Fitz as manager?

[Deleted member 2202]

Today's game shows that Fitz clearly isn't the man for the job long-term. Frampton should have been handed the armband a long time ago - captaincy brings the best out in him, and it brings the worst out in O'Connor. Also, Heywood should have played - no way he'd have got outmuscled for the goal.

If we're to make the playoffs in League 2 next year we need to get an experienced older manager in - they ARE out there!

 

[big neil]

I think we should seriously be thinking about approaching Newell for next season

would that be the handballing cheat who scored for wigan against us in the Freight Rover Final at Wembley?

 

[letsallgotolourdes]

MIKE NEWELL

would that be the handballing cheat who scored for wigan against us in the Freight Rover Final at Wembley?

22 years ago, glad to see you don't hold any long term grudges, I seem to recall they scored 2 other goals that day, get over it mate!lol

 

[westy]

Leary and moushino in centre midfield definately aint Evans and Mahon. Thats why we're going down a p#ss poor midield. O'conner's worst ever season in a reds shirt. I want to hear what Fitz say's. He can't defend them any more, or himself! I'll be back, but my season tkt may be put away for till next year. Panto seasons over for me.

 

[Downbeat Bee]

Thread title: Fitz as manager?

At the time I thought he was the wrong appointment and I thought the outcome of the interview process was a farce.

I feel that the rot is as bad as it has ever been since I started watching Brentford (1988) and the situtation is actually much worse than some think it is - how many would you want to keep / can we afford to keep for next year? Almost no one.

Our aim next year has to be keeping in league football

 

[paulm]

FITZ OUT NOW - sh*t

 

[jonny c]

Thread title: Fitz as manager?

At the time I thought he was the wrong appointment and I thought the outcome of the interview process was a farce.

I feel that the rot is as bad as it has ever been since I started watching Brentford (1988) and the situtation is actually much worse than some think it is - how many would you want to keep / can we afford to keep for next year? Almost no one.

Our aim next year has to be keeping in league football

Unfortunately, his job is to win football matches. He has failed miserably bar a mini revival of 3 games. Fitz

 

[Les Beeavinu]

What time did you leave to post this at 17.09

I couldn't help myself - so fecking angry I posted it on the way to the car.

 

[Brentford St George]

Nice bloke but not up to the job.We need a complete clear out soon including him,Dyke and a large percentage of the squad.

Wipe the slate clean and start again pre - season.

This club i love is crumbling and i hate to say it but we are in the 5hit

 

[Carri Bee Un]

You're right. I've been mad not to see it. I suggest we implement the 'letsallgo' plan to find someone to throw money at the club with no strings attached.

 

[West Wilts Bee]

Thread title: Fitz as manager?

At the time I thought he was the wrong appointment and I thought the outcome of the interview process was a farce.

I feel that the rot is as bad as it has ever been since I started watching Brentford (1988) and the situtation is actually much worse than some think it is - how many would you want to keep / can we afford to keep for next year? Almost no one.

Our aim next year has to be keeping in league football

Spot on Downbeat, I have followed the bees since 62. I can tell you that this is the worst bees team in my time of supporting them by far. This must be the worst team in bees history. I can handle the team not being just good enough, but to play like a gutless bunch that have no pride and guts.Makes me feel embarressed to support this rabble . the other thing that pisses me off, was that I said this would happen, only to get laughed and insulted by peoples on here who IMO should have known better. A sub 5000 gate yesterday . relegation is now almost certain and gates are going to drop even more now, not to mention the gates next season. i would love to know how much money we are losing each week. I hate to say i told you so, but if it's any consolation i will be one of the 3-4000. that turn up and watch us next season. I watched Fitz's body language yesterday, and i think he's given up.

 

[pmhbees]

I remember pre Leroy appointment a few people had Danny Wilson on their lists, but most opinions were of the nature of 'old hat'. Didn't start well at Hartlepool but 22 game unbeaten run and coming back from 3-0 yesterday shows something. They will be taking our place next season in league one so as far as I am concerned we have to get someone with experience. We were lucky with Martin Allen and with this board not likely to be again.

