Mark Flekken (Closed Thread)

[TadB]

He could have caught the cross if he stood still!

Leave the bloke alone. You will not get a goal keeper as good as Raya unless we lob out 40/50 million. Just accept that Raya has gone.

 

[WARFIELD BEE]

I have been concerned about him since the American tour, keeper is a vital position and can win you games, IMO at
the moment he is a risk we cannot afford, I was hoping with his size he was going to command his area but the xg of -6
concerns me.

 

[longtimeagobee]

I have been as patient as I can be but I think it must be said: Unless there is a massive improvement on his end of the remainder of the year, we must have a different keeper come next season. I think we can get away with it this year despite all the injuries due to how poor the bottom teams are. Feels like Europe is impossible or close to it with our current position. Hopefully he improves but he's been given ample opportunity and shown that while he can distribute as well as any keeper out there, he's overall just not up to standard.

Don’t mean to be rude, but you’ve been a fan since 2021, from the US.
That you have been as patient as you could be ain’t really going to cut it round these parts?

 

[kewbee]

Might have needed to jump a it but yes I agree. What is the point of taking up that 'advanced' position if your first action is to retreat to your goal line?

It’s his default reaction when a cross comes in. Very rarely claims a ball in the box.

 

[Lush55]

I gave him a bit of a bashing earlier, it is the ponderous way he passes to defenders and in return they pass back.
I was always taught to move the ball forward, it is for midfield to make themselves available for the pass and then the forwards to do the same.
We were very good at the passing ball in the championship, not sure why that has gone?
Our game seems to be very slow from keeper to midfield and then relies on the breakaway via KLP, Bryan etc.
We don't need a keeper and 3/4 defenders pushing the ball to each other and then wacking it for the chase, bypassing midfield in the process.

 

[gordonbankole]

I think after half a season it is fair to make a decent assessment of Flekken.

Fine with his feet, no question.

People have asked if he has made any decent saves, and yes, he made a superb double save against Palace. I struggle to remember any more.

However, there have been a number of goals in the “could have done better” category.

His retreats towards his goal line when a cross comes over into his six-yard box are very bizarre, as are the times he stands rooted to the spot (never a good look for a goalkeeper).

The whole thing on here with him has been so GPG; some refuse to hear a single word of criticism, some have tried so hard to like him, some are now wavering, some have criticised constructively and others less so.

He struggled pre-season and it has been very unconvincing in “regular season” too.

TF in a different club could have been out on his arse after 10 games (4 points gained if I remember correctly) and one of his biggest mistakes early doors was recalling Bentley and sticking with him despite constant errors.

I think we are now at the stage with Flekken where a decision has got to be made. Strakosha has been an enigma to say the least, but he has got to be in contention for a first-team place right now.

 

[badgerbee]

As with Yermoliuk, Mads RR, Damsgaard, Saman, Maupay, Baptiste, Olakigbe, Peart Harris and Onyeka, would undoubtedly be much easier to look "better" with 10 first teamers out there with him..........
Particularly Rico and Hickey.....

 

[Poolieboydave]

Once again, I think Mark has not pulled up any trees, but I also think some comments just beggar belief.

No more needs to be said. He’s neither the messiah nor a naughty boy. He’s just a middling keeper (… for a middling team) and there are far bigger reasons for the current slide in form.

 

[Wilton Bee]

I think his lack of agility is a concern, he doesn’t seem very light on his feet. Any shot low down to either side of him is in the net before he hits the floor.

He did make one great save last night that not many would have seen. It was towards the end when their sub who was roasting all who tried to run against him got clear and he managed to get down to his left and just got his hand to his shot and deflected onto the post! We were right in line in the North stand.

 

[Old B]

Building a habit of chipping the ball over a forward to the left back area and a couple of times when in the goal East stand end they seem to be very close to the forward. Couple of times, W Ham and Wolves have heard audible gasps from the crowd suggesting the passes were closer to the forward than necessary. Hope this doesn’t catch him out in a serious way.

 

[Zeeco]

TBH I find Flekken an ok keeper, no top four team or Real Madrid are gonna come begging for him, he's at a team who's league position reflects his ability, I would like to see Strakosha have a few starts

 

[badgerbee]

His distribution for the crucial third goal was hesitant, which put the defenders under pressure from the high press. (Although Collins’ subsequent decision to chip rather than hit long didn’t help).

And to be fair he actually made a save, though I suspect he was just showing off as we were 4-1 down at the time.

