New Stadium Progress

[wanderer paul]

Still would have thought that they would be party to any talks with potential developers, especially as the site entrance is likely to be somewhere close to their strip of land.

i would've thought so too.

As were all the residents behind Ealing Road were, when that was in its planning stage to build the roof, the residents had 'Ancient Lights' as their 'covenant' as it were, so had a say into what style, height etc the stand could be. As did the residents down New Road, but i don;t think they have 'Ancient Lights' to fall back on, just that the stand has been only 3/4's back instead of all the way, backing onto their gardens, so they had a say as to what backing the stand had. But that probably won't be built now anyway.

 

[Mr Cynical]

i think this is what i meant, Fullers don't 'own' any land but they do have a say as to what is built there/future ownership, i'm sure it was mentioned before that as long as an open recreational piece of land is built within any development of GP, that Fullers will agree to it as to not obstruct Brentford's plans to move to LR.

Given that any council planning permission is likely to include a provision for green space I shouldn't imagine this would be a problem?

 

[sleekerslee]

Where's that nice Mr Assett Stripper-Lange.

 

[PrincessBee]

likewise but apparently not!!!!

having a covenant over something doesn't mean you own it.

 

[JBN]

Isn't it a restrictive covenant, which should be capable of being overturned by a decent property lawyer.

Depends on the age of the covenant, wether the beneficiary or their successors in title are still alive/trading/able to enforce the covenant.

Specialist insurance can be obtained, however, I would have thought that in this instance if the covenant can be 'overcome' by providing recreational space within the proposal at GP it would not be worth the effort. If it couldn't be overcome, the premium may be rediculously high as Fullers are still trading and even if Fullers were bought out, they would have successors in title who could enforce the covenant.

 

[bees52 bomber]

Saw martin lange at a meeting in stripes when butcher openly said that he couldnt motivate the players , wasnt long after that he walked , but lange is still there hanging around the closet.

 

[bees52 bomber]

After reading through all this thread last night . Now can someone please explain why the club which is run by the fans,when some of them ask for a standing singing area to be incorporated they are told catergorically NO WAY.
I personally think that its time to show the fans exactly whats going to be on offer, facilities wise for football and other functions.as it gets nearer it will be to late to change and we certainly dont want that do we .I know that you have shown a visual aerial view but doesn't really answer what i'm asking ?
I well aware that L/R is a couple of years away but we dont want to see the real fans being pushed to one side by the corporate side, like the emirates is suffering at the moment ,as stripes clearly showed it couldn't sustain the meagre usage ?????

 

[PrincessBee]

having campaigned for safe standing areas for some years, i think that usually the reasons behind stadiums particularly of smaller clubs like ours not being able to go for standing areas are to do with the grants that are available. because of legislation a lot of the grants that are vital in helping with the cost of new stadia are only available to all seater stadia.

there's also the often stated reason that a club could not afford to convert were they to gain promotion to, say, the championship.

i think until the goverment relax thier stance on standing areas, all, or very nearly all, new stadia in the football league will go the same way i'm afraid.

i think the nearest we could get would be to have an area slightly over-designed so as to allow for an area to potentially be converted from seating to a safe-standing area in the future, tho as anything that goes away from a relatively standardised design increases costs considerably, i won't be holding my breath.

you'd be better off joining the safe standing campaign (if you havent already) at http://www.safestanding.com/action.php tho the site is having a bit of a revamp currently so it might not be too easily navigable. if the government can be convinced to loosen the restrictions on grants and so on, it would be a lot easier for clubs to implement the fans wishes.

hope that helps.

 

[Gee Bee]

Still would have thought that they would be party to any talks with potential developers, especially as the site entrance is likely to be somewhere close to their strip of land.

Maybe they are being kept informed. From memory there was a Mr Turner representing them in the early days of discussions. He attended a fans forum in the past and is part of the Turner family of Fullers Smith & Turner.

 

[ianallon]

i think that usually the reasons behind stadiums particularly of smaller clubs like ours not being able to go for standing areas are to do with the grants that are available. because of legislation a lot of the grants that are vital in helping with the cost of new stadia are only available to all seater stadia.

Is there anyone 'in the know' who could confirm this?