 

[bees_boy_90]

I remember pre Leroy appointment a few people had Danny Wilson on their lists, but most opinions were of the nature of 'old hat'. Didn't start well at Hartlepool but 22 game unbeaten run and coming back from 3-0 yesterday shows something. They will be taking our place next season in league one so as far as I am concerned we have to get someone with experience. We were lucky with Martin Allen and with this board not likely to be again.

danny wilson was my choice, but oph well.

i think fitz has failed in his time now, i am sorruy to say it but his signings have been poor decisions havent help, andd it may be time for a new start next year. allow fitz to go back to youth team, reservers or assistant manager. new man for the promotion push next year.

 

[letsallgotolourdes]

No one likes (wants) us, we don't care.

You're right. I've been mad not to see it. I suggest we implement the 'letsallgo' plan to find someone to throw money at the club with no strings attached.

No, no you're right, lets just bury our heads in the sand and pretend everything will be alright. I presume the reason we have a board is they would vet potential investors but I forgot there's nobody out there.

 

[love and mercy]

Spot on Downbeat, I have followed the bees since 62. I can tell you that this is the worst bees team in my time of supporting them by far. This must be the worst team in bees history. I can handle the team not being just good enough, but to play like a gutless bunch that have no pride and guts.Makes me feel embarressed to support this rabble . the other thing that pisses me off, was that I said this would happen, only to get laughed and insulted by peoples on here who IMO should have known better. A sub 5000 gate yesterday . relegation is now almost certain and gates are going to drop even more now, not to mention the gates next season. i would love to know how much money we are losing each week. I hate to say i told you so, but if it's any consolation i will be one of the 3-4000. that turn up and watch us next season. I watched Fitz's body language yesterday, and i think he's given up.

I also watched Fitz yesterday ,his body language said it all.
It was a different Fitz to previous games. It was very sad to see . I like him but the players have let him down big time.
If we get a new manager we must get rid of the likes of Frampton ,Willock ect
They are all dead wood and they are no good to us . We need players with guts and character

 

[Stanley]

We can only judge a manager on results and sadly it is obvious that he can get no more out of the team than LR despite bringing in a number of his own players.

I don't know what makes a good manager that is for the Board to decide, many on here are saying it is experience at this level then how do you account for what Ince has done at Macclesfield or Keane at Sunderland, they have been arguably less experienced than Fitz.

I feel LR and Fitz were decent coaches and "nice guys" but you need someone to make the big decisions and they don't seem to have it.

A clean sweep is needed and now that relegation is a certainty then the planning must start now.

 

[abee]

.......i would love to know how much money we are losing each week.

Somewhere north of £10k per week in hard cash which rate of losses can be expected to continue next season with the income down from falling gates matched by a reduced playing budget.

If anyone else had bought a majority stake in this club for £1 in January 2006 and turned in this sort of performance both on and off the field then we would have burnt Griffin Park down by now. However we have a chairman who has not a clue on how to lead the sorting out of a small business in very serious financial trouble and who fails to provide the leadership so desperately needed. We have an impotent holding company and a BFC board completely adrift and turning in on itself. Someone needs to get a grip on the business........we need an executive committee to run this Club made up of individuals who do have the experience of sorting out businesses. David Heath and Ian Jones I suggest would be an excellent start for the committee......these two have the nous, business sense and drive to get it turned around. Forget what you have been told by Bees United........BU has not put together a "professional board" to run BFC. It is a hopeless shambles.

 

[VTG]

abee well we certainly don't need Greg Dyke sitting there all smug and non-executive just doing mildly self-patronising interviews for the telly when it suits him and not putting his hand in his pocket! What's the point of him being there? He can jog on sharpish.

 

[RoyalOakBee]

Somewhere north of £10k per week in hard cash which rate of losses can be expected to continue next season with the income down from falling gates matched by a reduced playing budget.

If anyone else had bought a majority stake in this club for £1 in January 2006 and turned in this sort of performance both on and off the field then we would have burnt Griffin Park down by now. However we have a chairman who has not a clue on how to lead the sorting out of a small business in very serious financial trouble and who fails to provide the leadership so desperately needed. We have an impotent holding company and a BFC board completely adrift and turning in on itself. Someone needs to get a grip on the business........we need an executive committee to run this Club made up of individuals who do have the experience of sorting out businesses. David Heath and Ian Jones I suggest would be an excellent start for the committee......these two have the nous, business sense and drive to get it turned around. Forget what you have been told by Bees United........BU has not put together a "professional board" to run BFC. It is a hopeless shambles.