?
Or am I due a

 

[WARFIELD BEE]

He did make one great save last night that not many would have seen. It was towards the end when their sub who was roasting all who tried to run against him got clear and he managed to get down to his left and just got his hand to his shot and deflected onto the post! We were right in line in the North stand.

I wasn't sure if he touched it, the ball didn't seem to change direction, however your eyesight may well be better than mine.

 

[Wilton Bee]

I wasn't sure if he touched it, the ball didn't seem to change direction, however your eyesight may well be better than mine.

I definitely saw a change in direction, not massive but enough, otherwise it would have been another one against the defence as I believe it was Pinnock beaten on this occasion!

 

[SmiffyBee]

I like the way the full backs and Flekken hold the ball at times, until 2 attackers try to rush the Dutch stopper.

Causes mild panic in the stands to the more impatient fans who are, on one hand urging players to move and create space, but on the other mitten, do not realise, when we do this, it leaves Norgaard free to receive the ball in space.

 

[badgerbee]

I like the way the full backs and Flekken hold the ball at times, until 2 attackers try to rush the Dutch stopper.

Causes mild panic in the stands to the more impatient fans who are, on one hand urging players to move and create space, but on the other mitten, do not realise, when we do this, it leaves Norgaard free to receive the ball in space.

Agreed.
And inevitably we WILL come unstuck with this on occasions. As we did with Raya.
But it's how we play, and a big part of how we've managed to be as successful as we have over the last few seasons.
Just look at how going long without the appropriate personnel in place worked out for the 3rd goal on Wednesday......
Some people still can't see this, or understand it though.....

 

[Bridge Bee]

Raya regularly made saves that you maybe didn’t expect him to make. These saves won us points and you end up being 5-6pts better off because of it.

Mark hasn’t made those saves yet. When the oppo get through they tend to score. Maybe it will come. Maybe it won’t.

Raya also never had Janelt and Ghoddos playing in front of him as fall backs. He also had the Pontus Pinnock partnership which was established over a 4yr period. Just saying.

 

[westendbee]

Agreed.
And inevitably we WILL come unstuck with this on occasions. As we did with Raya.
But it's how we play, and a big part of how we've managed to be as successful as we have over the last few seasons.
Just look at how going long without the appropriate personnel in place worked out for the 3rd goal on Wednesday......
Some people still can't see this, or understand it though.....

But we didn’t “go long” for Wolves 3rd goal, it was a chipped ball from Collins which the Wolves player won well inside our half. “Going long” would have been a hard hit ball over the top for Wissa to chase.

 

[badgerbee]

But we didn’t “go long” for Wolves 3rd goal, it was a chipped ball from Collins which the Wolves player won well inside our half. “Going long” would have been a hard hit ball over the top for Wissa to chase.

We didn't "fanny around with it" at the back though.
As 90% of those around me were moaning about when we (allegedly) did.....

 

[TadB]

I gave him a bit of a bashing earlier, it is the ponderous way he passes to defenders and in return they pass back.
I was always taught to move the ball forward, it is for midfield to make themselves available for the pass and then the forwards to do the same.
We were very good at the passing ball in the championship, not sure why that has gone?
Our game seems to be very slow from keeper to midfield and then relies on the breakaway via KLP, Bryan etc.
We don't need a keeper and 3/4 defenders pushing the ball to each other and then wacking it for the chase, bypassing midfield in the process.

What has all this to do with the goal keeper. He passes the ball to a defender what they do with the ball, who they pass it to, or how quick they are has little or nothing to do with him.

 

[westendbee]

We didn't "fanny around with it" at the back though.
As 90% of those around me were moaning about when we (allegedly) did.....

We did, it went hesitantly left from Flekken to a defender under pressure who returned it to Flekken who passed it to Collins who was also under a bit of pressure …

 

[badgerbee]

We did, it went hesitantly left from Flekken to a defender under pressure who returned it to Flekken who passed it to Collins who was also under a bit of pressure …

Should have found someone else available for another short pass, rather than an aimless ball forward that inevitably came back......

 

[westendbee]

Should have found someone else available for another short pass, rather than an aimless ball forward that inevitably came back......

But everyone nearby was closed down because we had faffed about and invited Wolves to press high!

 

[Hippobee]

Should have found someone else available for another short pass, rather than an aimless ball forward that inevitably came back......

But everyone nearby was closed down because we had faffed about and invited Wolves to press high!

The reality here is that we are short on options. Wolves played the press effectively and currently, it seems we don't have the pace or personnel in the team to play through it. Flekken regularly didn't have much of an option in who to pass to - when he did, they were closed down pretty quickly.

