives the ball away, Janelt can’t clear it and, if you want to be really picky, Toney doesn’t track back hard enough to put a challenge in.
Let’s all please remember it’s a game of inexactitude and that why it’s so great.
Our coaching/recruitment staff have proved time and time and time again that they know what they’re doing do give the guy a chance FFS.
As a team we’re obviously low in confidence and the worse player we want to suffer with this is the keeper.
Obviously from his distribution he’s not suffering at the moment so let’s hope (and try) to keep it that way.
We’ll be USCWAP if he doesn’t ?
I can’t disagree with most of the above. I’m all for giving a player a chance. I generally back our players to the hilt and am frequently accused of wearing the rose tinted, as has frequently been the case with players such as Sawyers and Jensen. In fact I’m pretty sure I am on record on this very thread, making similar pleas to your own, on Flekken’s behalf. But there does come a time when, presented with the evidence, reality has to kick in. Let’s hope, as you suggest, that his poor mobility is simply the representation of a loss of confidence, and that this is redressed very soon.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Any GK’s on here? Look at his feet position on Mangala’s shot from behind the other goal. Should his feet be that far apart?
Would be amazed to see any goalkeepers on here being coached professionally on a daily basis. FFS.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

He’d just moved his left foot left anticipating the shot to go that side.
Everyone please stop looking at the resultants and start looking at the causes.
Cheap give aways, poor clearances, crap marking, poor challenges were the reasons for their chances/goals yesterday - not sh1t goalkeeping.
And I’m not having a pop at the outfield players; it’s just the way it goes when confidence is low and we’re in a rut.
Agree three main points for keepering instinct anticipation reaction get those right and confidence will follow But we must tighten up in front of him have faith it will come
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Honestly people are over analysing and being over critical, name two games he has had the same defence and midfield in front of him?

It's been a turbulent season with changes every week, back 4/5 changes constantly due to injuries. Lots of goals have been result of some of the worst defending we've done in the PL.

Any keeper will struggle with that. Janelt prime example for the first so so sloppy, or for the second Mee completely lost his man.

Trying to over analysing and find blame on him for outfield errors quite frankly is sad.

He'll absolutely be our number 1 for this and next season. So all the haters can hate or actually support him and build his confidence up. You don't go from being one of the best keepers in Germany to terrible as some would argue.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Would he have saved yesterdays goal (or about 10 others this season) if he had dived? Maybe, probably not. But he’s definitely have more chance of saving it if he dived than just stood there.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Back in the Micky Adams 97-98 season we bought Andy Scott. I remember the general consensus and traditional GP groaning that he was too slow, lazy and rubbish for his reaction to our standard tactic of hoofing it down the line on his side. Most of the time he pulled out of the chase very early. And then the ball went for a throw in the corner or a goal kick. Scott wasn’t slow, lazy or particularly rubbish at third tier level. It’s just that it was obvious to him that he was never going to reach those hopeless punts. We’ve had other players who’d nevertheless get cheered for knackering themselves to try more in those circumstances to the same result.

I suspect Flekken may be doing the same. His vision and judgement is likely much better than ours and a dive that’ll still result in a goal or the ball going wide is a waste. If he was conceding goals which actually ended up in comfortable saving distance it’d be a different matter. But I don’t think he is. The defence is in pretty much every instance at fault for having opened to create an unsaveable chance. If they didn’t know that they’d be along with TF losing confidence in him and I don’t think they are. They know he’s not the problem.
 

Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

Back in the Micky Adams 97-98 season we bought Andy Scott. I remember the general consensus and traditional GP groaning that he was too slow, lazy and rubbish for his reaction to our standard tactic of hoofing it down the line on his side. Most of the time he pulled out of the chase very early. And then the ball went for a throw in the corner or a goal kick. Scott wasn’t slow, lazy or particularly rubbish at third tier level. It’s just that it was obvious to him that he was never going to reach those hopeless punts. We’ve had other players who’d nevertheless get cheered for knackering themselves to try more in those circumstances to the same result.

I suspect Flekken may be doing the same. His vision and judgement is likely much better than ours and a dive that’ll still result in a goal or the ball going wide is a waste. If he was conceding goals which actually ended up in comfortable saving distance it’d be a different matter. But I don’t think he is. The defence is in pretty much every instance at fault for having opened to create an unsaveable chance. If they didn’t know that they’d be along with TF losing confidence in him and I don’t think they are. They know he’s not the problem.
Well said @AB ?
Ditto Sawyers, Jensen, Mbeumo and Holdsworth to name but a few.
Stan Webb was probably world class but we never gave him a chance ?
 
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Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

I want him to be on his toes, anticipating the action coming up. Sure, he won't save everything including yesterday but the number of times a goal has just been waved in suggest to me that something is awry - his reactions, his concentration - who knows?
Totally agree and if you watch there was also another occasion in the second half when he did the same but the ball hit his water bottle. There seems to be no reading of the oppositions players body position or understanding of where the ball is likely to go. I’m not impressed with him at all yet and to think we paid a similar amount as what Spurs did for their goalkeeper I know who I would rather have. He just doesn’t seem nimble enough.
But whilst he is a Bee I will still support him.
 
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