 

[SpiderBee]

having campaigned for safe standing areas for some years, i think that usually the reasons behind stadiums particularly of smaller clubs like ours not being able to go for standing areas are to do with the grants that are available. because of legislation a lot of the grants that are vital in helping with the cost of new stadia are only available to all seater stadia.

there's also the often stated reason that a club could not afford to convert were they to gain promotion to, say, the championship.

i think until the goverment relax thier stance on standing areas, all, or very nearly all, new stadia in the football league will go the same way i'm afraid.

i think the nearest we could get would be to have an area slightly over-designed so as to allow for an area to potentially be converted from seating to a safe-standing area in the future, tho as anything that goes away from a relatively standardised design increases costs considerably, i won't be holding my breath.

you'd be better off joining the safe standing campaign (if you havent already) at http://www.safestanding.com/action.php tho the site is having a bit of a revamp currently so it might not be too easily navigable. if the government can be convinced to loosen the restrictions on grants and so on, it would be a lot easier for clubs to implement the fans wishes.

hope that helps.

So, take the grant money, get standing permision from the FA, and store the seats until the Championship is reached!

 

[PrincessBee]

So, take the grant money, get standing permision from the FA, and store the seats until the Championship is reached!

nah, you mean take the grants, build the stadium, tear out the seats, then put them back when we get to the championship right?

 

[Boston Bee]

Or have them bolted in so that they can be removed and added as required. Isn't this what they do in all the big stadia in Germany??

nah, you mean take the grants, build the stadium, tear out the seats, then put them back when we get to the championship right?

 

[PrincessBee]

Or have them bolted in so that they can be removed and added as required. Isn't this what they do in all the big stadia in Germany??

it is, but my understanding (and i'm sure someone brighter will correct me if i'm wrong) is that to support that, the stand would need to be designed with a bigger load factor to cope with the potential added movement. ie - a stand that's only build for seating, doesn't have to be designed as strong, or at least in quite the same way, as one that's for standing. in any case it's not as simple as just taking the seats out.

you can go from standing to seating fine, but something that's only built for seating can't necessarily be converted to standing, without then breaching ISO/BS standards.

or something. i know what i mean.

 

[Boston Bee]

Yes...but it hasn't actually been built.

it is, but my understanding (and i'm sure someone brighter will correct me if i'm wrong) is that to support that, the stand would need to be designed with a bigger load factor to cope with the potential added movement. ie - a stand that's only build for seating, doesn't have to be designed as strong, or at least in quite the same way, as one that's for standing. in any case it's not as simple as just taking the seats out.

you can go from standing to seating fine, but something that's only built for seating can't necessarily be converted to standing, without then breaching ISO/BS standards.

or something. i know what i mean.

 

[PrincessBee]

i realise that. what i meant was, and i think i said so in the first of my mammoth and dull posts on this, that doing it that way will probably cost more, and i was under the impression that in general, as a club, we're not big into things that cost more. :shrug:

don't shoot the messenger, if it was down to me there'd be a standing area in every ground in the land. but it is hard to do in the current political environment, and as i said, the best thing to do would be to put pressure on your elected representatives to change that.

 

[Ambrose_1889]

Well, I'd rather see us invest in a stand that is able to be converted to standing (and vice versa if need be, UEFA competitions etc), if the law changes than a food outlet or cinema for example. First and foremost, this is a place for Brentford fans to watch their team. Let their wants and needs be prioritised.

 

[bees52 bomber]

Or have them bolted in so that they can be removed and added as required. Isn't this what they do in all the big stadia in Germany??

SIMPLE REALLY especially when its a new build ?????

 

[PrincessBee]

the bolt on bolt off 'safe standing' areas that they have in germany are still considered in the same way as normal standing by the uk government, so you'd still have the problems with grants and eligibility for the upper divisions though.

 

[The H]

i think a brand new stadium with terracing looks ghey.....

 

[Luke Kirton]

just a quick reminder in case you have forgoten. BIAS asked fans awhile back for thier views on what they would like at a new stadium:


This what fans said they wanted:

http://www.bias.org.uk/news_story.php?id=199_1_2009

This is the response to that:

http://www.bias.org.uk/news_story.php?id=201_1_2009

You will also find on the BIAS site updates on regular meetings about Lionel Road that BIAS are attending on our behalf.

Contact them if you missed out getting invloved the first time around I am sure there will be other opportunities.