As you say, Badgerbee, going long is pointless too, as there is no-one up top capable of holding it up, or winning a header to nod down to someone else. Nor is there someone with electric pace who could run into a space on a long ball in the channels. Going more direct was always a good option last season with Toney and Mbeumo - it's not an option with any of the current front 3.

We just need to move the ball far more quickly than we did the other night, all over the pitch. Easier said than done, I know. As others have said, Flekken has his faults, but I wouldn't blame his distribution or shot stopping on our defeat.

 

[westendbee]

The reality here is that we are short on options. Wolves played the press effectively and currently, it seems we don't have the pace or personnel in the team to play through it. Flekken regularly didn't have much of an option in who to pass to - when he did, they were closed down pretty quickly.

As you say, Badgerbee, going long is pointless too, as there is no-one up top capable of holding it up, or winning a header to nod down to someone else. Nor is there someone with electric pace who could run into a space on a long ball in the channels. Going more direct was always a good option last season with Toney and Mbeumo - it's not an option with any of the current front 3.

We just need to move the ball far more quickly than we did the other night, all over the pitch. Easier said than done, I know. As others have said, Flekken has his faults, but I wouldn't blame his distribution or shot stopping on our defeat.

Except that Flekken’s failure to (attempt to) claim THAT cross set in train the series of unfortunate events…

 

[badgerbee]

Except that Flekken’s failure to (attempt to) claim THAT cross set in train the series of unfortunate events…

?
?

 

[Beecareful]

Leave the bloke alone. You will not get a goal keeper as good as Raya unless we lob out 40/50 million. Just accept that Raya has gone.

£27m actually... not the money that was banded about. and he cost us £3m plus sell on. Check facts?

 

[WARFIELD BEE]

I like the way the full backs and Flekken hold the ball at times, until 2 attackers try to rush the Dutch stopper.

Causes mild panic in the stands to the more impatient fans who are, on one hand urging players to move and create space, but on the other mitten, do not realise, when we do this, it leaves Norgaard free to receive the ball in space.

What causes the panic if you want to call it that is the closeness the passing is to the opposition player very risky and will get caught.

 

[badgerbee]

What causes the panic if you want to call it that is the closeness the passing is to the opposition player very risky and will get caught.

Yep. Undoubtedly.
But also very instrumental in how we make a lot of our chances/score a lot of our goals/make sure the ball doesn't come straight back from an aimless punt/have finished top half in PL for the last 2 seasons...
All about %s
What ya gonna do?? ?‍

 

[Brentford77]

I like the way the full backs and Flekken hold the ball at times, until 2 attackers try to rush the Dutch stopper.

Causes mild panic in the stands to the more impatient fans who are, on one hand urging players to move and create space, but on the other mitten, do not realise, when we do this, it leaves Norgaard free to receive the ball in space.

Agree totally. I completely get how this enhances our play but equally, I expect my death certificate may well end up recording the cause of death as “Flekken taking too long on the ball”!

 

[WARFIELD BEE]

Yep. Undoubtedly.
But also very instrumental in how we make a lot of our chances/score a lot of our goals/make sure the ball doesn't come straight back from an aimless punt/have finished top half in PL for the last 2 seasons...
All about %s
What ya gonna do?? ?‍

Release it a fraction earlier to give yourself a better chance of success.

 

[Bumbling fool]

Must be reasons we're not privvy to that strakosha isn't being trusted. Maybe a part of it is that it's a bigger commitment to bench a keeper than say a midfielder, takes time for a keeper to build trust and gel with his defenders. But if strakosha was the keeper we thought he was when we bought him I'm doubtful we'd have bought flekken at all let alone that he'd last this long on such bad form. Something's got to give eventually, can't have a big 5 league number one on the bench for the statistical worst shot stopper in the league forever.

I'm also hoping that having toney to ping it to will unlock an element of flekken's game we haven't been able to fully appreciate so far, and that'll boost his confidence and the fans get behind him and performances improve in a virtuous cycle. Frankly that's the last hope I have left for him.

 

[jlove]

I never, during the game, had any thoughts - good or bad - about Flekken, he was just a player doing his job. On the other hand, Yarmolyuk, owned by their midfielders, Maupay, with the touch of a chainsaw, Collins, with his extraordinary generosity and reckless positioning, and Janelt, the invisible man, we discussed a lot.

 

[badgerbee]

Release it a fraction earlier to give yourself a better chance of success.

Easier said than done.....??......
Otherwise I'm sure he/we would be doing it....