No disrespect meant abee, but you would say these two wouldn't you?
What is more is that they were part of a previous committee whose one task has ben described by many (including you?) as becoming a shambles and a laughing stock with one of the four ultimately responsible (presumably) for the leak about Patterson.
I believe for what it is worth that this years die has been set and that those currently running both BU and BFC boards will have to end this financial year and take stock. Can Brian Burgess or anyone else really hold roles on both boards? Should BU not been big enough to consider the mistakes and to make real changes by listening to both its membership and the total fan base of Brentford?
Through all the bickering, healthy as it may be, it appears to me that BU is being guided by one man at the top who is challenged in debate but rarely defeated in vote. The accountability issues are rarely communicated properly imho, not so we know who is to blame, but so we know who is responsible for sorting each issue out. When this changes then and only then can people be measured on their results in the same way the team and manager are in their respective areas of responsibility.
There are many fans who know how to run a business but few are prepared to step up to the parapet for fear of being shot at and shot down. I would suggest Brian Smithers as freely as you would suggest David Heath but neither would necessarily be the right man. Until we can see the year end figures nobody outside of the board presumably knows for sure what other revenue streams have been put in place this last ten months and how successful they have been and when times are hard it easy to point fingers and apportion blame and far too easy to make changes for changes sake.
For instance, has replacing Leroy changed anything? No it would seem and we could have saved one hell of a lot of money if we had just taken stock, kept with him and the squad assembled and started again with Patterson or Fitzgerald next season. It was a gamble that as yet has not paid dividends and as such those that took that gamble must take responsibility and I believe your two nominees are as equally responsible for that gamble as GD, JG and KD?

 

[abee]

It was a gamble that as yet has not paid dividends and as such those that took that gamble must take responsibility and I believe your two nominees are as equally responsible for that gamble as GD, JG and KD?

Just to be clear.......Ian Jones is not my nominee but David Heath certainly is. I have never met Ian Jones but I offered him up as an example because he has I believe a background in sorting out small companies in difficulties. David Heath's background is well known to me.

I hold every member of the BFC and BU boards as culpable RoyalOakBee. I happen to believe that the BFC board as a whole is just about the most incompetent and poorly led that you could possibly assemble. My despair is that the man who makes the decisions for Bees United (that is Brian Burgess) has told us that BU could sit back and relax knowing that he had assembled a "professional board of directors" to look after the affairs of Brentford Football Club on behalf of the owners Bees United. We've done this before of course and I have commented in the past.......if this is Brian's idea of running the club professionally and he is proud of the off the field team that he has put together then there is absolutely no hope for the future. That is my personal viewpoint....others live on a different planet to me, trust the two boards completely and clearly life goes on without a ripple to disturb the serene, peaceful waters of the BFC board room and the BU board meetings.

 

[PJ]

Whoever is manager next season faces a huge challenge. The seven or eight players currently on contracts next season take up @£500k pa (nobody disputed that figure on another thread so i guess it wasnt a million miles out). Four of those are on big money by our standards and we need to try and get rid.
If memory serves this year`s budget started at £1.1m? God knows what it ended up as mind
If we`re stuck with all the under performing high earners then whoever is in charge next year will probably only have £3-400k max of salaries to distribute amongst what 14 players?

 

[Ace Face]

I like Fitz as a person and he says the right things, but this is a results business and his signings apart from Abbey have been awful.

Also no public evidence of trying to get rid of the crap like Heywood, Brooker, Tillen, Frampton & O`Connor.

Can we at not at least try violence, a bung, transfer listing or a gross misconduct sting involving Wynhart.

We also need to replace Reeves role with a player coach ala Williams at Colchester - now their manager.

I would give Fitz the Youth job.

 

[PJ]

Also no public evidence of trying to get rid of the crap like Heywood, Brooker, Tillen, Frampton & O`Connor.

i`d give all those 5 free transfers, they are either not good enough or earning too much. Or both. Start again from scratch

 

[westy]

i`d give all those 5 free transfers, they are either not good enough or earning too much. Or both. Start again from scratch

What about your beloved John mousinho?

 

[marlowbee]

danny wilson was my choice, but oph well.

i think fitz has failed in his time now, i am sorruy to say it but his signings have been poor decisions havent help, andd it may be time for a new start next year. allow fitz to go back to youth team, reservers or assistant manager. new man for the promotion push next year.