 

[bees52 bomber]

Thanks for that info Luke Kirton, but no pictures available of how they envisage the stadium will look at ground level and users areas . Will there be a pub on each corner ,standing areas, catering areas , supporters lounge, with all those questions and answers from your info its quite clear that there are still a lot of ifs and butts and that survey i believe was carried out in April .Well has there been a updated facts SHEET OR PROPOSAL because i'm sure i'm not the only one thinking this, thanks in advance for any new update.

 

[Edmundo]

Luke, that consultation was carried out by the Lionel Road Stadium Consultation Group, which BIAS is involved with, but not by BIAS as you seem to be implying.

 

[Ambrose_1889]

Found this picture on another forum, which is apparently a design for Lionel Road. Make of it what you will. Just looks like a cross between Reading and Wigan to me.

 

[PrincessBee]

very interesting, where was that? are there more?

 

[Ambrose_1889]

On a website called footballforums.net and it was the only one posted.

 

[maddogging]

Found this picture on another forum, which is apparently a design for Lionel Road. Make of it what you will. Just looks like a cross between Reading and Wigan to me.

:love2:

 

[walkerbee]

not too shabby
the stand on the right is huddersfield-esque

 

[Les Beeavinu]

Found this picture on another forum, which is apparently a design for Lionel Road. Make of it what you will. Just looks like a cross between Reading and Wigan to me.

Surely it's better to cut the grass crossways. Typical - we have architects who know nothing about football.

 

[JBN]

Surely it's better to cut the grass crossways. Typical - we have architects who no nothing about football.

But then you get a hooped effect and as we all know, only poofs wear hoops

 

[BuzzBeeSi]

I'm a bit concerned about the source of this.

But that looks incredible

 

[PrincessBee]

it is very pretty, but there's nowt there that confirms it as LR.

 

[Les Beeavinu]

But then you get a hooped effect and as we all know, only poofs wear hoops

Only if you sit behind the goals. Everybody else gets lines.

 

[JBN]

Only if you sit behind the goals.

Ah yes, I remember those days, in the Brook Rd Upper.

 

[PrincessBee]

there are people that don't sit/stand behind the goals?

 

[BuzzBeeSi]

Below is a link to the new hoarding graphic that's going up around the Lionel Road site. it would appear that the image used is the same shape as the one posted above (sloping from the main stand to the shorter stand opposite).

http://www.kdwebserver.co.uk/~brentfor/images/uploads/A1955_SK_081001_P1_Hoarding_R.pdf

 

[Ubee]

Whilst I'm not able to substantiate this, I have a heard a rumour that all the deals are now done. Barratts are doing the build; they are not phased about the current crunch as they think things will all be good in less than 5 years (ha!), and this is a medium-long term project.
Watermans is gone, as is the leisure centre. Stadium will incorporate a gym and other stuff, but can't remember what.
Can't recall the other bits that I heard - don't know which direction the grass will be cut

Oh - and i don't know how much of this is old news

 

[PrincessBee]

hoarding looks nice too.

 

[Isleworth_Bee]

:bound::love2::banana::bound:

looks quality

 

[Lokster]

Luke, that consultation was carried out by the Lionel Road Stadium Consultation Group, which BIAS is involved with, but not by BIAS as you seem to be implying.

I don't think he is implying that. :shrug:

 

[Davee]

It's all well and good, but our formational play is all over the shop!!!!

 

[PrincessBee]

lol

 

[Isleworth_Bee]

rofl

 

[bees52 bomber]

Thanks for the pretty pictures ambrose 1889 bit worrying that PINCHS seat is empty ,has the chief safety officer had his wicked way the PADDOCK IS BEAR L O L

 

[Les Beeavinu]

Ah yes, I remember those days, in the Brook Rd Upper.

Anyway, it'll look odd on tele which is where you watch your games now isn't it?

 

[JBN]

Anyway, it'll look odd on tele which is where you watch your games now isn't it?

Not a chance, I have a 4 year old son who wants to watch Thomas the Tank Engine and an 9 year old who wants to watch the Simpsons, I'm well down the TV food chain in my own house.

 

[ladbroke]

I'm a bit concerned about the source of this.

But that looks incredible

That picture was posted by myself on FF.net.

 

[readingbee]

It's all well and good, but our formational play is all over the shop!!!!

And we only seem to be fielding 10 players................are we that confident lol

 

[Ambrose_1889]

That picture was posted by myself on FF.net.

Where did you get it from?

 

[ladbroke]

And we only seem to be fielding 10 players................are we that confident lol

could we not be taking a corner in that image?