 

[WARFIELD BEE]

Easier said than done.....??......
Otherwise I'm sure he/we would be doing it....

I think he is trying to drag them in as far as possible, but very risky.

 

[TadB]

£27m actually... not the money that was banded about. and he cost us £3m plus sell on. Check facts?

I said that a replacement will cost us 40/50 million. 30 million was the cost Arsenal paid to ROB us at the end of the window.

 

[aslan]

Yep. Undoubtedly.
But also very instrumental in how we make a lot of our chances/score a lot of our goals/make sure the ball doesn't come straight back from an aimless punt/have finished top half in PL for the last 2 seasons...
All about %s
What ya gonna do?? ?‍

We had a great chance second half from one of these, Flekken turned around and gave a thumbs up to the few of us clapping the well executed pass ?

 

[North London Bee]

We just need him to show some assertion and positivity and dominate his box as he did in German.

I think he just seems to be lacking in confidence which is surprising.

 

[Banana]

Must be reasons we're not privvy to that strakosha isn't being trusted.

Really? ?

 

[westendbee]

Bit concerned that Flekken will now start coming for crosses he has no chance of reaching!

 

[badgerbee]

We just need him to show some assertion and positivity and dominate his box as he did in German.

I think he just seems to be lacking in confidence which is surprising.

"Mein!!" you mean......??......
?

 

[TadB]

Must be reasons we're not privvy to that strakosha isn't being trusted. Maybe a part of it is that it's a bigger commitment to bench a keeper than say a midfielder, takes time for a keeper to build trust and gel with his defenders. But if strakosha was the keeper we thought he was when we bought him I'm doubtful we'd have bought flekken at all let alone that he'd last this long on such bad form. Something's got to give eventually, can't have a big 5 league number one on the bench for the statistical worst shot stopper in the league forever.

I'm also hoping that having toney to ping it to will unlock an element of flekken's game we haven't been able to fully appreciate so far, and that'll boost his confidence and the fans get behind him and performances improve in a virtuous cycle. Frankly that's the last hope I have left for him.

Maybe in managements opinion Flekken is the better keeper of the two!

 

[Lush55]

What has all this to do with the goal keeper. He passes the ball to a defender what they do with the ball, who they pass it to, or how quick they are has little or nothing to do with him.

I mentioned the keepers ponderous way of distribution in response to those saying he cant lump it upfield as there are no receivers.
If he was quicker in passing out, defenders/midfield would be able to move ball quicker, instead of opposition pushing up or marking.
All to do with the keeper.

 

[LingfieldBee]

Unfortunately you can't help some clueless fans. I had people around me moaning he was passing short all the time and then when he did go long and our 5ft front line didn't win the header they grumbled then ?? honestly couldn't make this garbage up by some of them.

 

[LingfieldBee]

I mentioned the keepers ponderous way of distribution in response to those saying he cant lump it upfield as there are no receivers.
If he was quicker in passing out, defenders/midfield would be able to move ball quicker, instead of opposition pushing up or marking.
All to do with the keeper.

Unfortunately the midfield middle three barely moved for him last game. He was given very little out ball. That's not on him.

 

[grepo]

He did keep the most clean sheets in the Bundesliga, last season, but at the moment we don't look anywhere near not conceding a goal.

We won't concede today and Collins will score.

 

[grepo]

His name is an anagram of "oh outroar w*nk" so it's a no from me.

Is that what he was doing when he conceded that goal for Freiburg when he was stood in the back of his goal?

 

[jlove]

We won't concede today and Collins will score.

We’ll get a penalty, the players will drag Mark forward to take it, top bin flyer… cue wild celebrations then pages of complaints that he should’ve hit it lower…

 

[TadB]

I mentioned the keepers ponderous way of distribution in response to those saying he cant lump it upfield as there are no receivers.
If he was quicker in passing out, defenders/midfield would be able to move ball quicker, instead of opposition pushing up or marking.
All to do with the keeper.

Your opinion! Not mine.

 

[TadB]

I gave him a bit of a bashing earlier, it is the ponderous way he passes to defenders and in return they pass back.
I was always taught to move the ball forward, it is for midfield to make themselves available for the pass and then the forwards to do the same.
We were very good at the passing ball in the championship, not sure why that has gone?
Our game seems to be very slow from keeper to midfield and then relies on the breakaway via KLP, Bryan etc.
We don't need a keeper and 3/4 defenders pushing the ball to each other and then wacking it for the chase, bypassing midfield in the process.

We were very good in the Championship but not now? Perhaps that may have something to do with a slight increase in the standard of opposition in the Premier League.