Your deluding yourself, we are more likely to end up in the conference after next year, players on long term deals Heywood, Frampton, O,Connor, Kuffor and Ide likely to go, loanees to return, where are we going to get a winning side from, look at MK Dons & Wycombe their squads are much better than ours and they are not finding getting out of Div.2 easy. When I watched that game yesterday I could not think that team could beat many in the conference, let alone Div.2.

 

[PJ]

What about your beloved John mousinho?

lol "beloved" lol
Think hes got another years contract, but is cheaper than the others, still young and may develop. Might be a centre-half, wouldnt mind him having a go there

 

[rebus]

i`d give all those 5 free transfers, they are either not good enough or earning too much.

Not without some sizeable compensation comeinng their way PJ, you can't just dump players anymore.

I remember all the bitching at me from others on here about my complaint that giving three year deals to O'Connor and Frampton in September was ridiculous.

Next season, it is likely that our top three earners are all defenders. An absolutely crazy scenerio.

 

[PJ]

I remember all the bitching at me from others on here about my complaint that giving three year deals to O'Connor and Frampton in September was ridiculous.

Was shoulder to shoulder with you on that
Agreed we`re probably lumbered but efforts must be made to move them on, MA might take one or two

 

[West Wilts Bee]

Your deluding yourself, we are more likely to end up in the conference after next year, players on long term deals Heywood, Frampton, O,Connor, Kuffor and Ide likely to go, loanees to return, where are we going to get a winning side from, look at MK Dons & Wycombe their squads are much better than ours and they are not finding getting out of Div.2 easy. When I watched that game yesterday I could not think that team could beat many in the conference, let alone Div.2.

Your right , this is bloody frightening. But the writing was on the wall for me for the last year. Unfortuantly not many seem to have seen it coming. I'm not like abee, he can see it all coming from the financial side. I'm pretty much spot on from the football side. call it 42 years of watching Brentford.
Although I would prefer to call it experience.

 

[BuzzBeeSi]

I hope to god Fitz is NOT our manager next season. He came on the radio after the match. He was asked what he said to the team in the dressing room afterwards. He replied that there was nothing you can say, there's no point because you can't change what happened in the last 90 mins.

FFS.

A manager needs to kick the team up the arse and make them afraid to play that poorly ever again.

The whole club is incompetent.

 

[Thorne In The Side]

I think the club should kick out Fitz, anounce a ten point recruitment plan and end up with Jim Stannard as our new manager following three months of interviews.
Then we can linch the fat fulham **** and bury him in Lionel Road, cos let's face it, that's the only time LR will see any construction work in the coming year!

 

[Nick Hester]

Then we can linch the fat fulham **** and bury him in Lionel Road, cos let's face it, that's the only time LR will see any construction work in the coming year!

That will take some excavation work....have you seen how fat that free lunching Fulham sniggering fool is?

 

[letsallgotolourdes]

our saviour

lol

Your right , this is bloody frightening. But the writing was on the wall for me for the last year. Unfortuantly not many seem to have seen it coming. I'm not like abee, he can see it all coming from the financial side. I'm pretty much spot on from the football side. call it 42 years of watching Brentford.
Although I would prefer to call it experience.

If your football knowledge is as BIG as your ego, I think we should install you as chairman, coach, manager and centre forward or maybe you could take over from Steve McClaren. Hang on I've just noticed the 42 years bit ,sadly I think it's the onset of senile dementia and to think I got annoyed because you called me a F*****g idiot the other week, you're to be sympathised with, not mocked.

 

[PJ]

There are question marks about Fitz but his post-match comments are at least refreshing......no bullshit and to the point. He agrees with everyone that yesterday was unacceptable at least.

All managers are judged by results and rightly so. If we kep changing managers every 5 minutes we`ll never have any stability and the players` contracts situation next season will be a millstone for whoever is in charge as there will be so little room for manoeuvre no matter who is in the hot seat.

Personally i`d be inclined to reserve judgement on Fitz until the end of the season. He`s a rookie and learning, has done some good things and we`re generally more competitive (yesterday aside).

His replacement - if it happens - will probably be a rookie who`s also learning. If he cant make a silk cow out of a pigs purse (or whatever that poxy cliche is!) what then? Seek another boss at Xmas? Another compo payment?

Plenty of questions but who has the answers. A knee-jerk "Fitz out" reaction doesnt solve all the problems at GP IMHO

 

[Carri Bee Un]

No, no you're right, lets just bury our heads in the sand and pretend everything will be alright. I presume the reason we have a board is they would vet potential investors but I forgot there's nobody out there.

The reason we have a board is to vet the applications to give us money lol I am sure this is exactly the propblem, we've seen **** all from Dyke cos he's going through the many applications from insane millionaires that want to give us money. It's a time consuming job

me a F*****g idiot

 

[West Wilts Bee]

lol If your football knowledge is as BIG as your ego, I think we should install you as chairman, coach, manager and centre forward or maybe you could take over from Steve McClaren. Hang on I've just noticed the 42 years bit ,sadly I think it's the onset of senile dementia and to think I got annoyed because you called me a F*****g idiot the other week, you're to be sympathised with, not mocked.

Yeah whatever Chaiman will do for now. Might have a go at the management if Fitz goes. I hope you have a nice week to.

 

[West Wilts Bee]

lol If your football knowledge is as BIG as your ego, I think we should install you as chairman, coach, manager and centre forward or maybe you could take over from Steve McClaren. Hang on I've just noticed the 42 years bit ,sadly I think it's the onset of senile dementia and to think I got annoyed because you called me a F*****g idiot the other week, you're to be sympathised with, not mocked.

Yeah whatever Chaiman will do for now. Might have a go at the management if Fitz goes. I hope you have a nice week to.

 

[West Wilts Bee]

lol If your football knowledge is as BIG as your ego, I think we should install you as chairman, coach, manager and centre forward or maybe you could take over from Steve McClaren. Hang on I've just noticed the 42 years bit ,sadly I think it's the onset of senile dementia and to think I got annoyed because you called me a F*****g idiot the other week, you're to be sympathised with, not mocked.

Are you sure I called you a ****ing idiot. I thought I said bloody idiot. Must be the denmentia . Your right about my ego though. Thats why I'm a success in life and not a failure. Next time your passing Wiltshire way.pop into my nice detached four bedroom house for a cocktail or two. Lifes a bitch aint it.
You make sure you have a nice week nowrofl rofl

 

[ChinaBee]

Dyke do the decent thing now, sack fitz appoint yourself first team manager, sign a few fringe premiership players on big wages. Get a good coach to help you, match his salary with yours (around £200k a year), give them all BMW's (mercedes are yesterday cars). Get promoted, be the new god in most peoples eyes and then tell us its a dream

Nobody would ever do that to a club they love would they

Two questions from this rant

1. why is Fitz still here
2. Is Dyke still here? If so why?

3 questions I know

 

[jonny c]

Your right , this is bloody frightening. But the writing was on the wall for me for the last year. Unfortuantly not many seem to have seen it coming. I'm not like abee, he can see it all coming from the financial side. I'm pretty much spot on from the football side. call it 42 years of watching Brentford.
Although I would prefer to call it experience.

From another thread...

Fitz IMO could be one of the best managers this club has had. I really liked fitz as a player in the great escape. But many on this board have said if we get relegated fitz should get the chop. This imo is bollox, if we go down keep the faith in fitz. In time he will get us out of this mess.

Looking spot on so far.

 

[West Wilts Bee]

From another thread...



Looking spot on so far. [/QUOTE

Yeah thats my big ego, everyone should have one. PJ has got it about right, you cannot keep chopping and changing managers.If we're honest we were going down before fitz got the job. He never let the fans down, the players did that.

 

[glorybee]

If I remembr rightly the board spent many hours last year trying to con somebody to become a manager of a club with no money,no decent players, only a couple of likely looking young prospects. In the end they had to ask Fitz to take on the thankless job amd being a Brentford man agreed. His only experience was training the youth team, which has to be damn sight easier than trying to make something out of the ramshacle mob parading as Our first team. Let's be honest he has improved things and we should give him credit for that and if the players had played with the same amount of dedication and effort that Fitz has put in then we would be better off. Think for one moment, What has this period done to Fitz? It has probably killed off any desire to manage any kind of football team, let alone going back to the youth side.
O.K. as you are all saying, let's get rid of Fitz, chuck him out,he's a failure or whatever you want to call him, WHO do you honestly think Brentford could hope to convince to take on this club. Get Greg Dyke to open his wallet and say here you are 50,000 quid a week and the job is yours. Of course he would like the money but what a job and he would probably turn it down.
I say stick with Fitz, because we cannot get any one else and let him do the best he can until the club has money to buy us out of whatever league we are in. All we can do is stick with the only club worth sticking with.
I know i'm in oz but I still have the same feelings as every one else about the club I have supported Since my first game In 1944( and we had an Air raid alert at the game)

 

[Brain-dead Bee]

I'm undecided about Fitz, but I think the board should grasp the nettle and make a decision one way or the other by Easter (when I think our relegation may well be confirmed).

If Fitz is to be kept on, it enables him to use the last few games to try out some of the kids with a view to assessing who is worth a contract next season, whereas if he's in doubt he might prefer to maximise points in order to improve his chances of keeping the job, and thus take 'safe' options with more experienced players.

If they decide he's not up to it, the last few games will be a mess, but at least we might have a new manager by the time decisions have to be taken on contracts, unlike last season when Allen had to make those decisions when everyone knew he was going (though, to be fair, I don't think we lost anyone we should have kept).

Whoever's in charge, they won't have much scope for playing the transfer market, even for frees: O'Connor, Frampton, Heywood, Brooker, Tillen, Mousinho and Carder-Andrews are there already (though taking up decreasing sums of money going down that list). We should certainly keep Ide, and make Kuffour an offer (though I'm sure he won't take it). Of the other senior players, I'm not sure anyone is worth an offer: perhaps the cheaper of Abbey/Nelson (I'd just prefer Abbey), and Keith would be a possible if wages OK, Richards if ColU would release him. For Griffiths, Pinault, Rhodes, Leary (I know he's only on loan), Shipperley, Willock, Owusu, it has to be goodbye (unless Lloyd scores 6-7 goals and will take a pay cut). Of the kids, Masters is worth a year, Osborne edges out Charles if we want one defender, and it's goodbye to Peters

 

[beeeehive]

A new manager will be more willing to come in now as he will have the whole of the close season to change things around. It was a high pressure situation when Fitz came in.

 

[NorthamptonBee]

A new manager will be more willing to come in now as he will have the whole of the close season to change things around. It was a high pressure situation when Fitz came in.

And because of this I have sympathy for him. I think he turned us around and there is no comparison to the crap served up by Leroy but his players really let him down for the past few weeks and we can't afford that to happen next season.:sad:

 

[Jimbo]

I think we need to see where we are at in May.

If we dont win another game between now and the end of the season feelings towards Fitz will undoubtedly change.

However, if we go on a little run, knock in a few goals and make a fight of it (even if Fitz fails to deliver on keeping us up) I think there may be a lot said for continuity.

If we do get relegated, another one next season would be a catastrophe, some experience may be needed as well as enthusiasm

 

[BrightonBee]

And because of this I have sympathy for him. I think he turned us around and there is no comparison to the crap served up by Leroy but his players really let him down for the past few weeks and we can't afford that to happen next season.:sad:

Agreed, he inherited an absolute mess. He was fighting a losing battle from day one. :sad:

 

[beeeehive]

And because of this I have sympathy for him. I think he turned us around and there is no comparison to the crap served up by Leroy but his players really let him down for the past few weeks and we can't afford that to happen next season.:sad:

I have sympathy for both managers and what they've been asked to do in the time they had. Leroy had to find a spine of the team in a short time with a small budget and no real prepartion time, Fitz has to bring in players. To be fair though, Fitz had a bigger budget and was allowed to bring in lots and lots of players knowing what we already had and who he wanted having worked with some of these players before. They just haven't worked and sadly he's actually done worse then Leroy in terms or results and points.

I don't agree with the comparison you've mentioned, it's been crap all season in general and not got any better. The football is anything has got far worse to watch. Hoof, hoof, hoof, hoof.

 

[NorthamptonBee]

Huddersfield, Blackpool and Yeovil wasn't hoof.

 

[Jakalo]

Huddersfield, Blackpool and Yeovil wasn't hoof.

I guess the majority are home game only fans.

He's already said that they'll concentrate on 'nice football' next season.